Fundamentalist Christians are yelling that the end times are inbound and America may have a president bent on making it a reality.

Now I, as a pagan, see this as one of the biggest loads of crap to be dumped upon humanity in a long time, but many profess that it is true.

I see the truely scary thing in the how the newest fad faiths have become increasingly violent, divergent, and confrontational. Radical Islam and Fundamentalist Christianity are already butting their thick heads in Iraq, causing untold suffering on both sides. All I believe we would need to see the United States and the Middle East spiral into an abyss of terror and destruction, like Israel and Palestine seem hell bent on falling into, would be an American bomb hitting a mosque full of worshipers, or a revolution in Saudi Arabia.

The conspiracy comes here: I sometimes wonder if the leaders of these violent offshoots of western religion really realize how perverse their teachings have become and are just interested in bloodshed?

Has anger, terror, hatred and nationalism once again pushed the world to the brink of a conflict large enough to envelope it?

And finally, the "new fundamentalist Christian awakening" in America, is it a reaction to the war, or is it just being used as an oppertunity to exploit the faith of America and couple it with the anger over the terror attacks to forge a scociety where a crusade-like war could take place?

I'm not saying that any of this is proven true, but it's all a bit to much to just dismiss.

May peace prevail
~Astral

If anyone is starting religious wars or crusades its the extremist muslims. I could careless for anyone that uses religion as an excuse to kill someone. I say mass genocide is in order.

"Mass genocide"? Please tell me you're not serious. Because I can tell you there are fundamentalists and extremists on both sides, and when it comes to these extremists, neither side has the monopoly of blindness and stupidity.

I think this "mass-genocide" comment just goes to prove that there really is an U.S. vs THEM attitude out there among some.

I wonder what the point of "killing to stop killing" is except self preservation in this sense. Have we really come so far that society and politics have become kill or be killed?

I do believe that there is still a chance to walk as brothers and sisters in the light for humanity, but first the sheep must start to realize that their shepard (hint, common metaphor for western God) valued peace, love and forgiveness above all else.

I refuse to believe that humanity is beyond redemption, not yet at least.

~Astral

Originally posted by The Astral City
I think this "mass-genocide" comment just goes to prove that there really is an U.S. vs THEM attitude out there among some.

I wonder what the point of "killing to stop killing" is except self preservation in this sense. Have we really come so far that society and politics have become kill or be killed?

I do believe that there is still a chance to walk as brothers and sisters in the light for humanity, but first the sheep must start to realize that their shepard (hint, common metaphor for western God) valued peace, love and forgiveness above all else.

I refuse to believe that humanity is beyond redemption, not yet at least.

~Astral

the human race as a whole has gone beyond redemption. sure a few good individual is nice and fuzzy, but the rest of the world is bent on greed and destruction.

it doesn't take a God to make us walk in peace and harmony. buddist live in harmony because they figure out how to live, how to cope with our true nature

(speaking as another pagan, here...)

I think we'll see end-times/religious/millennial hysteria until mid 2013 or so. I hope it won't end in tragedy.

I think it's up to us to start by fostering a spirit of appreciation for and tolerance for diversity. Heaven knows the extremists aren't going to do it, but if the rest of us unite then they can't take over. Remember, they are a minority.

Yes, it is scary how much hatred is being propagated by the mainstream religions these days, and how much a foothold religion has taken in the political arena. Here in the U.S. we have a President who believes God tells him what to do and who meets with fundamentalists to determine world policy. In the Middle East clerics hold positions of political power and impose their particular interpretations of their holy books upon everyone else in the country. The Catholic Church is repeating the errors of the Middle Ages by commanding its priests to withhold communion from those who hold certain political views.

What really upset me is when Falwell & Co. used the tragedy of 9/11 to spread more hatred and division by condemning everyone except fundamentalist Christians for what happened. At a time when the nation -- and the world -- was expressing unity and consolation, the Religious Right chose to fan the flames. (Oh, and in case anyone missed it, he never did apologize to the pagans, though his nominal apology was so insincere it didn't really count anyway.)

Are we starting to relive the worst parts of the Middle Ages, or is it backlash from all the Millennial fever? It's like people WANTED the world to end, and are determined to make it happen anyway. I saw on the news that Israel had caught American Christians who were plotting to blow up the Mosque around New Year's 2000, and now they're all salivating because the Temple wall is crumbling. There's another guy drilling for oil in the Dead Sea because it's supposed to be another sign of the End Times. I've personally heard a fundamentalist preacher saying that it's ok the Earth, oceans and skies are filling with poison, as Jesus is coming to give them a new world!

I remember reading in my Bible that it's actually forbidden to try and make prophecy come to pass. This would certainly include Revelations, IMHO. So, by their own canon, those Christians trying to bring about Armageddon are damned in the eyes of their God.

It's sad, really. I'm pagan too, and while I abandoned mainstream religion after considerable research and soul-searching, I acknowledge it's not my place to judge the validity of another's faith. However, it's impossible to overlook the expressions of hatred, intolerance and hostility carried out every day by those who call themselves "saved" or "chosen". Islamic, Christian or otherwise, those who call for genocide, mass murder or torture (as well as suppression of women's rights and the teaching/exchange of social & scientific information) are nothing but sociopathic fanatics. They do more damage to their chosen faith than any unbeliever.

I'd have to say that I agree with my fellow pagans and their responses here, but it does lead me to another question:

Are we reaching the end of Western Religion's domination of the world? The most populated countries on the planet now are Buddist and Hindu and America's power is slipping to them. I give China 20 years before they eclipse the US's power. I wonder if the ancient religions will once again come back.

Also I have a question for my fellow peacemakers as well:

From what I've seen we seem to think simmilarly about the direction of our world, and I for one believe that it can be changed if only we knew how. So I am quite open to ideas as to how the conflicts can still be averted?

~Astral