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Proof that "Al Qaeda in Iraq" were armed by the US? (VIDEO)

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posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:01 PM
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I know that Iraq is no longer a hot topic and even more so for the supposed "Al Qaeda in Iraq" but I searched through the ATS site and couldn't find another thread on this. I have actually known about this since it first came out but unfortunately, I hadn't even heard of ATS at that time. So, I bring it forth now, as in my opinion, the war is still unjust and we need to hold those responsible, accountable. Although the MSM has a media-blackout on the situation in Iraq, our brave heroes are still fighting and dying over there. Moving right along, I'll get to my theory and the evidence to support said theory below.

I remember when Abu Musab al-Zarqawi was supposedly the most wanted man in the world when he lead a group alleged to have been called "Al Qaeda in Iraq" from 2004 until his death in 2006. I remember thinking that this would have been a very poor and stupid move on the part of the Jihadists because it gave credence to Bush's claim that Iraq was somehow connected to Bin Laden. I just couldn't see the Jihadists (or what most of the west believes to be the Jihadists) making such a poor PR move and it seemed far to convenient for the Bush Administration, with their increasingly unpopular war in that oil rich nation.

From day one, I became extremely suspicious of who this group was, who is funding them and their ultimate purpose. I did a little research and found that the name "Al Qaeda in Iraq" was a made up name, given to them by the western media. Never did they ever name or call themselves "Al Qaeda in Iraq" but rather, جماعة التوحيد والجهاد or Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad (Group of Monotheism and Jihad) and then later, Tanzim Qaidat al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn (Organization of Jihad's Base in the Country of the Two Rivers).

Anyway, I remember a video coming out of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, shortly before he was supposedly killed by a bomb originating from a US fighter jet. In this video, was al-Zarqawi appearing to have trouble operating a weapon and the MSM were touting the video as a "blooper", basically making fun of the guy for not even knowing his way around the weapon that he was operating. Right then and there, I noticed something odd about the video. The weapons, all of the weapons in this video were US manufactured weapons. In fact, this is most likely the reason that he was having apparent difficulty operating one of those weapons. Not one single media outlet mentioned the fact that Al Qaeda in Iraq were being issued US manufactured weapons and no one else seemed to realize this little caveat.



What was the "terrorist" group, Al Qaeda in Iraq, doing with US issued weapons? Could it be that the entire group was armed, trained and funded by the US or covert US operations for so called "US interests"? Was this a US or western manufactured group for the sole purpose of justifying the US war in Iraq with the dissatisfied western public? The group did seem awfully convenient for those in support of the war.

Some people might say that those weapons were merely taken from the dead bodies of soldiers, killed in theatre but that explanation doesn't seem to ring true. The weapons in that video alone, are far too brand new to have been taken off of bodies killed in action and what is the chance that they would have all necessary weapons for a squad or platoon sized element? Would we not also see some "terrorists" armed with Russian made weapons as well? This group seems to be armed with all US and western manufactured weapons.

Many people have already realized how phony this "terrorist" group is, but now we have a huge piece of evidence to suggest that this group was at least armed by the US government or US interests.

My theory is that this alleged "terrorist" group was manufactured, funded, trained and armed for the sole purpose of making the Iraqi War relevant to the reasons given by Bush & Co. for being there in the first place. In other words, when the people of the Western world just started to realize that this entire war was for the sole purpose of corporate interests and that we were flat-out lied to, to get us into this war of aggression, up pops a terrorist group where the name alone gives credence to at least two if the reasons cited by the Bush Administration for going to war with Iraq in the first place. It's kind of funny (or would be if it wasn't so tragic) that when this group started to be propagated through the MSM airwaves, opposition to the war went down. What do you think?

--airspoon





[edit on 23-5-2010 by airspoon]




posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:10 PM
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You get this all from this video?? I can see where you are trying to go and where you are coming from but I can assure you that those weapons were not given or supplied to them from us. They were probably stolen, bought on the blackmarket, or taken off dead US soldiers.

As for al qaeda in Iraq... I have no clue.... In the military we basically see a insurgent or a terrorists and we call them al qaeda so really who knows. But there were definatley NO terrorists groups in Iraq accept Sadaams regime of misfit losers who we swiftly kick their butts. Then he called out to all his "brothers" to come and help kill the infidel Americans. And that is when all the different organizations started showing up.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:55 PM
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reply to post by Reign02
 


Those weapons appear to be brand new. If you are in the military, then you know that small arms such as those, get banged up pretty easily and come time for deployment, you will rarely have a brand new weapon in the hands of the soldiers, much less a bunch of brand new weapons. Those weapons don't look like they were collected after a battle, from dead or wounded soldiers. Furthermore, brand new small arms aren't really shipped to theatre and then supplied to the units so it is unlikely that they were stolen from a shipment, though not entirely impossible. Small arms usually ship with each unit deploying or with the armory of each deployed unit. Furthermore, that video looks like a video, were a militant group just got a shipment of brand new weapons and they are trying out their new shipment.

