Judge questions weight of evidence in Hutaree case

Judge questions weight of evidence in Hutaree case

www.detnews.com

Detroit -- A federal judge on Wednesday expressed strong reservations about the weight of the evidence against nine militia members accused of plotting to wage war against the United States.
But a federal prosecutor said the government can't always wait until a plot is carried out to charge those involved and asked the judge to consider how much better things would be if federal agents had been able to arrest Timothy McVeigh before he blew up the federal building in Oklahoma City, killing 168

(visit the link for the full news article)

It appears that the judge may not be convinced that the federal prosecutors have enough evidence to justify holding those arrested without bond.

It will be interesting to see how Judge Roberts rules on this bond appeal hearing.

Another interesting tidbit from the defense was concerning the subject of explosives...

The Hutaree members also face charges of attempted use of a weapon of mass destruction. But defense lawyers have noted no bombs were among the large amounts of weapons and ammunition seized from defendants and said the only explosives set off at Hutaree training exercises were supplied and detonated by an undercover FBI agent who infiltrated the group.

Personally I don't like the way the prosecutors are comparing these suspects to Timothy McVeigh, seems a little too sensationalist to me in light of the fact they are having a hard time convincing this federal judge that they have the goods for the sedition charge.

stay tuned



www.detnews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

The Feds already got what they wanted, an American "Christian terrorist" group in our back yard! Oh My! This was plastered all over the news, but you wont see it retracted if these people are indeed found to be innocent.

-E-

Originally posted by MysterE
The Feds already got what they wanted...

Exactly!

It's kind of disgusting that the case was even brought if even the Judge is confused. And wasn't the case built on an "informant".

If people want to run around and act stupid with guns. Whatever.

I tried to give the government a fair shake here...I know they are looking to demonize a new group, and this one allowed for internet forum users to be lumped in. After all, Joe Stack and the Pentagon shooter guy were fresh on people's mind. But I still had the overall idea that yea these guys at least were VERY serious about attempting this.

But after this, after seeing a Judge question things, I feel I am not being a paranoid conspiracy theorist. At the very least, the prosecution thought this would be an open and shut case. I guess they don't have the public support they thought they would...

reply to post by MysterE


Yup. Even if theyre let go and all of these charges are bunk the public will never know. The news they wanted was front page headlines for days. The retractions/vindication will be a blurb on page 10 in between ad space.

How many people know the outcome of Rand Weaver's lawsuit or the final charges he faced? But everyone knows about the crazy white supremacist on the hill who's nutty world view got his kid and wife killed.

They've been convicted in the court of public opinion, the real trial only matters to those charged. Reading the threads on ATS is enough to show how many have already been swayed.

reply to post by JacKatMtn


Wait so are they saying that thinking or saying you hate the government and want to see it destroyed is a crime now????? Man oh man how fast this country has fallen... Does anyone know what evidence they actually have against this group?

No matter how this trial actually ends up, the government has already won this battle with the public. It was all over the MSM. Chanting about domestic terrorists and nationwide murder plans, enough weaponry to stock a small country, etc.

That's all the general public will remember about this.

They will remember the week that the government warned: "Domestic terrorism is at an all-time high, but don't worry, we're on the job....."

Then, sure enough, a week later they managed to locate our very own terror cell, right here in the US!

As a final note, I find it pretty scary that ultimately this Federal Prosecutor is trying to use preemptive guilt to continue to detain these men. Well, they would have done something had we not stopped them....

As you can see by my join up date, I was spurred by the media's handling of this very situation to post on ATS, after many years of lurking about.
Since then, I've seen people called " treasonous rednecks and drunken hillbilly traitors" for even daring to question the meaning of the 2nd amendment. I'll have to accept the hillbilly and redneck labels, but the right wing militant label was laughable, especially to those who know me.
It as if I'm witnessing the beginnings of a huge fascist movement (pardon the likely incorrect usage of the term).
Between the militias and the illegal aliens, this "enemy within" thing has turned into a tidal wave.

reply to post by 23refugee

Between the militias and the illegal aliens, this "enemy within" thing has turned into a tidal wave.

Don't forget "anti-governement" protestors, conspiracy theorists, et al. Just look at what the Illinois democratic representatives want the governor to do ,help fight crime in Chicago. I have a bad feeling about where all of this is heading.

[edit on 29-4-2010 by djvexd]

reply to post by djvexd


This new-found need to have a boot on your throat to feel secure is really quite disturbing.

[edit on 29-4-2010 by 23refugee]

reply to post by poedxsoldiervet


I am not sure what or how much evidence has been presented being this is just an appeal on the bond issue..

The troubling issue, which has been touched on by the members is the media tying this group in with all militia, trying to lump them all in one evil basket in the public eye..

Neverminding the fact that a few of the militias actually distanced themselves from this groups aims, and if I remember correctly, one of the militias played a role in apprehending one of the suspects.

Add to that the ADL adding the members of ATS, and other websites to this ever growing pile of folks that all of a sudden fall under the umbrella of homegrown extremists? coincidence? check out what's getting ready to happen in Washington DC very soon...

pr-usa.net...


Just what do these folks (govt) have in mind for us?

Finally, we have a democratic judge, appointed by Clinton, and actually doing her job!

Amazing!

All of those posting anti-fed commentary here are terrorists, subject to any investigation by the FBI, Secret Service and other agencies.

If you are found to be a threat to the federal government a case will be built against you and when ultimately found guilty you will spend a very long time in a federal prison.

Freedom isn't free, you must earn your rights and freedom from the federal government, pay your taxes and always express the highest level of respect and obedience to your federal government.

reply to post by Fractured.Facade


If I promise to be a brown nose may I have a brown shirt?

An update of sorts No decision has been made on the bond appeal, but wanted this article in here for posterity:

www.detnews.com

Detroit -- There was still no word this morning on whether any of the nine accused Hutaree militia members will be granted bond.
Alleged leader David Stone Sr. and eight followers were arrested in a series of raids that started March 27. A grand jury indictment unsealed March 29 charges them with seditious conspiracy and attempted use of weapons of mass destruction.
Prosecutors say the Lenawee County-based group was planning to kill a police officer and then use bombs to attack the scores of officers drawn to the slain officer's funeral. The group hoped the killing would spark a general uprising against the government, prosecutors allege.

Several things:
1) I just heard on fox news that Hutaree will be released on bond, that it can not be denied.
2) From what I can tell, what the judge is questioning is the evidence, as it does not match the charges that the prosecution is putting against the defendants.
My understanding of criminal law is that inorder for them to be held without bond, the charges would have to not only be very serious, but the evidence has to support the crime and there would have to be a flight risk on the part of the accused. Something tells me that the federal government ended up not only moving too soon, but lack the evidence for their case. The other question will be if this does go to trial, how much of a fight over the jury it will be, as they would have to get one.
Something in the back of my mind also tells me that none of the people accused are cooperating with the federal officials at all, remaining silent and demanding lawyers.