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Feds shut down nine websites in movie piracy crackdown

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posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik

Originally posted by Annee
In other words: One - the creator. Has exclusive right of sale - - for a limited time period.

Somehow - - I can't find anything wrong with that.


That's what I have been saying all along. Your fine with that but it can lead to price gouging which is what I am not fine with.

On the other hand we have the "legal" defenition of seeing is not taking. Again if I go to a friends house and watch a movie that he paid for. The artist isn't getting a dime from me but I get to see his work. Same with other loaners. Artists never saw additional profit from loaned books, records, movies and it was never a big deal although everyone did it.


NO - - how do you get price gouging out of that?

That is your assumption of what transpires. You can not assume someone else's mind.

Once again - - you are simply trying to justify your own actions.

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People are going to share things they find enjoyable - - like cook books. Its human nature.

Stop trying to shift the focus.




posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by Annee
NO - - how do you get price gouging out of that?

That is your assumption of what transpires. You can not assume someone else's mind.

Once again - - you are simply trying to justify your own actions.

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People are going to share things they find enjoyable - - like cook books. Its human nature.

Stop trying to shift the focus.


An audio cd is not worth more than $5.00 no matter who's music is on it but since the artists can set their price to whatever they want and no one can compete with them for the same album they are price gouging.

Using the information from a cook book that you didn't pay would fall under your idea of theft.

[edit on 6-7-2010 by daskakik]



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 10:08 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik
It's not self justification if the laws where I live say this does not constitute a theft.


It certainly is if you actually need laws to tell you that taking someone else's hard work and enjoying it without recompense is wrong, then you really do not deserve to live in a society. If it was perfectly legal to go take anything you wanted from anyone you wanted, that would be ok with you? Sad.



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 10:09 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik

Originally posted by Annee
NO - - how do you get price gouging out of that?

That is your assumption of what transpires. You can not assume someone else's mind.

Once again - - you are simply trying to justify your own actions.

---------------------------------------

People are going to share things they find enjoyable - - like cook books. Its human nature.

Stop trying to shift the focus.


An audio cd is not worth more than $5.00 no matter who's music is on it but since the artists can set their price to whatever they want and no one can compete with them for the same album they are price gouging.



What difference does it make what YOU consider a CD worth?

It is not your call.

This continued attempt at justifying the right to take something for free - - is getting really old and tired.



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 10:09 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik
Well if it's an audio cd you could send the band $2.00. That would probably be 25%-50% more than the label would have given then for the sale of the cd.


I did not ask what I could send because I actually buy things. I do not decide what the price of things should be. I am not going to pay more for something valuable that is on sale so I do not get to decide to pay less when I want something either. I want to know what YOU do to support the artists while boycotting the evil industry. Or are you just trying to make yourself feel better by calling theft "boycotting?"



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 10:17 PM
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Originally posted by Annee
What difference does it make what YOU consider a CD worth?

It is not your call.

This continued attempt at justifying the right to take something for free - - is getting really old and tired.


Here I thought it was a business transaccion. I don't take stuff for free but I do like to check it out before I buy. Funny thing is that I can download and burn to CDR-A which takes the theft out and it still costs me less than a dollar.

[edit on 7-7-2010 by daskakik]



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 10:21 PM
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Originally posted by evil incarnate

Originally posted by daskakik
Well if it's an audio cd you could send the band $2.00. That would probably be 25%-50% more than the label would have given then for the sale of the cd.


I did not ask what I could send because I actually buy things. I do not decide what the price of things should be. I am not going to pay more for something valuable that is on sale so I do not get to decide to pay less when I want something either. I want to know what YOU do to support the artists while boycotting the evil industry. Or are you just trying to make yourself feel better by calling theft "boycotting?"


Well I think that if you send the band the money that they would have made on the cd sale you will be supporting the band and sticking it to the industry.

I think the guy calling it boycotting (debunky) doesn't care what you call it.



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik
Well I think that if you send the band the money that they would have made on the cd sale you will be supporting the band and sticking it to the industry.



Really? And how many bands do you personally know?

I personally know some bands that use Artist Direct. It is a far cry from being promoted by a major label.

Being signed to a label that has backing to promote an artist -- is major.

Major connections - major league deals - power knowing power. The unspoken deals.



