Should we be seeing these Snowstorms if Global Warming was Real?

Hi all,

I would like to pose a question to all those members who are familiar with the whole Global Warming, Climate change scenario.

If we really are in the grip of either Man Made/Natural Global Warming, then why is it that we are getting random, large SnowStorms across different countries?

I have selected stories from all over, from within the last couple of years.

I understand there may be similar stories of drought and heatwave, but surely if everything was heating up, there would not be so much of this winter chaos??

Five dead as snowstorm engulfs US East Coast

Storm-related incidents claimed five lives and forecasters warned of 40mph (64km/h) winds in what may be the worst snowstorm in a decade. Snowfall is due to reach 22in overnight in the Baltimore-Washington DC area, the heaviest since 2003

news.bbc.co.uk...

Heavy snow causes travel chaos in parts of England .

Up to 20cm (8in) fell on Thursday night and many drivers had to spend the night in their cars or abandon vehicles. The AA, the UK's biggest breakdown organisation, said it had been a busy night and morning, with breakdowns coming in at a rate of 1,500 every hour.

news.bbc.co.uk...

Beijing’s Heaviest Snow in 54 Years Strands Thousands .

the heaviest snowfall in the Chinese capital in at least 54 years blanketed the city for the third day this month. China suffered an estimated 151.65 billion yuan ($22 billion) in direct economic losses almost 20 months ago when the country’s south was covered by the most severe snowstorms in five decades.

www.bloomberg.com...

Heaviest snow in 20 years brings large parts of Britain to a halt.

The heaviest snowfall in 20 years has closed thousands of schools and caused transport chaos up the eastern side of Britain, with London and the surrounding areas the hardest hit

www.timesonline.co.uk...

Las Vegas gets heaviest snow fall in 30 years .

The rare winter storm brought the Nevada city to a halt, forcing cancellations to flights and closing major highways

www.telegraph.co.uk...

Heaviest Snow in 18 Years Brings Much of Europe to a Halt.

The British capital ground to a halt on Monday after the worst snowstorm in 18 years caused hundreds of flight cancellations and virtually shut down public transportation

www.foxnews.com...

Ski resorts throughout Europe decided to open this weekend after reports suggested November had the heaviest snowfall in the last decade.

A large amount of snowfall in November has prompted some of Europe’s biggest snow resorts to open ahead of schedule this year. Ski resorts throughout Europe decided to open this weekend after reports suggested November had the heaviest snowfall in the last decade.

Ski slopes in the Alpine have experienced up to 60cm of snow, whilst the Pyrenees has had even more than that. The promising start to the ski holiday season is a welcome boost following suggestions that global warming could affect the multi-million pound business

news.directline-holidays.co.uk...

Heavy Snow Kills Dozens in Asia.

Iranian Red Crescent aid workers help motorists stuck in snow on the Zanjan-Qazvin highway northwest of Tehran.

The heaviest snowfall in the country in more than a decade has killed at least 21 people, the Associated Press reported

news.nationalgeographic.com...

There you have it. theres hundreds more stories all from within the last couple of years too. Looks like some places are getting colder and more snow, rather than getting hotter!!

g.

As much as I disagree with man mace global warming, just because we have snow falls does not mean that the planet is not naturally heating, you won't get snow falls or rain unless the planet is warm due to evaporation.

So you will get blizzards and tropical storms as well as floods because of a warm temperatures.
These sort of arguments do not actually help our cause because they are the easiest to find fault with.

most of us believe in climate change, we just disagree how much man is to blame and what we are against 100% is any form of tax on Co2.

reply to post by munkey66


I agree about the whole manmade thing, but these are some of the worst snowstorms in 20 years. surely in the grip of global warming you would not be getting record breaking snowfalls.



[edit on 19-12-2009 by grantbeed]

Ha, global warming doesn't mean 150 degree temps everywhere and no more winter. In fact, expect more cooler temps, more rain, more snow, more storms, more flooding, etc. Global warming does mean things are heating up everywhere, all it has to do is melt all that polar ice and presto, it changes the dynamics of the weather all around the world. Most likely global warming is what triggers global cooling, possibly the next ice age. It's all probably cyclic, just like the four seasons have been here on Earth.

