Explanation of Chem Trails

I enjoy having debates about chem trails. I have learned a lot about a multitude of different subjects since entering into the insanity that is ATS. But I think quite a few people either don't know how to debate, or are really not intelligent enough to have an original idea.

Those that believe that the lines you see in the sky are just contrails, (frozen moisture from aircraft exhaust) all know that at times "we" have sprayed things into the air. In Vietnam it was the defoliant agent orange. In the gulf of Mexico, it was a dispersant called corexit. So it would stand to reason that yes, indeed that are planes set up to spray things into the air.

Here is where we seem to have the breakdown in communication. Contrailers will tell you the science behind why sometimes you see lines in the sky and sometimes you don't. It is real science and it is undisputed. Yet chemtrailers will tell you that "chemtrails will linger for hours and contrails will disperse within 20 minutes". I have seen the "20 minute" figure more than once, so I will assume that is the rule.

Now on a day that is favorable for persistent contrails, amazingly enough, you will see persistent con trails. Then the chemmies will take pictures and claim they are being poisoned. And the disinfo agents were mean to them. Yet on days when persistent con trails should not form, there are none. And the chemmies claim "they" were taking the day off.

Now I have looked into both sides to see if I can find any reason to believe in chem trails. After all, I am on a conspiracy site, and I have yet to receive any "dis info checks". What I have found it that people in every country capable of recording data, are living longer and longer every year. So forget any other argument you may have about being poisoned. And don't even bother trying to explain how huge the conspiracy would have to be (in terms of people and manpower). Or that the pilots of chem planes have families that live on the ground. People are living longer than ever before. And I submit that next year people will live longer than they did the year before on average. Am I a profit? Nope, but I did stay at a holiday Inn Express last night. And used GOOGLE.

So in closing, when arguing about chemtrails poisoning our skies, please have a little bit of an idea as to what is making you angry about them other than it's on a conspiracy site so it must be happening.

However, the Insane Cloud Posse does not understand multiple aspects of aviation and meteorlogy.

They do not understand :

That combustion results in water in the exhaust.
That upper air is extremely cold
That upper air is extremely thin and can not hold as much water
That cirrus is natural, but that airplanes adding water to cold thin air can make it too

reply to post by firepilot


Firepilot.....

However, the Insane Cloud Posse does not understand multiple aspects of aviation and meteorology.

I think some some of "the Insane Cloud Posse" DO "understand multiple aspects of aviation and meteorology".

I think that some them simply enjoy wallowing in their chemtrail martyrdom.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

Originally posted by firepilot
Insane Cloud Posse

That made me smile.

reply to post by network dude


Yikes. Vietnam's Agent Orange.

My dad was in the army that time,
him and his friends had to walk through a contaminated forest.
They said if I was born a boy I'd have cancer because of that.
To this day, kids in Vietnam are born disfigured
because of Agent Orange.

reply to post by Maybe...maybe not


I think you could try to add to the discussion.

I think you should not mock people because they don't agree with you..

And quite a few times, I have seen them post about how its impossible to have contrails and that it must be chemtrails, because either it was summer and hot, or that it was over the desert.

I mean there have been some that have actually refused to believe the air is cold at the altitudes that aircraft fly.


[edit on 26-7-2010 by firepilot]

Originally posted by virgom129
reply to post by Maybe...maybe not

 

I think you could try to add to the discussion.

I think you should not mock people because they don't agree with you..

Virgom129.....

I'm not mocking.....I'm stating fact.

I'm stating fact about the behaviour of "chemtrailers".

You do realise I originally thought there might be "chemtrails", don't you? Did you notice my previous posts about that? I worried about it to the extent I discussed it with my wife, looked out for "spraying planes" which I though I might actually be seeing, identified "chemtrails" in the sky in my area, etc...

