Westboro Baptist Church--Religious Extremism At It's Finest.

I've been reading up on this cult for a little bit now. It was only brought to my attention recently how ridiculous these people are and how people who are against religion can use them as an argument.

And it would be a pretty damn good one at that.

I want to preface this thread with saying that I do NOT equate all religious folk to those of the WBC, this is an extreme example, however there are more and more of these "fundies" showing up and robbing people of their faith.

Faith is a GOOD thing, regardless of what your views on religion are. Myself have not been blessed with faith, I'm a Spiritual Agnostic.

Enough about that however, down to the meat and potatoes. Let's see what Wikipedia had to say about the WBC.

The Westboro Baptist Church (WBC) is an Independent Baptist church and hate group known for its hatred of homosexuals.[1][2][3] It is headed by Fred Phelps and located in Topeka, Kansas, United States. Its first public service was held on the afternoon of Sunday, November 27, 1955.[4]

The WBC is not affiliated with any known Baptist conventions or associations. The church describes itself as following Primitive Baptist and Calvinist principles, though mainstream Primitive Baptists reject the WBC and Phelps.[5]

The group is best known for its protest activities, which include picketing funerals and desecration of the American flag.[6]

Right off the bat, it's listed as a HATE group.

Most of you will think I wrote this in response to their view of the Gay Community, this is not the case. Although I am appalled at what I have read about them, it is the following behaviour that strikes a real cord with me.

Funeral pickets
The group came into the national spotlight in 1998, when they were featured on CNN for picketing the funeral of Matthew Shepard, a young man from Wyoming who was beaten to death by two men because of his homosexuality.[24] Westboro has protested at the funerals of people ranging from Fred Rogers[25] to Coretta Scott King to Jerry Falwell.

In July 2005 the Westboro Baptist Church declared its intention to picket the memorial service of Carrie French in Boise, Idaho. French, 19, was killed on June 5 in Kirkuk, Iraq, where she served as an ammunition specialist with the 116th Brigade Combat Team's 145th Support Battalion. Phelps Sr. was quoted as saying, "Our attitude toward what's happening with the war is [that] the Lord is punishing this evil nation for abandoning all moral imperatives that are worth a dime."[26]

In August 2005, a group from the church protested at the funeral of Edward Myers, a soldier from St. Joseph, Missouri, who died in Iraq. Shirley Phelps-Roper told a television reporter that Myers was "burning in Hell."[27]

On February 2, 2008, the group picketed during the funeral of former LDS Church president Gordon B. Hinckley in Salt Lake City, Utah, displaying picket signs criticizing him for being a "lying false prophet" and "leading millions of people astray." The organization also criticized Hinckley for being too accepting of gay people, accusing him of having an ambiguous voice about homosexuality rather than taking a firm stand against it.[28] Police had difficulty determining whether the demonstration met the guidelines of protected free speech."[29]

On April 10, 2008, Westboro picketed the funerals of three students who were killed in a house fire at the University of Wisconsin–Stout in Menomonie, Wisconsin. Around 1,000 students showed up and drove off the protesters after fifteen minutes.[30]

In August 2008, Westboro announced plans to protest in Winnipeg, Canada at the funeral of Tim McLean, who had been murdered on a Greyhound Canada bus.[31] While a small number of Church members succeeded in crossing the border despite orders to prevent them from entering Canada, they did not appear at the funeral.[32]

In February 2009, the group protested at the funeral of a plane crash victim. Students from the nearby University at Buffalo and the Buffalo area held a peaceful counter protest, holding up white sheets to shield the victim's family from the Phelpses. A motorcycle brigade, known as the Patriot Guard Riders, is known for revving its engines to drown out the Phelpses.[33]

Westboro picketed the funeral of recording artist Michael Jackson after his unexpected death on June 25, 2009.[citation needed] Members of the Westboro Baptist Church have also recorded a song titled "God Hates the World", an adaptation of Jackson's charity single "We Are the World."[34]

Funeral Picketing? Men of GOD! Picketing dead men, slandering their names for going to war to protect their country.

Blaming natural disasters on nothing else but homosexuality. Ok so I am gonna speak about that bit, just cause it's so damn entertaining. I can't really believe people would act like this.

I won't list the website cause the term used is against the T&C, but you can fill in the blank.

God Hates [Snip].com

EVERYTHING this church does is in the name of God. Would your god treat human beings this way? Simply for being "sinners"?

I'm a proponent of freedom of speech. I believe that even the people we do not agree with have a right to voice their opinion.

But where is the line? Where does speech become hate? Will it take an instance of mass violence for people to realize that this sort of behaviour is just wrong?

We see the government removing our rights everyday and as of late trying to paint those who are "extremists" as Domestic Terrorists. I would consider the WBC as part of that group far more than any "anti-government" group is.

Their god will judge them when the time comes, in the meantime, what are your thoughts ATS?

Sources

~Keeper

reply to post by tothetenthpower


These people are a negative influence on this planet...they are the procuring cause to militant extremism within religion, as far as, the Christian religion goes. This sickens to me to go to their website and see their hateful slogans and pickets that they do. Ill becoming of man this is.....

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Where does speech become hate?

Any speech that encourages illegal violence against another person or group because of their skin color, religion, sexual preference and on and on is hate speech and is illegal. These guys are listed as a hate group right along the side of the KKK

Will it take an instance of mass violence for people to realize that this sort of behaviour is just wrong?

I do not think many people agree with that behavior, you have the people that show up to picket funerals but other than that i do not think they get great public support. Their biggest advertisers are their critics, the only time i have been told about their site or shown a link was always in the context of "these guys are so freakin dumb check it out".