All I have to say is-

Hallelujah the Copenhagen bull# failed!!!!

Let us just hope that the US Cap and Tax bill cannot get out of the Senate.

As for your references to individual areas of extreme cold weather, they are no indications of any global climate model.

That being said, KMA global warming acolytes. The tax and control measure by our government has failed.

You will have to come up with another way to put the nail in the coffin of the US of A!

If you understand the science of global warming, either man caused or not, what you will discover is that global warming causes wild fluctuations in weather, not simply higher temperatures. With global warming expect floods, snowstorms, hurricanes etc.

Wether or not you believe that Man is causing any global warming, I am certain that you must understand that the massive amounts of pollution we are putting into the atmosphere, and soil, and water is not a good thing. Curbing our reckless poisoning of the planet is a good idea. Over 27 billion tons of CO2 are released into the atmosphere every year due to human causes. Something to consider.

Take a look at how much CO2 we release every year, and how much the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere has increased over the years: CO2 and Global warming

reply to post by Terapin


thanks for this reply. Yes, i certainly agree that we have not helped our environment/climate at all with the stuff we put out there.

Personally, I still feel the world is always part of a cyclical process.

In my OP, I pose a question. Its not a statement that i agree with or not. Would be good just to understand how the Warming of our planet actually can trigger larger snowfalls and colder temperatures as well as drought and higher temps?

reply to post by Terapin


Okay, let us not start another 40 page thread argument on Global Warming due to CO2.

Please.

If you want to argue about that, their are probably hundreds of threads to put your position on.

Now, if you want to point out to the OP that specific areas of severe cold are not indicative of Global Cooling, that is fine.

But if you want to talk about the total lack of credible evidence of Global Warming due to man made pollutants, let me pick the thread and we can go to town.

I call BS on all this non-sense. If the models were correct then the northern areas of the globe should be having warmer than they have been now.

What is being observed compared to what the "science" says does not match. In fact they just released a report a little while ago explaining how the unexpected colder winters we are going through is due to "natural causes". So pretty much what they are saying is if it gets colder it is due to natural causes and when it gets warmer it is because man caused it.

Nothing but a fallacy. The climate is going through a natural cycle and the globe is starting to get cooler. It has nothing to do with abnormal fluctuations.

reply to post by grantbeed


I believe that Global Warming could be an exaggeration.
Many have taken advantage of such a concept and are even profiteering on the dire prediction.
You need to watch:
GLOBAL WARMING SCAM EXPOSED ON TV PROGRAM (shown on December 16, 2009):
www.youtube.com...

-----------------------
www.myspace.com...

reply to post by Norio Hayakawa


thanks for the link. will watch this later and get back to ya.

In other words, nothing is abnormal and the amount of C02 has no effect on perfectly natural events like climate, which is always dynamic and is mostly affected by cosmic events rather than terrestrial events, especially if these 'terrestrial events' are caused by purposeful cloud seeding or other secret experiments.

If you look at the other planets in our solar system, they're changing too.

A temperature change of one or two degrees in 100 years shouldn't be dramatic at all. Earth has gone through warm and cold periods for hundreds of millions of years.

There has been a lot of misinformation about being able to grow bananas in Alaska, or that both ice caps will melt completely and Earth will turn into another Waterworld

I feel a climate shift is occuring rather than either warming or cooling.

Interesting though how the groups for Cap and Trade have deviously begun to brand it Climate Change rather than Global Warming.

The desired result of the these Cap and Trade groups is the same: A global government under the premise of controlling people's lives and monies in the name of 'Combating Climate Change' which is one of the stupidiest ideas I've heard of.

How do you 'Combat' Mother Nature?



[edit on 19-12-2009 by star in a jar]

Well as far as snow is concerned we are currently experiencing the most snow in December in the Baltimore region since 1960 I believe, usually we don't get anything to speak of snow wise until around Jan and Feb. I have a yard stick outside and it's currently at just under 18 inches, it looks like it'll top out around 20 inches, that's impressive.

What this has to do with global warming I don't know, what I do know is man made global warming is bs, but that's just my opinion. Like someone else already said though, whatever your stance on global warming is, it is a good idea to stop polluting the hell out of the planet.

reply to post by grantbeed

If we really are in the grip of either Man Made/Natural Global Warming, then why is it that we are getting random, large SnowStorms across different countries?

