For discussion: are we god?

Have we all been self-existent beings, making us "god"? If so, did we create this reality as a game or is there a greater purpose to it? Or, is there a distinct entity that created us and the universe, and that entity alone is self-existent? If that is the case, are we just pawns in that entity's game or is this a prison in which we are being punished by some superior being?



[edit on 22-2-2010 by Visiting ESB]

I think that everything there is... is essentially God. Us.. the water, the sun, the universe and beyond; Everything that has been created is essentially God.

Emotions and classifications are simply human creations... In true reality, all just simply is.

God could possibly be a separate entity, however God's touch and essence is in everything.

To understand God's true nature and existence from our perspective, would be like a kindergartner trying to do university level calculus.

I'd postulate that if we are all one, then we are God. The problem with the split consciousness theory, is that we perceive the "I." Our consciousness, while it has unique memories from lifetimes, is part of an endless "data stream" of experiences, memories, and thought. This is what Christians call "heaven." A place, where thoughts become reality. When you enter heaven, it is what you want it to be, though to another consciousness, they may see it (and your thoughts) differently. It's interesting to debate, and I'd be interested to hear some counter arguments to this one.

God created the universe in order to have companionship with autonomious self thinking free entities. (you) Freedom gives you the right to live contrary to your creator. (God) However, there are consequences to living contrary to your Creator. (the fall) Life as you know it is corrupt and depraved along with you and me. We are still free and autonomious but with a natural bend towards disobidence to the Creator. Christ came to take the punishment, restoring in you the purpose for which you were created. Now by the Holy Spirit you are still free and autonomious, but are now bent towards living in agreement with the Creator. This is only temporary. One day after all autonomious beings have had there chance to chose. God will punish the disobident and reward the faithful. (Heaven and Hell) The Creator only desires fellowship with those that freely chose Him. This is why Hell is eternal. Seek to be saved from wrong choices and be forever in fellowship with the one that created you.

reply to post by DocEmrick


ah but you are OF your mother and father and yet you are not your father or your mother

see the logic in that, being of something doesnt make you it, per se

its hard for me to put it in words at the moment, hmm ill think it out and try again later

im at work, ha

Originally posted by trueperspective
God created the universe in order to have companionship with autonomious self thinking free entities. (you) Freedom gives you the right to live contrary to your creator. (God) However, there are consequences to living contrary to your Creator. (the fall) Life as you know it is corrupt and depraved along with you and me. We are still free and autonomious but with a natural bend towards disobidence to the Creator. Christ came to take the punishment, restoring in you the purpose for which you were created. Now by the Holy Spirit you are still free and autonomious, but are now bent towards living in agreement with the Creator. This is only temporary. One day after all autonomious beings have had there chance to chose. God will punish the disobident and reward the faithful. (Heaven and Hell) The Creator only desires fellowship with those that freely chose Him. This is why Hell is eternal. Seek to be saved from wrong choices and be forever in fellowship with the one that created you.

That's all according to the bible. And that's also according to your god.
What about other religions then?

MY belief is this (and I'm actually para-phrasing this from another ATS member):

God is the Universe. We are all part of the Universe, thus we are all God.

I don't believe for one second that the supreme creator is Jehova from the bible. If that's all really true, then damn... Haha. We have a little child running the Universe.

No thanks.

reply to post by Visiting ESB


Gnostic Christ..."The Kingdom of God is inside you and all around you, not in these mansions made of wood and stone, lift and stone and I am there, split a piece of wood and you will find me."

"If you bring forth what is within you, what is within you will save you. If you do not bring forth what is within you, what is within you will destroy you."

So yea, I think we are all creators .. i.e. God. Masons know that already though.

I'm going to say that you are whatever you are programed to be. In this society we are programmed to be basically slaves. We are gods, that have been programmed to not know it. You can reprogram yourself at anytime, but this is most easily done in the early years.

reply to post by impaired


You have just proven that what I say is true. You have excercised your free will in rebellion to God. You have exchanged the truth for a lie. If you seek the truth earnestly you will find it. I just prayed for you.

