How can I get my brother to quit being a bum?

Hello everyone. Today I would like to talk about my family issues. Normally I wouldn't put my bothers problems out for everyone to see but seeing as there has been no solution found I guess this is the only way. My little brother was kicked out of the Navy early this year for drugs and other felonies. Ever since then he has stayed at home living the bum life. Not working and just getting drunk when he can afford to and can't seem to keep a job because he says its too tough. He was fortunate enough to get a job as a steel worker once but he only lasted for one day and quit because he said its too dangerous and his supervisor got second-degree burns on his first day there. It seems like he hardly leaves home and only goes out on the weekends and borrows money from me and my older brother but ive had enough of paying for his blunders. I have let him borrow more then $1000 already just so he won't go into debt but since I am out of a job since last month and letting my older brother borrow money from me for a car I just can't do it anymore. My parents seem to be spineless in motivating him to find a job and he just plays starcraft 2 most of the day now.

If your family had the same issues as above then how would you solve them? I will accept any replies good or bad a long as there is some wisdom in it so help a brother out yall.

I so hear you. Know that you are not alone in this. Many families are dealing with just the same situation including my own. I actually have two siblings that conduct themselves in the manner in which you describe. It is so disheartening..I love them and want to see them do well and I can see that you wish the same for your brother. My dad has a brain injury for almost twenty years and has been in a nursing home since they were seven and nine years old. My mother could also be classified as a invertebrate. To this day she continues to enable them and it drives me insane. The money they have cost her is astounding and they have whittled away her next egg almost to non-existince. Eventually she will have to come live with me and then their jig is up. I am not an enabler and see very clearly that the so called "help" she gives them financially is really not helpful at all.

So what do I do? After months of therapy exploring this issue the answer is really very simple. Detachment. I will only support them in life enforcing activities. I will be a great listener..give them a ride if they need it and it is convenient for me...but no money..not ever. Maybe a little for their birthdays. They have my love at all times. But for your own sake you must learn to detach from his...and your parents behaviour. He came here to learn in a different way then you did and you must not interfere with his choices. You cannot control him. You cannot make him the person you think he can be. When you think of him...imagine him doing well...picture him healthy and being purposeful every day. Visualization can be powerful and if there is ever a moment in his life when he feels he might want to make a change..all that good energy will flood into him. And if he doesn't want to change, you must learn to accept this. Detachment does not mean you don't care. Detach and love.

I often see life as akin to rock climbing. We can look across and see where people in our lives might be heading and we want to call across and say "Hey don't go that way." But really, there is nothing more we can do because we are climbing too and we cannot jeapordize our own path. The best gift you can give your brother is the best version of yourself. Model the behaviour you want to see in others.

Good luck to you!

Being in a slightly similar situation to your brother I can honestly say you guys will not be able to make his life any better. The bottom line is it's his decision. He has to be able to find what motivates him. Everybody reaches a point in their life where your choices are to sink or to swim. Personally I chose to swim and am currently busting my ass to reach my goals. I guess you could say motivation is key.

Originally posted by Mandog
He came here to learn in a different way then you did and you must not interfere with his choices. You cannot control him. You cannot make him the person you think he can be.

This you do for him. Because you love him, you must not try to control him.

When you think of him...imagine him doing well...picture him healthy and being purposeful every day. Visualization can be powerful and if there is ever a moment in his life when he feels he might want to make a change..all that good energy will flood into him. And if he doesn't want to change, you must learn to accept this.

This you do for him AND you.

Think of choices as expressions of the individual. Even though you think some choices are "bad", they are still that individual's expression of who they are at the moment. Because we love people, we must accept their choices, "good" and "bad". We should give them all of the information and tools to make what we see as the "right" choice, but if they still make a different choice than the choice we would make, then we must accept that. Acceptance is not condoning or enabling. Your parents' choices are the same way.

I believe these problems are rooted very deep in the persons mind. They are loosing a battle with their own demons. Being a self proclaimed 'looser' is a hard thing to over come. Usually the person perpetuates this persona without realizing it and gives up on trying to fix it because they dont know that they can. When a person is in this downward spiral the only thing that can stop it is an epiphany. Ultimatly it boils down to choice. You choose to fight or you choose to give up.