[edit on 12-4-2010 by zaiger]

reply to post by bushidomason


I agree, they are a stain on the face of religion and those true Christians who do gook work every day.

~Keeper

reply to post by tothetenthpower


The name church is just thrown in there in attempt to hide their intentions. Kind of like the KKK today promotes its self as just being a bunch of freedom loving patriots, how white power became white pride and ever notice communits countries call themselves republics? another example is the Disciples of Christ, sounds like a good christian group but inreality they are neo-nazi skin heads.
www.adl.org...

Funeral Picketing?

You guys wanted freedom....you got it

lines

I've seen this group a few times on the news when they have shown up at military funerals. Just within the last week or so a father who's son was killed, in one of the wars we find ourselves in, lost a court case against the group that protected their right to free speech. Win or lose, it's just plain wrong and revolting.

Actually, it looks like the case is getting bumped up to the Supreme Court. Could get interesting. www.baltimoresun.com...

But as "they" say, even the hopelessly insane can have moments of clarity.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower

On February 2, 2008, the group picketed during the funeral of former LDS Church president Gordon B. Hinckley in Salt Lake City, Utah, displaying picket signs criticizing him for being a "lying false prophet" and "leading millions of people astray."

[edit on 12-4-2010 by zlots331]

I suppose that they have the ability to excuse their sins against those they abuse.

Sad really, because I recall that somewhere in the Bible is says:

"Let Him that is without sin cast the first stone"....

Perhaps they are perfect and without sin. Perhaps their hate and abusive behaviour is not really a bad thing after all. Perhaps we can now act the same way toward them.

Okay, I'm going to turn off the sarcasm now.

I actually believe that these people are living up to a fairely accurate interpretation of the Bible. And of god.

Which is why I am an atheist.

reply to post by Ismail


That reminds me of the sign I saw someone counter protesting with. It read "I don't care what your imaginary friend thinks of me."

[edit on 12-4-2010 by janon]

Most of you here are aware of my Christian viewpoint,and I want to go on the record as saying that this group is an embarrassment and does not represent the Spirit of Christ.

What they did at that funeral is reprehensible,atrocious,and gives "Christians" a bad name.

Let God judge them accordingly.

reply to post by Ismail


WELL SAID!

I can just imagine how many posts will pop up containing the "they are different and not REAL Christians" and "they give us real Christians a bad name" garbage.

I believe this type of sick behavior is destined for ALL CULT MEMBERS of this and ANY of the Abrahamic faiths which are all violent and discriminative religions. Its just a MATTER OF TIME until the members of these DESPICABLE cults act out the hate and prejudices of these garbage religions.




[edit on 12-4-2010 by SunIsSon]

Romans 12:19-21

"Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord.” To the contrary, “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals on his head.” Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good."

Too bad some folks have such a poor understanding of true Christianity.

(The "burning coals" are not literal,of course!)

There are churches like this all across the south. They are just not as outspoken in public. They blame bad events on gays, interracial marriage, democrats, the homeless, etc, They project a caring and loving personality until you catch them off guard.

I appreciate the fact Westboro are up front instead of quiet people that try to subvert the workplace and such while pretending to be nice. I would rather the public see the hatred upfront instead of hiding it and giving vague hints and innuendo.

You must remember also that Falwell himself said this but, backpedaled.

""I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America. I point the finger in their face and say 'you helped this happen.'" -Jerry Falwell on 9/11

"I would warn Orlando that you're right in the way of some serious hurricanes, and I don't think I'd be waving those flags in God's face if I were you, This is not a message of hate -- this is a message of redemption. But a condition like this will bring about the destruction of your nation. It'll bring about terrorist bombs; it'll bring earthquakes, tornadoes, and possibly a meteor." –Pat Robertson, on "gay days" at Disneyworld

One of my greatest surprises was this churchy lady that came into a former job and tried for two years to get me fired while giving me a hug every morning until I found out what she was doing. She was telling the managers, "You can't trust a f__! ". All the while she was lying about my work performance, hiding my work, or just making unfounded accusations.

When I confronted her in front of the managers regarding this she said Jesus commissioned her to run me and all like me out of town and was even told this, "We used to stone you but, now we offer you the love of Jesus!" I will not discuss the case but, I was doing her job the next week.

Yes, God bless you too you crazy old bat! Anyway, it is the old message of fear mongering that we've always heard. It is only turned up a notch and upfront without hypocrite smiles.

[edit on 12/4/10 by toochaos4u]

WBC is possibly even desecrating our flag. If you go to their website and after their page loads, you will see their page icon next to the url address. It is an upside down American flag. According to www.usflag.org, and my interpretation, they are breaking etiquette/law regarding our flag.

Flag Etiquette

Is it okay to display the flag upside down to protest the direction of government, the economy, the war, high crime rates, your bar's liquor license, etc.?

A truly horrendous organization that disguises itself as a "church". Westboro Baptist Cult sounds more accurate.

I imagine now some Christians here know how Muslims feel when people say: all Muslims are no good because of the few terrorists amonsgt them . . .when lunatics claim they are Christians do things lik ethis group, and then disbelievers put you all in the same boat.

These people obviously would conjure up versus in the Bible to justify their lunacy and then some of the secular disbelievers want to lump all Christian in one boat. Religion . . . it’s all bad, they say.

Of course that’s absurd and has no basis in reality.

I keep telling people here that sectarian, fundamentalist, literalist religion can often lead to abortion killings, terrorism, and sects like this. But to lump all of religious people in one lot is the height of ignorance.

Would one say all Germans are bad because of Hitler?