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik


Here I thought it was a business transaccion. I don't take stuff for free but I do like to check it out before I buy. Funny thing is that I can download and burn to CD-a which takes the theft out and it still costs me less than a dollar.


You just continuously try to justify.

Taking something - that is not offered for free by the artist/distributor - is theft.



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 11:21 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by daskakik
Well I think that if you send the band the money that they would have made on the cd sale you will be supporting the band and sticking it to the industry.



Really? And how many bands do you personally know?

I personally know some bands that use Artist Direct. It is a far cry from being promoted by a major label.

Being signed to a label that has backing to promote an artist -- is major.

Major connections - major league deals - power knowing power. The unspoken deals.


Checked the artist direct webiste and shop. Still too pricey but if they are giving the artist more on the sale it's cool.

About signing to a label that can promote and artist I would have to see what the deal is like.

Here is something that a fellow ATSer wrote on another thread here The Filesharing Conspiracy.


The labels: I've actually been offered deals by 2 labels, and I can vouch for the notion that, at least in my case, it was a HUGE rip off! One of them was at the point where I wouldn't have gotten ANY money from CD sales and only 10% of the revenue generated from live shows....right. I ended up doing everything myself....and sadly, I can't help but wonder what might have come from the promotion I would've gotten from said label.


I have seen some sites the allow you to sell your music and they take 25% or so from the sales. Maybe that is what this person was talking about when he says he did it all himself.

I do have more than a few friends in bands and into other artistic endeavours. Wish they could get more exposure without having to hand over too much to the guys with the connections. But thats the way the world works.

[edit on 6-7-2010 by daskakik]



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 11:28 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by daskakik


Here I thought it was a business transaccion. I don't take stuff for free but I do like to check it out before I buy. Funny thing is that I can download and burn to CD-a which takes the theft out and it still costs me less than a dollar.


You just continuously try to justify.

Taking something - that is not offered for free by the artist/distributor - is theft.


Sorry CDR-A (also known as audio cdr or cdr-audio) is the media where the the royalties are paid in the purchase of the blank cd. It is not theft. The record companies get their money so it isn't theft and the cost per blank cd is between $0.25 and $0.50.


[edit on 7-7-2010 by daskakik]



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 11:38 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik

Checked the artist direct webiste and shop. Still too pricey but if they are giving the artist more on the sale it's cool.


NO - not your call again. Only the Artist can determine if it is too pricey. The artist gets no promotion from Artist Direct. All and any promotion is the responsibility of the artist


About signing to a label that can promote and artist I would have to see what the deal is like.


Again not your call. There are new artists - established artists - indy artists - etc. Their call - - not your. As the consumer - - your only call is to Purchase or Not.


Again - - signing with a major label - - you are benefiting from their connections and financial support or promotion. The average amount paid to an artist per CD is 10 cents.

The major promotion helps in getting an artist recognized and their record into radio rotation. The more popular the artist - - the more support for touring. Touring is where a musical artist makes their money.

It's crucial to look at the "whole broad spectrum".



[edit on 6-7-2010 by Annee]



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 12:15 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


As to the price of their wares. It's too pricey if they expect me to buy. I'd be better served downloading and burning their album unto an Audio cdr and be 100% legit.

About the signing deal. If the artist is getting pennies per CD I could decide to send them a couple of bucks, from what I saved by burning to an audio CDR, which would, I hope, get into their pockets instead of the labels.

[edit on 7-7-2010 by daskakik]



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 07:58 AM
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Originally posted by ~Lucidity

See movies I understand. But TV?! I'm furious frankly.

[edit on 1-7-2010 by ~Lucidity]


wild guess here but its probably because the TV companies and actors will make no money.

for example. if ITV in england airs a hugely popular show but everyone watches it online instead. companies wont pay ITV for television adverts because they arent getting the viewing figures they would like. so ITV make less money so they pay the actors a lot less.



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 10:09 AM
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Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by Annee
 


As to the price of their wares. It's too pricey if they expect me to buy. I'd be better served downloading and burning their album unto an Audio cdr and be 100% legit.

About the signing deal. If the artist is getting pennies per CD I could decide to send them a couple of bucks, from what I saved by burning to an audio CDR, which would, I hope, get into their pockets instead of the labels.



Its theft. If you don't pay for it - - its theft. I don't care what your laws allow.

Self Serving. Yeah - that part I got.



