Sick Of Paying Your Mortgage? You May Not Have To Pay!

reply to post by Phage


More power to you I got a 30 yr fixed in 05 on a house that was less than I can afford. Yes there is a legal obligation (not quite sure I'd call it a moral one, ask the Mortgage Bankers Assosiation about strategic default and their headquaters building) to pay or suffer the consequences (forclosure), but I'm not going to begrudge somone who gets out of that legal obligation because the other party screwed up thier part on the enforcability of it. I doubt anyone who gets their foreclosure thrown out at court is going to have a sellable title for a long time (at least long enough to "quiet title"). If nothing else I'm sure the IRS is going to tax them on their gain like they do on shortsales.

I've never said people should be protected from their own stupidity but neither should the TBTF banks. The system has worked for over 200 years without to much help. 10 Years of MERS and people like me wonder why in the hell I did things as right as I could when yes, a few people are living (for a while at least) rent and mortgage free and the institutions that screwed it up enough to let that happen are paying record compensation.

Originally posted by In nothing we trust
OK let's say you pay your mortgage off and the mortgage bank sends you a piece of paper that says it's payed off.

If they can't produce the original loan documents how can they send you a piece of paper stating that the contract is payed off when they can't produce it?

Which calls your payed off mortgage into question.

edit on 12-10-2010 by In nothing we trust because: (no reason given)

You know that puts an interesting angle on this argument and on the OP's original topic.

If the note is unclear and the trust is clouded, why is the borrower paying that money to that trust? Can't a borrower claim that his monthly bill has been going to an entity that has no right to collect on the money? Can't a borrower sue and claim that it is a form of stealing?

If there is confusion on whether or not the mortgage is paid off, why can't there be a question on whether or not mortgage payments actually went to satisfying that actual mortgage? If there are questions on who actually has the right to foreclose on a home, shouldn't there be a question on who the payments are going to, and if those payments are actually servicing the loan?

For the OP, instead of demanding to see the actual note, how about demanding the bank prove that it is the trust that should be receiving the monthly mortgage payments. If they can't that means they are STEALING your money if they can't prove who they are in this whole mess. Then get a good lawyer and demand your money back.

Originally posted by In nothing we trust

Originally posted by Pauligirl

In most states the cancellation or certificate of satisfaction signed the lien holder is recorded in the same county register of deeds as the mortgage/deed of trust. It will be found when a search is done when you sell the house.

If the bank sends a letter directly to you when you pay off, read it. Carefully. It may contain a document that YOU need to record.

Oh that's nice.

So if I don't send a copy of my payed off mortgage to the country there is no record that my mortgage was payed off, because the bank isn't obligated to do that or can't be bothered with it or they have future malicious intent towards me..

edit on 13-10-2010 by In nothing we trust because: (no reason given)

In my state about 95% of the time it's sent directly to the register by the lender. I guess it all depends on who your lender is.

reply to post by Chinesis

Repeat after me: "I am free."

I assure you....I am more free than you are.

Because I live in reality...not fantasy land where I think I know how things work...but then cry when things aren't "fair".

I play within the system...and will be better off than you doing this than you are talking about your fake "laws" and whatever other nonsense you talk about.

You are not free...you are a slave to your warped view of reality.

reply to post by Chinesis

Property taxes are illegal. Fact.
As for the car...there is no legal requirement to register the car/truck.

We all have a right to travel.
WE only have a privilege to drive IF we drive.

I don't drive, I travel.
Do you?

Oh...you are one of "those".

Have fun in jail...you can cry and whine how it is "illegal" while in jail.

As I have said to others of your kind...you can have the right to travel...but stay the hell off of OUR roads.

Just because you might be able to do it, doesn’t mean you should. It’s steeling and that’s wrong.

reply to post by 1984 is now


and what are the banks doing? the banks are stealing from you the leagal way. charge you interest rates up the roof bc they can fees for this fees for that bla bla bla.

sure the consumer is loaning money but be abit more fair about it.

I would strongly advise anyone who is considering this shameful path to understand that the OP has made a lot of declarations that are speculative at best about what may happen if a person attempts to refuse to pay his mortage payments. If you would take the advise of an unknown poster on the internet as legal proof of anything, you are a fool, IMO.

How many have been successful in avoiding mortgage payments using this stratagy? Where are the lists of those who have tried to avoid their contratual obligations and won? Finally, what type of person are you if you try to beat the obligations that you promsed to fulfill?

Sure the mega corporate banks are scum-bags in some cases. But, does this give you the right to cheat and steal? How will your children, spouse or friends view auch deceit on your part? Honor is something you should strive for. At the end of the day you can sleep comfortably knowing you did what was right, regardless of what others have done.

Do the RIGHT THING!

......

Originally posted by mnemeth1

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
I have heard of this. I am going to be looking into this closely int he next few months, and thank you for the link to the webpage, Bank of America happens to be the mortgage holder in the situation I am thinking about. I wonder if they will be able to find the note?

Here's the deal.

If you have enough money saved to afford a down-payment on a new home or to front for rent on a new apartment, I don't see any reason why you shouldn't simply stop paying if they can't produce the note.

It may take years before this is resolved.

As long as you keep making your property tax payments, I don't think there's anything they can do to you.

Just make sure you have enough cash to create a backup plan if they suddenly produce the note and begin foreclosure proceedings. At worst, you'll get kicked out of your current home and have to find somewhere else to live. - which is peanuts for getting to live rent free for several years.

edit on 12-10-2010 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)

haha! good point!
5 years of no mortgage payments is a lot of money saved to go buy something else in cash.
Screw these banks and screw this fraud based system of worthless paper.

