Originally posted by gameisupman
Maybe those "armchair debunkers" as you like to broadly paint them in order to belittle their posts and make yourself feel all high and mighty (but
ultimately makes you look like a stereotypical ufo enthusiast) don't see the serious added value exploring things like this that are so old, and new
information isn't worth it's salt other than to feed some dough eyed believers religious like fantasy about UFOS.... But I do understand your desire
to explore old crap that can't really be looked into any more... allowing you to continue your fantastical beliefs. Makes sense. If you wasted your
time with more modern sightings... you would be depressed and give up, because the modern state of "ufology" is a joke. By living in the past you
are trying to distance yourself from this joke any way you can...[etc]
Wow. See what happens to a "true denier" in the face of actual evidence, much of it decades old, regarding a case which has resisted debunking for
40 years? (Sure, let's pretend Menzel and Klass didn't try... haha.) But isn't it interesting that a skeptic would get so angry by mere
presentation of evidence? Let's think about this.
We all understand the UFO witness / believer's routine frustration with debunkers. It makes perfect sense within the big picture of the UFO
phenomenon, where witnesses have been ridiculed by so-called 'skeptics' for decades. (Though no true skeptic thinks the UFO phenomenon is 100%
ridiculous -- perhaps 95%! -- and no true skeptic would be ridiculing anyone who gives weight to this particular case. It's an impressive,
multi-witness radar-visual one, and even a skeptic should admit "not so easy to dismiss.")
But for a skeptic to get as nasty as 'gameisupman' has gotten here.... what explains that? It's not as if UFO believers have been poking and
prodding the skeptics for two generations now, with the apparent weight of "science" and skepticism on their side. It's been the other direction.
So that doesn't explain it.
I think maybe what we see here is evidence of why some individuals literally CANNOT allow themselves to even admit the possibility of "real" UFOs.
Maybe the above poster is being forced to question his religious beliefs? Maybe it's just scary? Maybe the possibility of real UFOs challenges the
very natural assumptions we've all mostly carried -- that this is "our planet", we're top dog, are in complete control of our destiny, and its.
(Not new ideas, i know.)
But TRULY accepting even the possibility of UFOs (and i say this with no sarcasm) forces one to deal with some difficult issues. So I try not to be
too hard on 'skeptics' with SUCH extreme reactions to evidence, as above. A nerve has been hit. And let's face it, even respectable, mainstream
science itself is not immune to this bias against confronting our human assumptions. Because we all remember the following (most telling!) part of the
Trick Memo, no? (For newer members, this was written by the Project Coordinator of the Condon Report -- science's supposed "final word" on the UFO
topic -- in a memo summarizing (among other things) why several science team members didn't think U. Colorado should accept the USAF contract.) Here
"[The scientists'] argument runs like this: in order to undertake such a project one has to approach it objectively. That is, one has to admit the
possibility that such things as UFOs exist. It is not respectable to give serious consideration to such possibility. Believers, in other words, remain
outcasts. Branscomb suggested that one would have to go so far as to consider the possibility that saucers, if some of the observations are verified,
behave according to a set of physical laws unknown to us. The simple fact of admitting these possibilities puts us beyond the pale, and we would lose
more in prestige in the scientific community than we could possibly gain...."
Pretty enlightening, no? These were very smart,'"skeptical" men -- our best and brightest, the scientists, advocates of truth, right? Yet behind
closed doors (the memo was leaked, not supposed to be public) these scientists were admitting they couldn't even be objective about this issue...
couldn't even TRULY consider the most obvious hypothesis as legitimate. (Have to "go so far as to consider the possibility...."?)
Beyond what that all says about the Condon Report's objectivity -- any positive UFO findings in that scientific atmosphere would be impressive,
right, and yet there they are, in the BODY of the report, ignored in Condon's conclusions -- the point is, if our best and brightest scientists
can't be reliably objective about UFOs, can't bring themselves to actually consider the ET hypothesis a valid one, then what can we really expect of
the casual ATS skeptic?
UFOs challenge world-views. (Again, not a new observation!) But it's rare to see the effects erupt so forcefully, like above. So go easy on
'gameisupman'. He's dealing with some tough stuff!