As far as "Al Qaeda in Iraq", in my Army unit we did not call all insurgents "Al Qaeda" though that is besides the point. It really has nothing to do with what western soldiers were calling their foes. Back around '05-'06, the US government along with the MSM, were going on and on about a new terrorist group named "Al Qaeda in Iraq", lead by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. For a while, if Iraq was brought up, so was al-Zarqawi. They used this as a reason for why we needed to be in Iraq. It was alleged that he was actually Al Qaeda and a branch of Osama's organization, operating in Iraq. This simply wasn't the case. It did however boost support for both the war and Bush's fledgling popularity.

Also, everyone who knows anything about the Middle East of those times, knows that Saddam was not in bed with terrorists and in fact, hated by most terror organizations. He spent most of his reign, fighting terrorism in his own country and opposing terror around the globe. But again, this is besides the point.

What I'm theorizing here, is that "Al Qaeda in Iraq" was actually an organization trained and supplied by covert western forces to give credence to the Iraq War, which was beginning to turn into the 21st century's Vietnam, back in the states. What better way to boost support of the war and give credence to Bush's claims that got us into the war in the first place, than to have Al Qaeda operating in Iraq, causing much chaos in that country? It was too convenient for the Bush Admin and too damning for those opposed to the war in Iraq, including jihadists. You see, the jihadists aren't stupid and they knew, even back then that the best way to win the war in Iraq, was through popular opinion back in the States. Starting an Al Qaeda wing in Iraq, was one of the most stupid things they could possibly do. However, it would have been one of the best things to do for the Bush Admin or TPTB.

This video clearly shows an alleged terrorist group using brand new or what appears to be brand new US manufactured small arms. The video also seems to have been filmed to show their brand new shipment of American made weapons. This piece of evidence, only backs the mountain of circumstantial evidence to show that Al Qaeda in Iraq was a creation of the US government to win popular support for the war or at least give a valid reason for being in a war with no valid reasons at all.

I am a retired Army paratrooper veteran, having a ton of experience with the Middle East, particularly Afghanistan and Iraq, seeing how my unit was deployed almost non-stop since around Sept 22, 2001 until my retirement around 2005. From my experience, these weapons don't appear to have been collected from battle and it is unlikely though not impossible that this militant group stole a "shipment" of small arms. It is much more likely that this group received a shipment of these weapons from a supplier. This video clearly shows an alleged terrorist group with a new shipment of US made weapons, which further backs up the claim. Occam's Razor is sharper than ever.

--airspoon



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:02 PM
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I remember seeing this in an intel briefing and someone brought up that little tidbit of info. Intel said that they'd been told the weapons were probably from dead GIs.

It was funny when he burned his hand on that hot barrel, tho.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:15 PM
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reply to post by jerico65
 


Yeah, that was a little funny though I've known a couple soldiers to burn their faces or arms after leaning up against the weapon. The excuse about the dead GIs just doesn't fly in my book because the seemingly good or new shape of the weapons. Also, the ammunition would be tough for them to get, so I doubt they would be wasting NATO ammo on demonstrations.

--airspoon



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 07:34 PM
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reply to post by Reign02
 


Yes, I did get a lot from this video, though other pictures, videos and accounts as well. However, this video actually says a lot, at least a lot more than most people can see. I have spent my career in the military, with those same weapons used in the video and with a good portion spent focused on the Middle East. Based upon my many years of experience with those weapons, the military and the Middle East, the most likely explanation for this video, is that they recieved a shipment of brand new American made weapons from somebody, most likely the US government ir a branch there of.

--airspoon

[edit on 23-5-2010 by airspoon]



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 07:56 PM
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reply to post by airspoon
 


I agree that SAW looks brand new!

Sorry if you have a weapon involved in any war-action, the things get beat up fast!

So fast you carry a black marker to blacken out the metal!

Anyway good thread OP S&F!



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 10:06 PM
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It does indeed look new and in fact, so does the M4, M16 and 203. This isn't even mentioning the ammo. Given a choice, most insurgents wouldn't arm themselves with American or western weapons due to the ammo being hard to find in that region. If they picked up weapons from fallen GIs, then they wouldn't have access to that much ammo and therefore they would be less inclined to arm themselves with such weapons.

--airspoon

[edit on 23-5-2010 by airspoon]



posted on May, 24 2010 @ 12:30 AM
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Do you know a GI that could carry all that arsenal? Sheesh the ammon alone would weight tens of pound if not hundreds.



I sure don't remember many GI's carrying that much weight ever. They sure need alot of water to carry that weight.



posted on May, 24 2010 @ 08:09 AM
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Right, they would have to have taken out an entire squad+ and that squad would have had to have all new weapons. Another thing that struck me, is that they have a mix of M4s and M16s. Generally speaking, US military units have either or. You shouldn't see a squad or even company size element with mixed rifles like that, except for maybe AF combat controllers, when they are embedded into Army units and then even still.

--airspoon



posted on May, 24 2010 @ 02:45 PM
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Originally posted by airspoon
reply to post by Reign02
 


Yes, I did get a lot from this video, though other pictures, videos and accounts as well. However, this video actually says a lot, at least a lot more than most people can see. I have spent my career in the military, with those same weapons used in the video and with a good portion spent focused on the Middle East. Based upon my many years of experience with those weapons, the military and the Middle East, the most likely explanation for this video, is that they recieved a shipment of brand new American made weapons from somebody, most likely the US government ir a branch there of.