However, I took the time to research all of this in great depth & in doing so I found that "chemtrails" do not exist.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

reply to post by network dude


network dude, are you intentionally trying to spread wrong info, or do you really not comprehend the differences in the below:

Those that believe that the lines you see in the sky are just contrails, (frozen moisture from aircraft exhaust) all know that at times "we" have sprayed things into the air.

OK...that isn't the "disinfo" I was talking about I'll get to that. The "frozen moisture from aircraft exhaust" words, though, ARE an (intentional?) attempt at a ridiculous strawman, apparently.

THERE IS ALSO MOISTURE in the very air where the contrials form!!!!

Now, here's where you don't tell the entire story, you omit details...and what other word for that, but "disingenuous"???:

In Vietnam it was the defoliant agent orange. In the gulf of Mexico, it was a dispersant called corexit.

Are you seriously attempting to equate commercial and civilan jet air traffic, at cruise altitudes over 25,000 feet MSL, to the events of LOW ALTITUDE, virtually "on the deck" spraying in Vietnam, and most recently, in the GoM??? :shk:

Furhter:

So it would stand to reason that yes, indeed that are planes set up to spray things into the air.

FACE/SLAP!!!

Must I be the one to destroy your premise, and your thread for you, or will you man up and do the research yourself??

(Hint: Look into the "hercules" airplane, for a start...the C-130 in military designation...)

You could use Wiki....some pooh-pooh it, but it DOES have a lot of easy-to-find, good info.

Wiki "agent orange", too....it even has pictures!!!

We will all wait with bated breath......

Are you seriously attempting to equate commercial and civilan jet air traffic, at cruise altitudes over 25,000 feet MSL, to the events of LOW ALTITUDE, virtually "on the deck" spraying in Vietnam, and most recently, in the GoM???

See, how chemtrails is just a catchall for anything they want it to be. For one person, its about persistent contrails, for others, its about UFOs and aliens, and for others, its about cropdusting or oil dispersant spraying.

What about this? (warning for adult language)
www.youtube.com...



As for me, i like the magical sylphs explanation best of all



[edit on 26-7-2010 by firepilot]

reply to post by weedwhacker


Mr. Wacker,

Please step down off of your high horse for just a second and read the OP. No read it. Then try to understand my point. I don't think that chem trails exist. At least not in the way the "chemies" would like to think. But yes, in fact I have done a tiny bit of reaserch on the C-130 Hercules. In fact, I did so much reserch on them, I used to have one assigned to me. Tail number 1269. It was a 1970 H model. Great plane. I did the BPO's on it an repaired the avionics for several years.

Now about the agent orange. Yes it was sprayed out of planes onto the canopy of the jungle. It was meant to kill off the foliage to see what the enemy was doing in there. It ended up being a carcinogen that affected many people and continues to affect them today. I know they did't spray agent orange at 30K feet. I do however acknowledge that a plane was used to spray said agent. If you disagree, I can provide proof.

Just let me know.

Now about the agent orange. Yes it was sprayed out of planes onto the canopy of the jungle. It was meant to kill off the foliage to see what the enemy was doing in there. It ended up being a carcinogen that affected many people and continues to affect them today. I know they did't spray agent orange at 30K feet. I do however acknowledge that a plane was used to spray said agent. If you disagree, I can provide proof.

No one has disputed this occured.

Originally posted by network dude
Those that believe that the lines you see in the sky are just contrails, (frozen moisture from aircraft exhaust) all know that at times "we" have sprayed things into the air. In Vietnam it was the defoliant agent orange. In the gulf of Mexico, it was a dispersant called corexit. So it would stand to reason that yes, indeed that are planes set up to spray things into the air.

No-one disputes that. The military also disperse chaff on occasions.

Although the only evidence from observations of such actvities suggests that if visible at all, it last at best a few minutes and - except for chaff - occurs at very low levels.

