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What's A Diploma Worth?

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posted on May, 20 2010 @ 05:08 PM
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What's A Diploma Worth?

Americans have always loved college and real estate. So why do these assets need government support?


The overall cohort default rate on student loans has increased by more than 50 percent since 2003. The media have focused on the portion of this growth coming from students at for-profit colleges: According to the Department of Education, more than 40 percent of loans granted from 2003 to 2006 to students at such institutions will go bad over time. But students at nonprofit four-year colleges are also projected to default at rates between 10 and 20 percent. And the trend will worsen: Among 20 to 24-year-olds, college graduates are doing slightly better than non-graduates in the job market, but they still suffer an unemployment rate of 8.4 percent.

But if the worth of the asset is questionable, the price has been going through the roof. In the last 25 years, college tuition and fees have increased by 440 percent, according to the National Center for Public Policy and Higher Education. That’s more than four times the rate of inflation.

Early this year, students in the University of California system responded to tuition hikes with some half-hearted campaigns of campus unrest. The bankrupt Golden State—which has shielded generations of customers from the actual costs of maintaining a tenure-rich, administration-heavy public university system, but which can no longer keep up this impossible mandate—is an especially painful case. But Alabama, Wisconsin, Illinois, and more than 30 other states have experienced similar protests against price hikes at their state school systems.

Time was that a top school was considered impervious to these kinds of market forces. As recently as 2006, the College Board estimated that the wealthiest 10 percent of private four-year colleges and universities had an endowment cushion of $454,100 per student. But these nest eggs were raided in the great credit unwind. Harvard’s endowment has lost $10 billion, about 30 percent of its value, most of that under the leadership of current White House economic advisor Larry Summers. Yale’s endowment has lost $5.6 billion.




posted on May, 20 2010 @ 05:26 PM
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I dropped out of highschool, and never intend on going back.

I'm 17, and i only have 3 things in my life in which i will not participate in:

1. Money
2. War
3. Mass production

Sign me up for anything excluding these things. Sadly, there aren't any in society.



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:15 PM
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First let me state that I finally paid off my tuition loans. As for their value versus cost :down:

Higher education has long been an industry in the US, plain and simple. The tuition itself continuously rises without justification. In states like Ohio, rate increases are governed to an extent. But only that so many percent of an increase does not require permission. Only percentages that go above that rate cap require permission that is usually granted if plans of a new building or extensive renovation are included with the request.

Teaching fees, lab fees and various other fees are not regulated in any way. Same with room and board. In fact, when I attended the University of Tennessee, admission to football games was included in those fees. You just went to the box office, handed your card and they would punch out the game for that week and hand you the ticket. None of mine were punched because I was in the band, I didn't need a ticket. But the music department handed me $20 every game day as reimbursement as well as an additional $20 for away games as a stipend. Longer trips were a $20 per diem stipend.

If collages managed their costs better (tenured professors than only conduct a 1 hour lecture once a month), they might be able to actually decrease tuition over time.



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:19 PM
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A problem with current 4-year colleges is that they have lowered their academic admission standards. This allows more people to attend and borrow money to pay the school. Now, students that are "involved in the community" and "leaders in society" are accepted despite their sub-par academic performance (I know many former classmates like that). I'm am totally anti-community service which means I had to have a 4.0 to get into programs like med school.

This coming from an academia type but in undergrad I felt surrounded by people that looked forward to their "rebate" check which is the amount of loans that exceeds their books and tuition. Many of them rarely attended class and were unimpressive when they did. They are doling out degrees to people that in years past would have probably flunked out. Anyways, anyone can go to college and get a degree, but what you learn depends on how hard you work.



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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One reason why a lot of people are getting worthless college degrees is that a bachelor's degree has the same value today as a high school diploma did years' ago.

Decades ago, employers knew somebody with a high school degree had basic literacy and math skills. Today, our high schools are churning out millions of students who can barely read, write, or balance a check book. People now have to get a college degree to get high school level jobs in order to assure their future employers they have basic skills.



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:25 PM
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Originally posted by gandhi
I dropped out of highschool, and never intend on going back.