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by Annee
 


I don't think you understand. As far as music goes they sell blank CD's, called Audio CDR, that include an extra charge which covers the royalties. It's not theft because if I download and burn copyrighted material (only applies to music) on one of these cd's then I am in good standing with RIAA.

This has nothing to do with local laws. This is something the music industry set up.

Edit to add - You say you don't care what my laws allow but you expect me to care about what your laws allow. Hypocritical if you ask me.


[edit on 7-7-2010 by daskakik]



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 07:49 PM
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I talked to my kid about production and distribution. The extent of what a film goes through to be ready for distribution is fascinating.

About free downloads. SOMEONE is paying if it is a legitimate licensed site. If your country allows free 24 hour previews (I still say a Preview should not be the full product) - contracts were signed and conditions were determined for compensation to the distributor.

If your country sanctions pirated sites - - something is wrong.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 03:10 AM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by Annee
 


As to the price of their wares. It's too pricey if they expect me to buy. I'd be better served downloading and burning their album unto an Audio cdr and be 100% legit.

About the signing deal. If the artist is getting pennies per CD I could decide to send them a couple of bucks, from what I saved by burning to an audio CDR, which would, I hope, get into their pockets instead of the labels.



Its theft. If you don't pay for it - - its theft. I don't care what your laws allow.

Self Serving. Yeah - that part I got.



And one more time I ask:
If you dont care about the laws, why again should I?

And please let go of the ridiculous idea that price is set by the producer. If he wants to maximize profits, price is where MR=MC in a free market, and where MC=Marginal Benefit for the consumer in a monopoly.
He can set it hwere he want, ONLY If he DOES NOT WANT TO SELL IT.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 09:10 AM
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I'm amazed that any of you, being here on the internet. Can call downloading a movie theft.

You're honestly stealing nothing. There is nothing physical. You aren't taking from one person to have for yourself.

It's a virtual duplication of technically non-existent information. It literally exists in the space between spaces, within a modulation.

You can't steal something which doesn't exist. Secondly if the video is then re-encoded. The information contained within isn't owned by anyone if it's changed in the slightest. It becomes a completely different item. This is how the digital works.

So if someone literally took the time to redraw every frame of a movie to EXACT detail and then connected them to produce a new video. Who owns it?

Artistically it's yours. However the story is still copyrighted. So you simply can't reproduce it for profit.

So I ask, what is the difference between drawing by hand. And using digital technology to recreate the frames? Technology just makes it easier to COPY. Not STEAL.

The only reason we call it stealing now is thanks to government PSAs when we were in school talking about "Don't copy that floppy!" "It's theft". Which completely ignores the actual definition of theft.

Then the RIAA/MPAA ran with that premise.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 09:41 AM
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reply to post by grey580
 




I think you need to take some midol. And I'd appreciate you not putting words into my mouth I never said.


Midol might be your drug of choice for that testy time of month. But I prefer Hydrocodone! My wife forgets its that time of month! Does Midol work well for you Mr. "Hey look at me, I believe in aliens, hence my name !!"



My issue here is with the tactics employed by the MPAA/RIAA. Here we have two large groups with alot of money. Trying to impose legislation and use our resources that we pay for to benefit themselves. While selling us their product at a premium. Do I really need to pay $30 dollars for a blue ray movie?


Who are you to dictate how much production of that blue ray costs?
Do you have any idea how much overhead they pay? How can you assume that you have any right to say what they should charge.... You hold the ultimate trump card... Your wallet.. If you feel it is too expensive.. DONT BUY IT!!!!! But to assume that you can steal it is just plain stupid!




I understand they have to make some money. But come on make it affordable. Maybe if it was affordable people wouldn't pirate.


really??? So if they went down to 20 bucks you and others would stop pirating??? LMFAO !!!!! Lies ... simple plain lies!! You would say they should only be 12 bucks!!! Again... pathetic..



I am of the opinion that a billion dollar industry shouldn't be trying to pass laws or use public law enforcement to benefit themselves. We are not in the business of keeping them in the black.


Now below you call me a jackass... I am going to prove that you are that and more!!!



a billion dollar industry shouldn't be trying to pass laws or use public law enforcement to benefit themselves.


Really? So, said "industry" should not be able to use law enforcment to protect their product? Are you serious? They should also not be able to protect their property with laws?? Again.. you must be joking..are you serious?




And before I go, you sir are a jackass.


If I were you I would leave the big boy conversations alone and stick to UFO's and ET's...




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