The Shroud of Turin – Miracle or Man made?

reply to post by Rising Against


just to make things clear jesus looked like a muslim black hair black bead dark eyes and dark skin! if you passed him at an airport you would prolly think he was a terrorist depending on your paranoia!

if he was a white man that opens the door for my theories but thats another story!

reply to post by Rising Against


He's a European white male, specifically gaulish-looking. So I really have my hold back. I will look more into it later. But Jesus was certainly not Gaulish.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by Gorman91]

They did some recent DNA tests on the shroud and proved it was a fake. it wasn't 2000+ years old, more like dated around the 1400's.
One more lie that the Vatician wants to promote as the real thing. Science proved them false.

Excellent work, what a fantastic thread! The links and images are great
as well. Thanks for sharing that with us.

S&F

Originally posted by Rising Against
reply to post by TheBloodRed

 

Yes, but not everyone can have faith like that my friend, people are different, we have different beliefs and we have different ways of believing in those beliefs and we’re a better world for it IMO.

We all seek the truth...Isn't that why you believe in God, well this is why I look for evidence. I'm only on this site because all 'I seek is proof.'

Well said my friend and great post. The one thread that connects us all is that we are all seekers of "truth"... especially here at ATS.

reply to post by Rising Against

Well, personally, I don't think that the shroud could even be close to real considering the fact that Jesus was not Anglo-Saxon, which is exactly what we see in the picture/shroud. Jews did not have even close to caucasian features until many centuries later with interracial breeding. Therefore, this shroud is nothing more than a person's rendition of the Eurocentric version of Jesus Christ. It doesn't fit the description of him in the bible, "Hair like wool." And a person who has long flowing hair, does not fit the M.O.

Sorry to be the downer, and, if you still believe that this shroud is genuine, don't let me spoil your day.

Namaste and Love

I have been following the shroud stuff since the 80's and read (and watched) everything that has ever come out on it. I am not a Christian, and in fact not even a theist...and yet, I do not believe this to be a forgery, but something yet completely unexplained. The newer sewn pieces in the shroud (from which the samples were taken), can easily explain the more recent dating.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by whatsup]

reply to post by Rising Against


Seeing is how it has been tested before and there are conflicting reports.
Some say that the corner tested had been repaired by master craftsmen by weaving or reweaving the burnt and damagedd areas.
The holders of the shroud will not allow further testing to be done as a little bit of the shroud must be destroyed with every test.
I say if you believe that it is hold steady to your convictions.
Who cares as it is a faith issue anyway.
And if you are athiest don't sweat it either.
You have no stake whatsoever if you are athiest.
Me I care not either way what another man says about anyones Gods or items that may have been theirs.
I just try to do the right thing and do no harm and if that is not good enough then an afterlife with that sort just wouldnt seem right.

reply to post by Eye of Horus


I had to subscribe just to ask you to quote your source. DNA testing will not specify a time period, only carbon 14 dating. The carbon 14 dating has been called into question based on several possible sources of error so please quote your source....

Wow, huge OP and am still reading it. Before I come back and share my thoughts on the subject I want to throw an article into the mix for consideration.

You see, in 2009 Luigi Garlaschelli , an Italian scientist recreated the shroud of turin in an effort to prove that the actual shroud if a fake/hoax.

Check out the article from CNN and read the method he used and what he has to say about the shroud. Then let me know your thoughts.

www.cnn.com...

Originally posted by PsychoX42
It doesn't fit the description of him in the bible, "Hair like wool."

There is NO description of Jesus in the Bible.
"Hair like wool" is NOT found in the Bible.


Kap

reply to post by Kapyong


you really want someone from israel in the land of middle eastern people to be white dont you?

Originally posted by whatsup
The newer sewn pieces in the shroud (from which the samples were taken),

Wrong.
This is a falsehood passed on by believers.

Originally posted by whatsup
can easily explain the more recent dating.

Only if you falsely assume the testers were so stupid they tested the RECENT additions.

But they didn't.
Or do YOU have some evidence they did?


Kap

Originally posted by g146541
Seeing is how it has been tested before and there are conflicting reports.

There are no conflicting reports.
There is clear evidence it is a fake.
And there are believers who won't accept it, and make wild false claims.

Originally posted by g146541
Some say that the corner tested had been repaired by master craftsmen by weaving or reweaving the burnt and damagedd areas.

What "some say" is just false.

Originally posted by g146541
The holders of the shroud will not allow further testing to be done as a little bit of the shroud must be destroyed with every test.

They DID test it.
It WAS shown to be fake.

Originally posted by g146541
I say if you believe that it is hold steady to your convictions.

Sure -
You can believe in faeries if you want to also.


Kap

Originally posted by metalholic
you really want someone from israel in the land of middle eastern people to
be white dont you?

What a BIZARRE post!

No, I do not.
I do not even believe Jesus existed.

I can't imagine how someone could be MORE WRONG.


Kap

reply to post by Kapyong


well it was like u went through the whole bible to tell that guy hey no description of jesus...

so it made me think of how christians would really turn in there sleep if they found out that jesus looks like a muslim

[edit on 18-7-2010 by metalholic]

Wow what a thread!!!
Good job OP , thanks alot!

Gday,

Originally posted by metalholic
well it was like u went through the whole bible to tell that guy hey no description of jesus...

It a well known fact that there is NO description of Jesus anywhere.
I have no idea where "hair like wool" come from.

Originally posted by metalholic
so it made me think of how christians would really turn in there sleep if they found out that jesus looks like a muslim

Or if they found out he never even existed in the first place.


Kap

Gday,

Ah, here it is :

Revelation 1:14, 15 -

"His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and His eyes like a flame of fire; His feet were like fine brass, as if refined in a furnace, and His voice as the sound of many waters;"

Well, that is a description of the Risen Christ - a heavenly being.

But note it does NOT say "hair like wool" as quoted.
It says "head and hair were WHITE as snow (like wool)".

So -

Did a historical Jesus have "eyes like a flame of fire" ?

Did a historical Jesus have "feet like fine brass, as if refined in a furnace" ?

Did a historical Jesus have "a voice as the sound of many waters" ?

Did a historical Jesus have hair AND head "as white as snow - like wool" ?


No way.
That's a religious legend about a spiritual being.


Kap

Starred, Flagged, and added to favorites!

Thanks OP for taking the time to post such a wealth of knowledge about a very compelling, yet controversial subject.

Great work!