Originally posted by trueperspective
reply to post by impaired

 

You have just proven that what I say is true. You have excercised your free will in rebellion to God. You have exchanged the truth for a lie. If you seek the truth earnestly you will find it. I just prayed for you.

I'm sorry Mr. perspective.
I'm in need of some proof, for your claim of proof.


Rules you come up with do not count for a not believer.

I am a believer by the way.
If there happens to be no god at all. Your wrong you know.

In my understanding, we are the awareness behind all of our experiences. That perfect Awareness or Consciousness is the seat of our being and our so called egoself which is impermanent will eventually merged with this Perfect Awareness.
As mentioned in the Upanishad :
-That which makes the tongue speak but cannot be Spoken by the tongue, know that as the Self. This Self is not someone other than you.
- That which makes the mind think but cannot be Thought by the mind, that is the Self indeed. This Self is not someone other than you.
- That which makes the Eyes see but cannot be seen by the eye, that is the Self indeed. This Self is not someone other than you.
- That which makes the Ear hear but cannot be Heard by the Ear, that is the Self indeed. This Self is not someone other than you.
- That which makes you draw breath but cannot be Drawn by your Breath, that is the Self indeed. This Self is not someone other than you.

Originally posted by MurderCityDevil
reply to post by DocEmrick

 

ah but you are OF your mother and father and yet you are not your father or your mother

see the logic in that, being of something doesnt make you it, per se

its hard for me to put it in words at the moment, hmm ill think it out and try again later

im at work, ha

Biologically yes, but that doesn't explain what I was describing with consciousness.

Originally posted by trueperspective
reply to post by impaired

 

You have just proven that what I say is true. You have excercised your free will in rebellion to God. You have exchanged the truth for a lie. If you seek the truth earnestly you will find it. I just prayed for you.

I'm scared.
Dude. I believe in GOD, just not yours
Your god is absolutely insane, and I would never give my energy or prayers to that murderer.
My God is the Universe - you, me, the chair you're sitting on, etc...

But I'm still going to hell, huh?

Nice try on the scare tactics, and nice try in making me feel bad when you said "I'll pray for you".

Desperate for recruitment? It may work for others, but it will not work for me.

But I'll pray to the Universe for you.

Scriptures of religions require interpretation by definition of terms,
the so-called "word" GOD fails to bear the truth of the real word it translates,
if you're wise to know to understand then you'd have the insight not to question but tell,
that yes we are ultimately gods but we shall die as humanity -and those 'others' won't be anymore at all.

[edit on 2010/2/22 by YeHUaH ELaHaYNU]

I wanna share a phrase that I kind of came up with (well, conjected), in regards to all of this:

We are infinite by default, and we incarnate into biological entities to experience the FINITE.

There it is - in a nutshell.

reply to post by impaired


That is our Destiny -the Fate of the EBE's was to assume it.

trueperspective, that's quite a presumptuous handle, no? Isn't it written in your beloved psalms that David begged the LORD to deliver and keep him from presumption? He did that because when you're coming from the base assumption of being a "chosen" or special people, that is THE trap that will get you. And as you see from the OT history of Israel, that's exactly what happened. But, to the subject at hand:

Originally by trueperspective
God created the universe in order to have companionship with autonomious self thinking free entities. (you) Freedom gives you the right to live contrary to your creator. (God) However, there are consequences to living contrary to your Creator. (the fall)

OK so far, except that no one can actually live contrary to the Creator, only contrary to their own best interests. The Creator is served whether good or ill transpire. Our "freedom" boils down to a choice of whether or not to accept the truth that God is in benevolent control. I.e. there IS no pointless suffering in the world. The great delusion common to mankind is just this: "I am in charge of my life." The second delusion serves to cement the power of the first: "God allows pointless suffering."

Life as you know it is corrupt and depraved along with you and me.

Sorry, pal, there you went off the rez. That's a purely human teaching created for the purpose of coercive control of the masses.