--airspoon

[edit on 23-5-2010 by airspoon]

I too have spend many years in the military and carry on a regular basis the M240B, M249, M9, and M4. I do not see how you think these weapons are brand new in this video. I have been to Iraq and Afghanistan and have encountered insurgents carrying our weapons but I seriously doubt we are supplying them. If anything they could be taking them off Iraqi Security Forces or Cops because some of them do carry M4/M16s. But he most likely purchased the M249 from the black market.



posted on May, 24 2010 @ 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by airspoon
Right, they would have to have taken out an entire squad+ and that squad would have had to have all new weapons. Another thing that struck me, is that they have a mix of M4s and M16s. Generally speaking, US military units have either or. You shouldn't see a squad or even company size element with mixed rifles like that, except for maybe AF combat controllers, when they are embedded into Army units and then even still.

--airspoon


I have seen many ARMY infantry units carrying both M16s and M4s. And the Combat Controllers all carry M4s now same with TACP and Security Forces. IF we were supplying them then why are we over there fighting them?? We are wasting so much money on this war to be supplying both sides, think about it, it doesn't make sense. What is to gain from supplying the enemy that we are fighting.



posted on May, 24 2010 @ 08:40 PM
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reply to post by Reign02
 
Simple it keeps the threat of "al queda." alive it's not surprising that elements of the government would support and arm a "terrorist organization." Here's a classic example:en.wikipedia.org... also look at this:en.wikipedia.org... Both the military and the CIA with or without the knowledge of the government has armed and supported various terrorism groups for continued power and funding.One more exmaple for ya:en.wikipedia.org...



posted on May, 24 2010 @ 08:42 PM
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Well when the USA has already been on record for Arming them ... back when they didn't want Russia to occupy the area, and now they need an excuse to stay over there, so why not?



posted on May, 25 2010 @ 01:58 PM
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reply to post by Reign02
 


It is important to note that I'm not talking about all insurgents here. I'm only talking about the group labeled "Al Qaeda in Iraq", a smaller Sunni militia, made up of foreigners to Iraq.

Furthermore, please name one infantry unit, S level or smaller that has a mix of both M4s and M16s. Army units get issued either rifle on the basis of that "unit's" mission capabilities.

Occasionally, an insurgent or two will be using western weapons though it is very rare. What's even more rare, an entire top echelon of a militia having a plethora of American made weapons and an abundance of NATO ammo to where they can be demonstrating these weapons for video.

I'm not saying that it is entirely impossible for them to have gained these weapons in an unorthodox manner, I'm just providing a theory with far more plausibility. As I have stated before, Occam's Razor should be applied here.

--airspoon



posted on May, 25 2010 @ 02:51 PM
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Originally posted by Jahan
Well when the USA has already been on record for Arming them ... back when they didn't want Russia to occupy the area, and now they need an excuse to stay over there, so why not?


Yea but didn't we supply them with Russian weapons for the most part. And our government is in debt up to our ears, why continue this war if it is costing our government tons of money?? MAybe so we can secure the oil to regain some income or cut some costs?? There are too many factors that could be in play for this war.

Man I hope they don't send me back to either one of those hell holes.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 07:21 AM
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Hey Reign,

You need to do some more reading on ATS if you have to ask the question "Why are we fighing the war". MONEY MONEY MONEY.....

If you choose to beleive it or not, a Lot of the people on this website beleive that the "war on terror" is being fought to provide a lot of profit to the powers that be...i.e. the people who really run the show, not the fake guys in the governement we see on TV, but the real top guns...Rothchilds/Bilderburg members etc.

I hate to see our boys getting shipped back home in plastic bags to line the pockets of these bastards, but sometimes the evidence is overwhelming.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 08:02 AM
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Getting all that from a video is pretty silly man.

Alot of countries use the same weapons as the US, M16's and M4A1's aren't unique to the US Army. Bosnians used them, russians have used them, Israel use them, branches of the old Iraqi Army used them.

Look into something more before you suggest such huge, hollow theories.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 10:41 AM
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reply to post by Motive
 


Well first off, it may be only silly to you or to anyone who isn't familiar with the subjects discussed because you obviously don't have the experience required to understand the situation. While it is true that other countries use our same weapons, no other country has the motive like the US. Also, no other countries have the right to sell those weapons, unlike the Kalashnikov. The problem is that those weapons were most likely supplied by the west or Israel but there is no doubt in my mind that this particular group was manufactured for the benefit of the US. This group only served to help the US and hurt the insurgency. Low and behold, the only videos that show this mysterious group are also showing them with only US made weapons.

Also, just to let you know, that wasn't an M4A1 and branches of the old Iraqi guard did not use them nor the Bosnians. You are just spreading propaganda now.


--airspoon



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 11:11 AM
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I suppose we had to arm them before we could justify killing them, no?

Any chance that they obtained the weapons through the black market?



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