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Who to believe about the aliens?

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posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 11:04 AM
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The mysteries are frustrating for everyone interested-- believers, nonbelievers, investigators, personal experiencers, witnesses, scientists, military, government, etc. But it's also very exciting and fortunate that we get to be here at this monumental point in human evolution. Many people, like myself, have personal "proof" of alien life already and that number is growing. Eventually it will be safe enough for the aliens to show up for all to see.

"Safe" means that enough people in enough places in society and politics will be personally knowledgeable enough to be able to help our world handle the ensuing eruption and scrambling of ideas. Nothing will "collapse" except our stupid belief systems about the aliens. This happens at every new world. How do you think the other races all got to know each other?

I want to encourage everyone to keep your eyes open and think straight. Do not confuse the aliens with the confusion. What I mean by that is what humans are doing is all about the humans. It is what they do whenever confronted with things they do not know the nature of. It's only human nature to dogmatize and demonize and sensationalize every mystery.

The aliens are not a mystery. They are exactly what and who they are, and hardly any humans on Planet Earth can distinguish among of all the gossip they hear, what is real from what is not about them yet.

Don't worry, everyone is going to know they are here. Then the only problem left will still be who should everyone believe "about" them? But that is the real problem, isn't it?

The question is: Of all things you now and will hear, what kind of ideas or people or professionals or countries or leaders or books or movies would you believe "about the aliens" when the proof of visitation finally came out (broadcast live on CNN) and why would you believe them?

PLEASE NOTE: If you have no interest or are unwilling to consider the reality of alien life even hypothetically, please post in the "there are no aliens and you are a psycho liar" threads. In this thread, let's hear what people seriously think about the aliens and how the subject is affecting our world.




posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 11:49 AM
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the "there are no aliens and you are a psycho liar" threads



Hi EarthSister. I'm glad you finally created your own thread!


Since 'discovering' ATS, I have learned never to completely believe anything but never to completely dismiss it either. IOW, I'm kinda 50/50 on the whole alien issue, though I have come across some interesting arguments for both sides (ie: exist or not). I find your case particularly interesing as it is clearly(from my point of view) a case or "either/or". That is: either you are lying and hoaxing and aliens don't exist (or at least not as you describe) OR you are truthful and therefore absolutley certain that aliens DO exist. BTW, I am not accusing you of hoaxery, just saying that its a possibility from my perspective.

Right now, I doubt I'd believe anyone simply because there is so much 'junk' information out there. Probably about 1% of all available material on aliens in true. It's just a case of finding out which 1% is true...

All information I gather is potentially that 1%, so all information is valuable, so far.




posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 01:12 PM
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Ok .. darn prepare for longwindedness....

In this universe I believe other intelligent life exists.

Are they here...?
I have my own abduction experiances.. and if I believe them, then I'd have to say they are.

Science proposes that they couldn't make it here, just like we can't make it there.. although I'm tempted to agree.. certain new theories and research might suggest otherwise.... science is great as it's self correcting


Although I'm still teetering on the issue.. for arguements sake, I'll say.. Yes they are here.

What the heck are they doing here....

Experiments...

Observation...

Are they truely waiting for enough people to "believe" before they park on the white house lawn? I could swear I saw a poll in a respected US magazine, some years back, that polled its readers and came to the conclusion that over 50 or 60 percent believed other life existed. I'm betting it was either Time or Newsweek...

Are they poised to attack? Well some would say.. Well no they could that now if they wanted, but we are still here.

I would disagree.. I do not believe or not believe the aliens might become hostile... I just don't think the fact that they haven't become hostile yet.. doesn't mean they won't.

It could be possible they are waiting for us to discover a key technology and observe how we handle it... then deciding if we might be dangerous.

Are we aggressive towards them and why...
I saw a film on "Sightings" it was filmed in space and pictured a saucer like craft approaching the earth. Then this thing..projectile..laser..?? Shot right up out of the earth with clear intent to hit the saucer. The saucer made a spectacular getaway....

This makes me wonder... any nation with the tech to shoot something in space, with that reaction time and accuracy.. would definetly be a civilized one.

So why did we fire at it..