Valid question.

Part of the answer is that all types of weather are produced by heat energy.. Wind, rain,snow, and all precipitation. When it snows outside, it is actually a sign of heat working in the atmosphere. Heat is what makes things happen with all weather.

It is like your car. Without heat from the fuel, the car is not going anywhere. It takes heat to get things working.

Just ponder on how much heat energy it took to get all of that moisture up into the atmosphere in order for it to snow.

So in actuality, the more snow a place is getting, is getting more heat.

reply to post by endisnighe


Please note, that I did not make the claim that Global Warming is man made. I simply pointed out that such climate change does not mean simply hotter temperatures. It also means significant fluctuations. Severe winter storms do not prove that global warming is not happening. Such fluctuations are to be expected when climates change. Weather patterns will be effected in such a manner. This is true wether or not man has anything to do with it.

The fact that man is indeed putting billions of tons of CO2 and other pollutants into the atmosphere may or may not have anything to do with it, but it certainly can not be a good thing. I am a fan of a cleaner environment and less waste. I am not saying that Man is causing global warming however. If global warming was being caused because the Earth got closer to the Sun, for example, you would still see increased storms and significant fluctuations in weather patterns. (no I am not saying that the Earth is getting closer to the Sun either)

reply to post by grantbeed


I'm not an expert, but I think if you look at things like the 'Gulf Stream' link here in Fragile Earth you can see one example. The global weather systems and seasonal forces are clearly very complex things, not yet entirely understood, however certainly much better understood, or at least observed, than at any time in history.

My own observations are that I and people I trust do observe significant changes towards the types of 'extreme' weather events predicted a good 10-15 years ago in anticipation of global warming effects on my region (UK) and we now seem to lurch from one to another on an almost monthly basis. These range from flash and regional flooding, record rainfalls, record summer heat recordings, seemingly more common destructive storm/high wind events, noticeably earlier spring events in nature, noticeably later autumn events in nature, blizzard/cold snaps, etc...

I am by no way convinced anyone really knows what will come, but I can't right off the scientists who predicted the changes to my neck of the woods based on MM emissions influenced GW all those years ago, just because of the increasing politicisation of the issue. I would however keep a very open mind about how the earth/climate might react next, to either the cumulative effect of our emissions, and/or terrestrial or extra-terrestrial (as in e.g.solar, gravitational) events.

[edit on 19-12-2009 by curioustype]

reply to post by Terapin


Yes, I like to recall the year I went to visit my high school sweetheart-1984-I drove a standard family station wagon after a record 2-4' snowfall with snowdrifts in the range of 12'. When was the last time I had seen such a snowfall? Never.

Weather research and science is one of the shortest lived sciences.

But give a politician something he can scare the populace with and that their politician has just found his gold mine.

People are scared as a whole of disasters in general. This is what makes me despise the very nature of what is going on.

Fear to institute another form of Tax and Control. The only purpose behind it.

Pollution is bad. Al Gore and Carbon Credits is another form of Tax and Control for the purpose of money and control-PERIOD.

reply to post by curioustype


I think people from all over the world have definatley noticed their weather change a lot over the last 10 to 20 yrs.

Ive been all over the place and everyone talks about how they used to have a very defined 4 seasons, but now its a crazy mixed bag of weather every year!

Here is the way Global warming advocates explain it:

If it snows, it is because of GW.
If it is dry, it is because of GW.
If it is cold, it is because of GW.
If it is hot, it is because of GW.
If we have an ice age, it is because of GW.
If we run out of oil, it is because of GW.
If Congress doesn't collect enough taxes, it is because of GW.
If anything goes wrong ANYWHERE in the world, it is because of GW.
It is ALWAYS BECAUSE OF GLOBAL WARMING.

That's your "Al Gore Science Lesson" for today.

reply to post by grantbeed


Of course weather has changed over the last 10-20 years.

It always has, it always will.

If you are not old enough to know, 25 years ago, they were telling the children(I was one of them) that the earth was in the midst of a Global Cooling period.

WHAT HAS CHANGED? The science? The weather?

No! The government wants your money. Period.

Name one period in history that government has not tried every avenue of enticement, to get your money.