Without reading any of the other posts before creating my own, I can answer this. He's never had any reason to want to better himself. Most likely anytime he needs anything, if he begs hard enough he'll get it. If he gets in trouble, someone will bail him out. One of the hardest things about dealing with your siblings AND children is to know WHEN to stop giving in to them and let them deal with their own mistakes/problems.

I was in a similar situation years ago. I was a drunk bum who couldn't hold a job for anything. It was a struggle to keep bills paid, and I had to SAVE to have cigarette money. I lived close to my parents & anytime I needed anything I could just ask. I'd borrow the car, money & so forth. My life changing experience came when I got myself into a mess that they couldn't get me out of, and I wound up behind bars for a year & a half & they sold the house they were letting me live in. I had to become more self-reliant then, because I had no free place to stay except with them...and 35 years old living w/ mom & dad just isn't good.

Long story short, I am now hundreds of miles away from them and own a computer repair shop that I operate out of my garage. I fix approx 150 PC's per month @ $40 a pop. Money is no issue. Self-esteem is redlining.

Bottom line is, someone is ENABLING him. Once they stop he will either change, or wind up in jail & THEN change.

It isn't the bums, dropouts and stoners who create the most problems in the world. Rather it is industrious, well accomplished men who wear nice clothes and have nice haircuts and fancy college degrees.

Leave your brother alone and quit being so judgemental.

Work isn't that important as there is nothing a man can make that won't turn into dust.

I would get my family and myself in line first, you have to stop enabling him. If you have had enough you need to stop giving him money. Let him go in debt, take his x-box, ps3, or pc or whatever so you can recover some of that money owes you. You just have to wash your hands of it all and stop getting involved.

And as the poster above said though, there is no problem with the so called 'bums' of society, let them do what they like just keep yourself clear.

reply to post by Mandog


Thank you for your reply Mandog. I sometimes give my little bro some work like cleaning my car or picking me up some food to get him some cash but in the end as long as I keep giving him money he willl just depend on me all the time. You are right though that I should detach and hopefully he will take some initiative after that.

reply to post by ScRuFFy63


Its almost like he is truly depressed from being fired from the navy but It was his decision to get caught doing the things that he does and this is why he is in his current state. If only I wasn't away at the time maybe things could of been different.

reply to post by Iamonlyhuman


So far I have given him a way to write resumes and where to look for work. He says he fills application online and could get a job soon but I will believe it when I see it. Still I hope that he does pull out of this slum that he is in.

reply to post by Stop-loss!


So you blame yourself? Why? You cannot be fully responsible for another being. Nobody can do that 100%. I made bad choices that put me down the wrong path and I won't allow anybody else to take the blame. Every choice was made of my own free will. By letting others take the blame you merely bring them down with you. See people like to think that we are products of our environment but that is only partly true. When we give in to our body's "will" we are products of our environment but when we give in to the desires of our souls our body has no choice but to go along for the ride.

Even alcohol and drugs cannot control a man unless he lets it. A true man can quit cold turkey. You have to have the will power. He needs to ask himself what he really wants. I don't mean money, cars, women etc. Only he can figure out where he fits in this world. And trust me when I say all the help in the world won't help unless he knows what he wants.

PS: Wallowing in the past breeds only hate anger regret. Dreaming about the future makes it seem far far away. Living in the now and being prepared to take one step at a time is the path to whatever you want.

reply to post by ScRuFFy63


I don't blame myself completely. Its just that if I never lent him that money, he would of tried harder to look for a job. That is probably the main reason he quit his job because I gave him a hand-out. I learned my lesson and now I will see how long he can last until he decides to really look for a job.

This is a simple one to be honest mate, although I do feel for you:

Stop lending him money. Completely. Period...

Instruct your parents to stop lending him money (if they do in fact lend him cash, you didn't specify I don't think)

Finally, leave him to it. You could try giving him the whole motivational speech, showing him your possesions/home and make a point that if you want nice things you need to work etc but I'm not sure if you've done all that already or not, sounds like you have...

Only he can change his life, offer him the support/advice and help if he wants it but that's the thing... he has to want it!

Well your brother seems to inadvertently be doing something somewhat decent actually. If he did get a job he might make a few dollars for himself, but more importantly he'd be making more money for the rich to use against the masses. The wealthiest among us use their money to make themselves more powerful at the expense of people like you and I. Your brother's choice not to get a job actually serves to prevent the rich from using him to make themselves richer and the rest of us poorer.