They screwed everyone...screw them back!

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


It's ok for us to pay our mortgages , for houses we cant afford because we are kept in debt by paying taxes for debt that doesnt belong to us !

yeh sure

the government arent here to make money of us , they are here to protect our rights !

'Be the change you wish to see in the world"

Just because the banks/government is being irresponsible is no reason for the rest of us to follow along. You made a deal to buy a house, hold up your end of the bargain. This sort of behavior is exactly the root cause, it doesn't matter if you are the fat cat banker or the lowly homeowner - cheating is cheating.

I have never claimed to be the sharpest knife in the drawer, and now I am beginning to wonder what has happened to honor in this country.

It is easy to see that many of the mortages held by the banks have problems, but this problem should be left with the banks. I would, however, like to know if two or more have ever been in more than one of these mortage bundles which have sold to investers. This, I would think, would constitute fraud and could get someone in a lot of trouble.

If you decide to stop paying a debt which you ask to for, I don't see how you can expect to keep the collateral which you put up to quaify for the loan.

I am not sure if others are aware of this or not but recently there was an invention introduced to the business community. It is called the computer. Within it's programming and circuits is the capability to render exact copies of whatever documents are put into them. These copies are concidered the have the same validity as the original documents in many court cases. These copies can easily be printed out with such clarity that they can be read by judges as well as lawyers.

One other point I feel I should make is that of the mortage being recorded in the local courthouse. If I were to even think of trying to get out of paying for my mortage, the first thing I would do is go the county courthouse and be certain it had been recorded. This document can carry as much weight as those from the bank itself.

Like I said, I don't claim to be real smart but I know I can't fight the courts with their own documentation.

Originally posted by sapien82

the government arent here to make money of us , they are here to protect our rights !

THe object of the government is to make money off it's citizens.

chinkinthearmor.net...

This is a really important site to read on how to properly handle finding out if they have the note and how to protect yourself while doing it.

Originally posted by In nothing we trust

Originally posted by sapien82

the government arent here to make money of us , they are here to protect our rights !

THe object of the government is to make money off it's citizens.

Yes thats whats become of the government ! However the real reason governments are instituted amongst men and women is to protect and maintain individual rights , not to bleed us dry of our own hard earned cash.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher

Because once they find the original note...you will be defaulted...and trust me...they WILL find the note. They may not have it on hand to show you right away...but please please please don't think that means you don't have to pay your mortgage.

It is worse than that. Check out the following BEFORE you do something stupid and play into the hands of greedy bankers.

If you want a short and sweet explanation of WHY the banks WANT to foreclose on you see: CORPORATE AMERICA'S BLAME GAME

A good analysis of exactly what the "foreclosure insurance" SCAM is.
A more technical analysis naming names is HERE

More very good information is at Introduction to the Mortgage Servicing Fraud Scam.

Be aware legislation to close this loophole is pending!!

The Big Takeover: How Wall Street Insiders are Using the Bailout to Stage a Revolution

Originally posted by 1984 is now
Just because you might be able to do it, doesn’t mean you should. It’s steeling and that’s wrong.

The banks stole 23.7 trillion from you.

You should take your money back.

reply to post by wutone

I essentially made that point about 4 pages back. This is a legal issue, first and foremost.
The way it should work, is that the original deed and title is filed with the county. The mortgage holder gets a copy, the lender gets a copy, and the original is held by the county. If this were the case, it would be relatively easy to verify the lien holder, no problem.
When the note is sold, the original title would have to be amended as to the new lien holder. This is what should be sought, a certified copy of the original deed showing the lien holder as agreeing with the party being paid.
At least, that is how I see it, and how I am personally going to proceed.

I'm done trying to talk sense.

If you guys think you have found some golden loophole...go ahead and proceed.

When you lose your house...please come back to this thread to admit you were wrong.

DO NOT STOP PAYNG YOUR MORTAGE unless you cant find the money and you will be evicted anyway.

My aunt decided to something similar with her home, She bought her house before all this economy crisis affected the real state and she put a good downpayment $80,000. and the house price was around $330,000

When the real state went down in this past 2 years, she decided not pay her mortage because the bank didnt lower her mortage payment, reason was they could not find the note, she tought it was unfair to her to pay that much when her house value dropped to $190,000, she decided to stop paying and next day went and bought a 2009 Volvo to have a good car before her credit goes to hell, she got the car and lived RENT FREE for about 7 months. She had good credit and high limit credit cards before all this happened, but she wanted to be smarter than the bank.

What happened to her?

1) her credit was affected by the non-payment of the mortage
2) her credit cards limits were lowered instantly to almost nothing, she had a $10,000 VISA with around $126 charged on it, they lowered the limit to $200, so she could not use it and the other credit cards did similar things or were closed.

3) THE BANK FOUND THE NOTE, she was contacted by the bank with an option for her because they knew she was working, they didnt lower her mortage, they only told her the 7 months she didnt pay had to be added at the end of the loan term, and she had to start paying her house again or be evicted.

4) She started to pay the house again but couldnt afford to pay the 2009 Volvo, the car was reposesed 2 months later.

5) She had some of the credit cards with high limits almost full, she stopped paying them and now the credit card banks are taking payments from her PAYCHECK.

6) Last month she got a promotion but the more she makes the more she has to pay to those credit card banks to repay what she owes.

DON'T STOP PAYING YOUR MORTAGE unless you have no other option because of unemployment etc.