A.) We don't know what they are up to and we just want to make it clear that you don't visit without signing the guestbook.

B.) They know what they are up to and it's not good.

My reaction to their "outing" will be a welcome one if they present themselves peacefully.. I would however keep a cautious eye on them.

If they become hostile.. and all I'm left with is a spork from the last time I went to KFC.. then I will take that spork up against them to defend humanity. Sure it's flimsy and plastic but those Greys don't look to sturdy to me.

My mood might also be swayed by some theories.... descriptions of aliens who have abused human captives.. if they turn up as the spitting image of those decribed I'd be alot more nervous, even if they did present themselves peacefully.
--------------------------
Seti @ home is a good idea, it's my screensaver..what can I say.. I'm a pushover... but why in the world are we listening for radio signals? Any intelligent being worth his salt would be transmitting by light signals!!! For all we know they are transmitting their butts off trying to get our attention.. while we site here listening to white noise with HUGE radio dishes. Arg!!!



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 02:33 PM
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The first thing would be if this day ever came, the aliens would have to allow some of us access to interstellar travel without their interferance so that we could travel the stars and verify what they have said. We would in essence have to do our "UN\Iraqi style weapons inspection" where we would have unlimited access to any planet or species that the aliens have or may have had dealings with. We would have to "inspect" and question witnesses to verify the aliens story. IF this doesn't happen then their will always be a possiblilty of a hidden agenda.

PRIOR TO THE ALIENS REVELATION:
I think your trustworthy info is going to come and has been coming from ex-government and military officials. Anyone can lie so you would have to find other sources that confirm statements made by these people. You could trust those in power now, but we all know they will deny and lie to complete a project or agenda....as could ex-govt and military people, yet hopefully their ties have been broken enough with their past so as to feel they can tell the true story.

I also think independent sources like NIDS and MUFON and their similar cousins in other countries are important places to find truth.

NOW....
Say the aliens reveal themselves tomorrow (either by accident or intentionaly). Who do you find truth from now? Unfortunately you will have no one to verify what the aliens tell you. It will be like going into a relationship with a new love...they may tell you what you want to hear, but meanwhile they're out sleeping with someone else. Actions speak louder than words (even telepathic words) so their actions will have to be monitored by the scientific community and our relationship with them is going to have to go very very slow. If the aliens reveal themselves in a panic and say "yikes you humans are going to blow the world up within a week if you don't do as we say!"....then we've got a problem in that the crisis could be manufactured so that we accept them quicker and not analyze their actions.

Personally the group of people that I find the most trustworthy and logical is the Buddhist community. I don't agree with their non-violent behavior to aggressors (if you don't fight back then you will be enslaved), but if the aliens came down and revealed their relationship with us is going to be....then I would listen to how the Buddhist community see these aliens statements as being words of truth or words of deception.

As far as media that I would trust. Well that really wouldn't matter much since I have no idea how they could verify anything an alien said but just for kicks:

TV: BBC

Movies: Dreamworks

Books: Anything that had the backing of a well respected university as a publisher

Magazines: Entertainment Weelky (ha....they suck, probably any hard news/scientific journal)

Leaders: Colllin Powell, Dali Lama, and anyone that had a limited political but more scientific or spiritual reputation as a deep thinker.

Countries: None! If the aliens end up showing favoritism towards one country too much...now you've got problems. Look how people kind of distrust the US because they think they are in league with them. The aliens will have to deal with the UN which is both good and bad, but really the only choice.



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 02:36 PM
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My my perspective:

It is inconceivable that other intelligent life does not exist in the universe, or in other universes for that matter. This life, if ever discovered, will be so radically different from ours we will probably be unable to comprehend it. No stargate/star trek crap with aliens speaking english. I find it hard to believe in the greys and nordics and reptilians, as they are just too much like life as we know it, and too easily created by the human imagination (not attempting too say all abductions are peoples imaginations, as for the abductee they can be very real). The only way i can see these beings being real is with the 'earth seeding theory', and that the greys and nordics were also seeded by the same thing, the greys and the nordics different appearance being adaption to the different environments in which they live.



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 02:52 PM
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I of course am a big believer in aliens, I think most of us are or we wouldn't hang out here.