We are still free and autonomious but with a natural bend towards disobidence to the Creator.

how convenient, blame nature instead of the real culprit: Ego! Ego is the Great Satan that we all face, not some 'fallen angel' that most Christians (secretly) believe to be more powerful than God.

Christ came to take the punishment, restoring in you the purpose for which you were created.

Another dodge by the religious right. "someone else can pay". No, you have to pay all your own debts. No one else can. It's only the cowardice of the Ego that causes us to want to dodge out on that one. Be a big boy and take your spanking! The good news is that when you forgive others, you are automatically forgiven. But God knows when you have forgiven... Forgiveness means to accept God's good and ordained purpose for the suffering others have caused you. It's a big step in the direction of trusting God!

Now by the Holy Spirit you are still free and autonomious, but are now bent towards living in agreement with the Creator.

Yes, I am, but it's a real stretch to assume everyone who reads this is!

This is only temporary. One day after all autonomious beings have had there chance to chose. God will punish the disobident and reward the faithful. (Heaven and Hell)

another bone the ego throws you. remain in the approval-addict loop long enough and you will be set free... except, that's not what Jesus said, is it? He said that the Truth would set you free. Accept the truth: the voice in your head that tells you it is you and gets you to do all that crappy stuff, isn't really YOU. The one true Self, the Holy Spirit, is your essence. You have thus far chosen to listen to the False Self, the Ego, the control freak that lives in each of our heads. (see clips on youtube of the film "Revolver" dealing with the ego)

The Creator only desires fellowship with those that freely chose Him. This is why Hell is eternal. Seek to be saved from wrong choices and be forever in fellowship with the one that created you.

I would say the same to you, friend, except Hell only lasts as long as you insist on living in it. (hell is being Ego's slave) But until you muster up some courage to trust the creator unconditionally, you're in the poop. There IS unlimited power available to those who wish for real fellowship with the omnipotent Creator. But you have to give something up: the ability to create a victim. see www.roage.com...

Originally posted by impaired

Originally posted by trueperspective
God created the universe in order to have companionship with autonomious self thinking free entities. [...] Seek to be saved from wrong choices and be forever in fellowship with the one that created you.

That's all according to the bible. And that's also according to your god.
What about other religions then?

MY belief is this (and I'm actually para-phrasing this from another ATS member):

God is the Universe. We are all part of the Universe, thus we are all God.

I don't believe for one second that the supreme creator is Jehova from the bible. If that's all really true, then damn... Haha. We have a little child running the Universe.

No thanks.

@Impaired
That's not even what the bible says. It is only ONE way of interpreting what it says. There are literally millions of ways to interpret it.

I would only differ with you in saying that God is the universe. I would say that God is all that is. We are not certain that this universe we inhabit, is all that is. But that's a slight difference, and i am sure totally in line with your intent.

The Jehovah of the Bible is an impostor, and a damn good one at that. It is the same ego that you and I both have to deal with as a head-pest. He has convinced everyone that he does not exist, and simultaneously that he is God and the Devil and that he is the most powerful being in the universe. The ultimate trickster. And it's not even a real being! It's just a construct, a fiction that we, God, have created for the purpose of honing our skills of observation, learning, and discovery. (see Revolver, again, for clues! Great movie, the more I watch it, I find it even better than the Matrix, which used to be my favorite until Avatar rolled out)

I love this game (existence)!!!

There's this old definition of what we really are/what god is, that I read... I think it originated in India, I forget...

Basically In the beginning god was all there was. No air/space, just god. Then a moment came where god decided it wanted to know itself better, but how can it. An eye cannot see itself after all. So god split itself up into pieces. These pieces became the universe, which became us.

So we exist to experience existence, to experience ourselves.

no

we are part of everything, thats for sure, we are connected to the rest of the universe

but

outside of this universe, there are probably a sea of universes, and outside of it, it can exist anything

but

something or someone must have created this system, I mean, its impossible if you stop to think, there must be something or someone that initiate everything

but we dont have a clue and we will never have a clue, thats for certain