I'm 17, and i only have 3 things in my life in which i will not participate in:

1. Money
2. War
3. Mass production

Sign me up for anything excluding these things. Sadly, there aren't any in society.


I see a Darwin Award in your future.

Good Luck to you!



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:29 PM
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I like to contribute with this valuable link.
www.focus.com...



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:31 PM
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I think some things should not be for-profit.

Education is one of them. When the almighty dollar bill is more important then the students, and their education, I consider it a racket.

The few times i have considered going for a degree, ended without me pursing it because the market went into such that it would have been a saddling of burden without a way to pay the debts back.

As with most things in the world, it's great in theory, but in practice, it fails miserably.

Whats interesting, where my wife works, at a hospital, most of the nurses make the statement "I'm not here for anything other then a paycheck, if the patients live or die, it's not my concern".

So if that is any indication...



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:37 PM
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Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
I like to contribute with this valuable link.
www.focus.com...


Very good website. I'm glad to be a professional student. Everyone on this site could do it too...trust me, conspiracy theorists types (like you all and me) are SOOOOOOOO MUCH smarter than the non-conspiracy theorist types (trust me, I'm in a class of about 160 and as far as I know, my best friend and I are the only CTists), and none of the others are as smart as us. We should take over in the realm of academics.

[edit on 20-5-2010 by BenIndaSun]



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:39 PM
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reply to post by BenIndaSun
 


I agree with you so much! Also I'm probably the only person who enjoys to read about history in my city.



posted on May, 20 2010 @ 06:57 PM
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I am from the netherlands. Our school system is a bit different then the american system.

I got my HAVO Diploma when I was 18.

At that time I recented the system, but not any more. I have a better view of why it was what it was and can live in far greater acceptance now.

Regardless.

Through oculair disabilities I am not fit for work, going by the criteria. So I get a "weijong" ( a form of benefit/welfare. )

I am very happy I am not materialistic and balanced. Now I do not work and I do not follow coventional education. I live my live in freedom of these things. Free to pursue my own development any way I want. NO DEBT, NO WORK, NO TUITION, NO MUST. only choiche.

Have a happy life.
Good day



[edit on 20-5-2010 by GamleGamle]



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 08:24 AM
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Originally posted by GamleGamle
Through oculair disabilities I am not fit for work, going by the criteria. So I get a "weijong" ( a form of benefit/welfare. )

I am very happy I am not materialistic and balanced. Now I do not work and I do not follow coventional education. I live my live in freedom of these things. Free to pursue my own development any way I want. NO DEBT, NO WORK, NO TUITION, NO MUST. only choiche.

Have a happy life.
Good day


To be fair, if I was "unfit for work" and received welfare payments I'm certain I could find a way to be happy in life same as you. But I actually enjoy the feeling of accomplishment that comes from hard work and the yearing for education. It's just a difference of approach. I'm glad you're happy ...



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 10:25 AM
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reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Thank you.

I do have the same kind of feelings towards acomplishment, but for me acomplishment has gotten a whole different meaning. My acomplishments are far more personal, spiritual a kind of wordless understanding and appreciation of what is.

For work and study.

Their is nothing wrong with a day of good hard work.
Their is nothing wrong with studying to be better, more productive and capable.

These things are great, but twisted man with twisted systems make the above things just as twisted.

Therefore I am my own study and my living space is my work space.
Money is a proxy that is easily manipulated. Therefore I like to see my acomplishments manifest in tanigable change and improvement. Preferably circumventing money.

Anyways even though people are from different walks of life. We are all still very much the same. We just express ourselves differently.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 10:36 AM
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A diploma or a degree? A diploma is from high school, a degree from college. My opinion is that Diploma is worth alot - it shows that you have completed the minimum educational expectations adopted by society. A degree... not so much! I have 3 of them and they are all worthless, although they cost me a total of $93,000 to obtain and that was 20 years ago! But degrees do demonstrate to the corporate class that you are good at conforming, following instructions and capable of being easily indoctrinated - and that means ALOT to those folks. Its how they keep this broken machine running.



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