It all boils down to proof. If I tell you I am the King of Denmark it's just a statement. If I invite you to the palace and everybody is running around calling me "your Highness" or you see my face on a stamp with the letters HRHSPIDERJ on it, that's pretty good proof that I am the king.

I'm not of course, it's just an example.

I've been researching this stuff for the past 18 years or so and still haven't come across any real proof I've found a lot of people who claim to have proof, but they wind up just being statements.

So Yes I believe, I just don't believe anyone has real proof. And the more steadfast you hold to your personal belief system and the more time you invest in that same belief system the less open minded you become.

I've seen it happen time and again, from Richard Hoagland to MUFON.




That is: either you are lying and hoaxing and aliens don't exist (or at least not as you describe) OR you are truthful and therefore absolutley certain that aliens DO exist. BTW, I am not accusing you of hoaxery, just saying that its a possibility from my perspective.


There is also the third option which is that Earthsister is mentally unbalanced and yet completely sincere. There is also a fourth option, which is that Earthsister herself is doing this for reasons that neither involve money, fame nor the need to be worshipped, but something entirely different, what that could be I don't know.

That's my opinion.

SpiderJ



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 03:26 PM
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SpiderJ: Thanks. My point was that EarthSister's POV is 'Aliens exist' rather than 'I *believe* aliens exist and here's the "proof"... In ES's case, she is either right or wrong (aliens-exist v they-don't), whereas others are either right, wrong, or kinda half-right (aliens-exist v they-don't v this-photo's-too-blurry-to-tell)

I'm a little tired so i dunno if i'm makin sense, sorry



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 03:38 PM
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SpiderJ: Thanks. My point was that EarthSister's POV is 'Aliens exist' rather than 'I *believe* aliens exist and here's the "proof"... In ES's case, she is either right or wrong (aliens-exist v they-don't), whereas others are either right, wrong, or kinda half-right (aliens-exist v they-don't v this-photo's-too-blurry-to-tell)


thanks for clearing up your point, and I see we're you're going. ES tends to come from a point of view that she is the only one with real information. She is steadfast in her belief that anyone who contradicts her or states their own experience as real, she is very dissmissive of them. Hopefully she will be more open minded of other peoples experiences.

Just do a search of her other posts and you'll see.

I don't doubt her sincerity, I doubt her inablity to admit she may be wrong.

MHO

SPIDERJ



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 04:31 PM
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IMHO. I read through whats being said then I either believe it or I dont. I had a look at ES's site and in this case I dont [but thats just me no offence Earthsister]. Of course I could be wrong. The reason I believe in UFO's and aliens is because of the large amount of literal and photographic documentation. But there are some people who when you read there statements seem more plausible then others. The problem really is like spiderj said, proof. There is a real lack of evidence. Even with my own spiritual experiences there is no proof although I know it happened. Hell on one of my experiences I even got the photograph to prove it, but still no one wanted to believe. Instead it was just put down to being a case of me seeing what I wanted to believe.



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 04:36 PM
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Of course I could be wrong. The reason I believe in UFO's and aliens is because of the large amount of literal and photographic documentation.


For me, my belief is just based on the simple concept of space. There's a lot out there and I can't accept that we're the only living things in the entire galaxy, universe, multi-verse or multi-plex (which ever defintion suits you.)

And if you still have that pic, please post it. Not saying I'll believe but would love to take a gander.

SPiderj-verse



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 05:12 PM
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I'd like to be prepared for everything. I have not yet seen any convincable evidence that there are someone else out there. We may be all alone. We may not. I think that there is a greater chance that we are not alone, but I'm keeping in mind the possibility of us actually being alone.

Now, have the aliens been here? I think that is possible. Why haven't they made contact? That is the one big question everyone is asking, isn't it?

Maybe they are all capitalists? Universal corporations, making profit in every possible way? If so, the theory about them giving the government technology in return for abducting people could very well be true. I don't think a scientific alien race would do this - they would probably already know what we do with new tech.

They could also be evil. If they have been with us since long ago, then if they made contact 100-200 years ago, people would have accepted it. If they would make a sudden contact tomorrow, we would panic.