Personally I feel you might be better off helping your brother to become more self sufficient. If he's living with your parents perhaps you and/or your parents could help him learn to garden. Then he could grow food for your consumption and his own making his stay with your parents a bit more worth while. That's just one suggestion, but I think my idea is basically about helping your brother to work his own works rather than pushing him into working to make someone else rich.

reply to post by Stop-loss!


I think you may need to set more realistic expectations. You will probably have to settle for something short of dictating what your brother is. You can set terms for what this relationship is and what ways you will not allow yourself to be affected- ie: not fund his drinking if he should expect you to.

But at the end of the day, if this guy is prepared for the fact that he won't be able to give anything to or expect anything from society, then it's his god given right to do absolutely as much or as little as it takes to kill him- what it takes to kill you, unfortunately, is the only upper limit to what you can do. And believe me I am not saying this to be flippant, I wish your brother a long and meaningful life. I'm just pointing out that every one of us plops down on this rock by no choice of our own into circumstances that we cannot begin to control until after many years of growth and preparation- and even then its almost never what we would have it be. So a guy has got to have control over something just to stay sane- and I've known guys whose only freedom was that to shorten their lives with outrageous behavior. It's hard to say how I feel about that, but I did everything it was my place to do and not a bit more, and I have no regret for that.

On a more practical level, I suggest that you talk to him sympathetically. Address not only what you believe his problem is, but what HE thinks his problem is, because I suspect he's spent some time thinking about it. You need a common goal before you can work together.

Oh, and by the way... if the guy who was in charge of me set HIMSELF on fire the first day, I wouldn't remain under his charge either.

Originally posted by Stop-loss!
reply to post by ScRuFFy63

 

I don't blame myself completely. Its just that if I never lent him that money, he would of tried harder to look for a job. That is probably the main reason he quit his job because I gave him a hand-out. I learned my lesson and now I will see how long he can last until he decides to really look for a job.

It doesn't matter who lent him money or how much it was. It doesn't matter why he quit his job. None of that matters anymore. The past cannot be changed so you have two options. You could either use it as motivation or spiral deeper into depression b/c of it. The choice is yours.

A lot of people on this thread seem to agree with you taking an aggressive stance against his bad habits. It would be wise to remember that the second you or your parents put your foot down you are basically telling him he is not in control. You will make him feel small and insulted then he'll more than likely lash out in one way or another.

Your goal is not to speak to him as though you know whats best. Your true goal should be to help him realize within himself whats best. Remember the story about the wind and the sun and the man in the jacket. Don't give him the answers to life, that just makes a man feel worthless as if he couldn't come up with the answers himself. Speak in such a way that the answers come from him. Doing so will allow him to save face. It will empower him.

"A real leader will always follow..." - Dale Carnegie

Originally posted by ScRuFFy63

Originally posted by Stop-loss!
reply to post by ScRuFFy63

 

I don't blame myself completely. Its just that if I never lent him that money, he would of tried harder to look for a job. That is probably the main reason he quit his job because I gave him a hand-out. I learned my lesson and now I will see how long he can last until he decides to really look for a job.

It doesn't matter who lent him money or how much it was. It doesn't matter why he quit his job. None of that matters anymore. The past cannot be changed so you have two options. You could either use it as motivation or spiral deeper into depression b/c of it. The choice is yours.

A lot of people on this thread seem to agree with you taking an aggressive stance against his bad habits. It would be wise to remember that the second you or your parents put your foot down you are basically telling him he is not in control. You will make him feel small and insulted then he'll more than likely lash out in one way or another.

Your goal is not to speak to him as though you know whats best. Your true goal should be to help him realize within himself whats best. Remember the story about the wind and the sun and the man in the jacket. Don't give him the answers to life, that just makes a man feel worthless as if he couldn't come up with the answers himself. Speak in such a way that the answers come from him. Doing so will allow him to save face. It will empower him.

"A real leader will always follow..." - Dale Carnegie

I agree with this dude ScRuFFy63 op try his way first, kids just need a purpose to feel that they achieve something or are at least on the way to it, # not only kids but pretty much all of us.....but if that does not work then the boot will come down one way or another. I think the whole point is to avoid that the "boot coming down" it just leads to more ego trips usually.

There is a realization to be found in StarCraft. Perhaps he led himself there on purpose?