Here is where we seem to have the breakdown in communication. Contrailers will tell you the science behind why sometimes you see lines in the sky and sometimes you don't. It is real science and it is undisputed. Yet chemtrailers will tell you that "chemtrails will linger for hours and contrails will disperse within 20 minutes". I have seen the "20 minute" figure more than once, so I will assume that is the rule.

The 20 minite rule comes from chemtrailers. Everyone else has, for the past 80 years, been pointing out that contrails can and do persist for hours and on occasion spread out to cover the sky. There has been loads of research into this over recent decades, not least by the miitary who would rather their aircraft do not produce contrails, and more recently by those who believe contrails may be contributing to climate change.

Now on a day that is favorable for persistent contrails, amazingly enough, you will see persistent con trails. Then the chemmies will take pictures and claim they are being poisoned. And the disinfo agents were mean to them. Yet on days when persistent con trails should not form, there are none. And the chemmies claim "they" were taking the day off.

Ye, that sounds about right

Originally posted by Essan
and more recently by those who believe contrails may be contributing to climate change.

and I will admit that there is a strong argument for the fact that increased cloud/con trail activity affects the temperature at ground level locally.

I will also admit that weather modification exists. Silver iodide is released into an existing cloud in hopes that it would produce rain.

(Essan, I know you already know this stuff, I am just making sure we don't have to go down that familiar yet well traveled road.)

edit to add:

Chaff is much like driving down the road and having a Semi Truck with a trailer right beside you. Any radar (X or KA band) will see the most predominant target and report it's speed. With Chaff, a much larger radar return is projected and therefore, difficult or impossible to determine any target inside the "radar cloud". Most C-130 are fitted with Chaff and Flare. While most C-130 are only cargo planes and not offensive with regard to weaponry, they hate being shot down as much as any plane. the flares try to convince heat seeking SAMs or AtAMs that they are a much better target than the plane is.

[edit on 26-7-2010 by network dude]

reply to post by Maybe...maybe not


Well, someone`s spraying something.

www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by lambros56
reply to post by Maybe...maybe not

 

Well, someone`s spraying something.

www.youtube.com...

There was NOTHING about spraying in that video. Nice try though

reply to post by network dude


so you do admit to chem trails, cloud seeding, temp control, cloud cover ops, and yes storm manipulation, ie last knight at mid night till six am over twenty plus x flights passed over /above slc UT, today clouds, also increased number of kc 10's flights yes hill AFB is at Ogden UT SLIA, is north of me and i am in the planes flight path, and yes i get good look at them now and then, i would like to know why one plane at say6same alt can leave no "trail" but the next 2 do, and why the x is that for sat pos sen relay? known as spsr, or is it part of the HAARP project?

Originally posted by lambros56
reply to post by Maybe...maybe not

 

Well, someone`s spraying something.

www.youtube.com...

The old chaff video again?

Sorry lambross, this has been debunked numerous times here before

reply to post by lambros56

that would be a lot of CHAFF, nice catch.

Originally posted by bekod
reply to post by network dude

 

so you do admit to chem trails, cloud seeding, temp control, cloud cover ops, and yes storm manipulation, ie last knight at mid night till six am over twenty plus x flights passed over /above slc UT, today clouds, also increased number of kc 10's flights yes hill AFB is at Ogden UT SLIA, is north of me and i am in the planes flight path, and yes i get good look at them now and then, i would like to know why one plane at say6same alt can leave no "trail" but the next 2 do, and why the x is that for sat pos sen relay? known as spsr, or is it part of the HAARP project?

Umm, because maybe they are at different altitudes. I mean 8 year olds would probably not assume that every plane flies at the same altitude. It gets on average about 3-4 degrees colder per thousand feet in F..

And HILL AFB is not a KC-10 base for that matter either. It is more of a maintanance depot more than anything else

And yes, everyone here has admitted cloud seeding with silver iodide into developing thunderstorms goes on. And that has NOTHING do with "chemtrails", unless we are back to chemtrails being whatever someone wants it to be and has no actual meaning