Anyways, for me, they are just that - alien. I'm into finding out their motives first before making any further "contact", would they land tomorrow. And if I am taken against my will, well, I guess I stand no chance against beings who can make a trip to our planet with ships smaller than a commercial airliner...



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 05:19 PM
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spiderj,No I meant some of the UFO pictures that are widely available through the Internet. Oh sorry you meant MY picture, the face of god in the river and the face of torment. Ok.





I saw God's face in the river and got the picture to prove it.

You can read the thread on the link below if you like. [Or maybe not].

www.abovetopsecret.com...

"There's a lot out there and I can't accept that we're the only living things in the entire galaxy, universe, multi-verse or multi-plex (which ever defintion suits you.)"

I also I believe this.



[edit on 19-7-2004 by kode]



posted on Jun, 27 2004 @ 08:36 PM
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Of all things you now and will hear, what kind of ideas or people or professionals or countries or leaders or books or movies would you believe "about the aliens" when the proof of visitation finally came out (broadcast live on CNN) and why would you believe them?


Excellent question!


I'm not sure who I'd believe to be honest... There are no "professionals" in this field (at least not ones I'd acknowledge as such), so thats out. Countries have been lying about their involvement for years, so they're out too...same with leaders. As for books, I suppose it would be the authors who seemed to hit closest to the mark, when they finally show themselves. If the aliens come down and look like "greys" and say they are from Zeti Reticulum 4 (as we call it), then I'd be more apt to believe those authors who said this before the aliens did....same with movies.

Most of all, I'd base my beliefs of their intentions on their actions, and my general "feel" when listening to them. So far, they are covertly abducting our citizens, and covertly (or with corrupt cooperation) intruding on our territory, so so far, I'm not too convinced they're friendly. Doesn't mean they are hostile or planning an invasion either, but their intent doesn't seem benign....



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 12:36 AM
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Al Vereco
UnusualMe
Boogie
minimi
Spiderj
kode
RX84
Gazrok

Some of you said things I have never thought of, and all of your considerate remarks help explain a lot about where we are at as a race. Thank you, good job.

Newcomers: Jump in! We want to hear your ideas. Please first read the NOTE in the opening post.

I think it's fair to say that most of you would agree that if the "great debut" happened tomorrow, it wouldn't really solve much of the general, current confusion. Long, lingering questions still far surpass what any sighting, however encompassing, can answer, and the event would surely spawn more impossible questions.

If that is fair to say, then do you think most people on Earth feel this way, or are we ahead of most others or behind? Who are we ahead and who are we behind?

How long do you think it could be until we are teaching about advanced life forms through schools, and in which years and classes would "Alien Life 101" be appropriate as a subject?

[edit on 28-6-2004 by EarthSister]



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 02:47 AM
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I think it's fair to say that most of you would agree that if the "great debut" happened tomorrow, it wouldn't really solve much of the general, current confusion.


I'm sorry but I have to disagree. I believe, especially considering what's going on around the world that if the great debut happened tomorrow it would have an amazing affect.

At the very least it would stun people into thinking. We live in a world on the brink of disaster. An alien arrival, would have an immense impact and almost immediately and I believe it would be positive, for the most part.

SPiderj



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 07:37 AM
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kobe: No offense, but I think this is more a case of your mind making "sense" of random ripples of water. In your pic of "God", I'm not sure what you see as God but you can make out the face of Gimli from Lord of the Rings if you look hard enough. It's like them 'blot tests'; your mind makes it mean something.

SpiderJ & EarthSister: True, the Great Debut could stun people into thinking. But - depending on the manner of the Debut - there could be confusion, panic, riots... And that's even before people turn to the governments and the governments are forced to admit that they've known about aliens for decades (if that is the case). Eventually, governments could be overthrown, aliens could be attacked, and humanity is thrown headlong into an intergalactic war
I think, though, that (assuming aliens exist) they would be VERY careful in the planning of the Debut so as to cause as little uproar as possible. But at least a little uproar is inevitable, IMO.

I think it depends on the nature of the individual persons. Intelligent, open-minded people would welcome aliens with open arms, though warily. Whereas ignorant close-minded people would attack on sight, even gleefully... Unfortunately, IMO most people are of the latter category



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 07:57 AM
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Originally posted by Gazrok
...If the aliens come down and look like "greys" and say they are from Zeti Reticulum 4 (as we call it), then I'd be more apt to believe those authors who said this before the aliens did....same with movies.

...So far, they are covertly abducting our citizens, and covertly (or with corrupt cooperation) intruding on our territory, so so far, I'm not too convinced they're friendly. Doesn't mean they are hostile or planning an invasion either, but their intent doesn't seem benign....


I agree that an invasion is not in the works. Besides, if you believe people like Sgt. Clifford Stone, they already have various underground and/or underwater bases around the world.

I also agree that they are not benign.

However, isn't their home base the Zeta 2 Reticuli System and not Zeta Reticulum 4?

Perhaps you just mean Zeta IV (AKA Zeta Prime) in the Zeta 2 Reticuli System, which would make sense.




[edit on 28-6-2004 by Paul_Richard]



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 02:05 PM
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I think, though, that (assuming aliens exist) they would be VERY careful in the planning of the Debut so as to cause as little uproar as possible. But at least a little uproar is inevitable, IMO.


This is pretty much what I assume as well. Let's not get into that whole thing about making asses out of u and me...yeesh


I really do believe they would plan it out to make it as low key as possible well as low key as a hundred spaceships floating over your local mall can be.

This works if their intentions are both positive or negative. Also, why does everyone assume that when the aliens land mass panic is going to ensue. I understand that some would instinctively be fearful, but assuming the aliens are real they certainly have the technology to zap the globe with zanex and mellow everyone out.

Think about it, any abductee will tell you they can't move, they can't do anything. The little buggers can control your mind. I would think a big ass mother ship along with a fleet of other craft could mellow the planet out before anybody can grab their glock.

SPiderj



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 02:42 PM
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Originally posted by Spiderj



I think, though, that (assuming aliens exist) they would be VERY careful in the planning of the Debut so as to cause as little uproar as possible. But at least a little uproar is inevitable, IMO.


This is pretty much what I assume as well. Let's not get into that whole thing about making asses out of u and me...yeesh


I really do believe they would plan it out to make it as low key as possible well as low key as a hundred spaceships floating over your local mall can be.

This works if their intentions are both positive or negative. Also, why does everyone assume that when the aliens land mass panic is going to ensue. I understand that some would instinctively be fearful, but assuming the aliens are real they certainly have the technology to zap the globe with zanex and mellow everyone out.

Think about it, any abductee will tell you they can't move, they can't do anything. The little buggers can control your mind. I would think a big ass mother ship along with a fleet of other craft could mellow the planet out before anybody can grab their glock.

SPiderj


I'm sure Aliens that swooped down over american cities hoping for a peaceful first contact would not start out their intro by zapping us with mass paraylisis or mind altering waves.

As far as people "panicing" .. any remember WAR OF THE WORLDS and the Orsen Wells radio fiasco? history1900s.about.com...

How the present themselves, I would assume they know, will have a lasting impact on popular opinion concerning them.

They can go the safe route.. finding some private method of communication and contacting each government and letting them do the introductions.

OR they can come in droves..flying over the capitol of each nation while blinking that nations flag colors and playing their national anthem.

Of course that's assuming they know much about us at all. We all assume they've been listening in on radio, TV etc... What if that isn't the case? A planet with a different atmoshere might not be well suited to radio transmission.. maybe they use light waves or even some other method we haven't considered.. they could very well be driving nearly blind in what to do.

In my abduction experiance they seemed to know english... and had a desire to introduce and test my knowledge of certain things. THey did the same to my grandfather. I've heard similiar stories, of people being intoduced to new tech or quizzed on certain things.. one involved them having pointing to our solar system on a map.. they are pretty sure they failed.

Why would they do this if they had access to our information highways.. either they don't or they wish to test the mettle of the common "man"



posted on Jun, 28 2004 @ 04:08 PM
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I'm sure Aliens that swooped down over american cities hoping for a peaceful first contact would not start out their intro by zapping us with mass paraylisis or mind altering waves.


I didn't mean to imply that they would, just that they could.

As far as the War of The Worlds incident goes I think we're at a different place as a society than we were then.

IMO of course.

Spiderj



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