Do you believe our consciouness lives on after death?

Ever notice that in any haunted building or home, there are several entites?

The "shadow" people are the main controllers of these locations. The other entities cry out for attention or try to make themselves known, it usually lasts a couple of moments but the shadow/controlling spirits shut them down or it shuts them up.

Most spirits/entities will not cross (tick off) this shadow entity because of its higher energy. Residual energy is not a threat to any enviroment - it is just what it sounds like - a point in time repeating itself over and over.

These controlled entities are usually repeating some unfinished business, but a majority are intellegent. They have not crossed because the controlling energy enjoys their presense. That would be their hell. Not being able to move on, because another stronger energy binds them to that place because it enjoys their being there.

To cross over - that is a whole different story. If you want to cross over - lose your own demons and baggage - or you will be bound to this realm.

Matter restrict and limit consciousness.

/Thread

I believe it. My mother died of cancer when I was 12. When I was 16 I was in a horrific automobile accident. While I was in ICU, I thought my aunt had come to stay with me - held my hand and sang a favorite lulliby. Turns out my aunt hadn't been able to come. I didn't find out about this until years afterwards. My father finally told me that one day he came into the ICU and saw my mother sitting next to me holding my hand. He said she smiled at him and nodded, and he knew I would be ok. But it freaked him out, so he turned around and left.

And the best part of my belief? If I am wrong - I'll never know! Can't worry that you're wrong if your brain is rotting in the ground. So, I'll go on believing. It makes me happy in the here and now.

reply to post by unityemissions


I appreciate the courtesy, but I am sorry I cannot accept that my conclusion that consciousness exists outside of the body/brain is a belief in the same way you believe that the brain is causing consciousness. This is because my conclusion is baed on rational reasoning based on available facts and occams razor of using the simplest explanation to explain those facts.

As I said earlier and in some other threads if you take a rationalist point of view you have to conclude that consciousness exists outside of the body because logic takes you to that conclusion. Sure, you can argue that conclusions derived from logic may not be absolutely true. But it is the most reliable means of knowledge. It is based on logic that Einstein created the theory of general relativity and this was later empirically verified. It is based on logic that the Indian mathematician and astronomer Aryabhatta propounded the theory of gravitation and the heliocentric model(long before Kepler and Newton) which again were later empircally verified. It is based on logic that the Indian philosopher Kannada proposes the existence of atoms and subatomic particles, which have been empircally verified recently. Therefore logic has consistently been shown to be reliable in revealing reality to us.

Moreover, I have actually had empirical experience of my consciousness existing apart from the body. So as far as I am concerned both the logic and the empirical have proven the existence of my soul. Finally, and I consider this evidence secondary, there is countless testimony in fields like NDE, parapsychology which attest to the same conclusion. In other words there is sufficient and overwhelming evidence to accept the existence of the soul from experience, logic and expert testimony. I am more than convinced I will survive physical death, and I am more than convinced you will survive it too.

You have a right to remain skeptical, but remember you cannot ever be absolutely skeptical, for then you would also have to be skeptical of your skepticism. You have already admitted you accept your existence as a physical being(brain) as a belief, so obviously you are not a true skeptic. But I hope you realise this puts in your same category as somebody who believes in god, angels, aliens, fairies, resurrection, judgement day etc.
The same cannot be said of me because I am basing my conclusion on critical thinking and logic. This is closer to science than faith.

reply to post by Psychonaughty

Don't you see? If we forgive eachother and forgive ourselves than the paradoxes are solved.

That is all humanity needs to learn is forgiveness and utter innocent unconditional love, that love that keeps us existent for ever and ever. This type of mindset would free humanity of it's negative karmatic debts which we continiously see with war etc....

Hypocrisies don't make truths. If I should forgive, and allow for the unfounded arrogance to continue, then we neither learn nothing nor abolish negativity as arrogance is a negative trait. Your stance is do as I say not as I do? Preposterous, I will do no such thing. As I said, forgiveness can not be achieved as we both know you are better than that, this garbage shouldn't have happened in the first place as you are not that stupid nor are you incapable of growing. Why forgive and allow such limitations to simply continue when those limitations can be conquered someday by having someone who cares fight to conquer those limitations. To me, that is innocent unconditional love as we all need each other to discover reality, not a minority few full of pompous arrogant self proclaimed contradictory truths.

Honestly the more I thought about this question the better I wanted to answer it so I'll add on here...

We are living our basically every path we possibly could have taken in life, in alternate universes, all at the same time. All time is happening at once, it's not how we perceive it here in the physical realm. We (as in us here right now) are just a fractal of our consciousness which is living. Our cosmic counterpart is steadily taking in all of our physical experiences, while at the same time pushing us to do certain things (think of having a 'gut' feeling, sometimes you just know it's right). Or our spirit guides or those who have loved us and passed on are influencing our physical experiences. This is to help out, not to cloud our judgment. Ultimately we make the final decision when it comes to everything, but like I said our sub-conscious play a big roll in that, and little do we know how much it really is effecting the things we do, say, etc...

I don't have it all figured out yet, and I may have some things wrong, but one thing is for certain we do in fact live on after biological death (as I've said earlier). Try having an OoBE (astral projection) and then tell me that there is no such thing as life after death... after an OoBE you just know (you can feel it) that life goes on after death. It comes with your OoBE's. As well as a lot of factual information in which you can receive while out of body. I have confirmed and debunked a nice chunk of stuff so far doing so myself, I can't speak for all of you though, so you need to experience it for yourselves. That's why you will get all different answers for this question.

Although I believe I am certain, know for a fact there is life after death, that doesn't mean I'm going to make you think the same thing so don't take it that way. It's just my personal belief so I feel strongly about it. And honestly before my spiritual awakening I was not sure there was life after death, but after my first OoBE I was sure of it (and other things as well).

I want to believe that there is life after death. Maybe its arrogant to even think that, I have no proof for one thing, but I just feel that there might be.

One thing that shakes me, is the question "What makes me -me? Who am I?" If had an accident and it resulted to brain damage, will I still be me? Will I become another person, a different person? Am I what my brain is?

reply to post by Indigo_Child


I'm sorry, but once again, you're being irrational. You assume that since we don't yet know certain things about how the brain works, and how consciousness arises, the mind must exist outside of the brain.

You use the hard problem of consciousness, and the inability of science to as of yet pinpoint exactly how memory works, to back up this claim. That doesn't make sense.

I too have had vivid conscious experiences that could be called astral projections. I don't see them as anything other than the imagination at work.

Funny you say that I'm in the same group as people believing in aliens, gods, etc...Yet your username is indigochild!! Also, you're the one who believes in aliens, annunaki, depopulation, etc..I've read your previous threads. Not buying into your bs. I do realize you're very capable of being manipulative.

Here's a recap for anyone interested in seeing through indigo's false beliefs:

2010-2012 Depopulation of the Planet

I must also note that you start off stating this is all fact. Much like you do here. Mixing some truths with a bunch of hooey. Later you go to say that from all your research, it seems highly probable, but it may not come to pass.



Are you ready to admit that you are the one being an ass, here? The one who is being irrational, and twisting beyond all belief?! Lots of words, a few theories, mounds of assumptions. It's getting old, indigo.

Oh, one last thing. I don't care what one study says about how people interact with their environment. I can tell real people from the fake. A real individuals character is independent of their environment. It's internalized, and not subject to outside forces. Perhaps few are so internalized these days. All I can say is, what a shame.

reply to post by boniknik


There are many accounts of people suffering brain damage, whose personality changed drastically. I've heard stories of someone's wife being scared to death over what their husband had become after injury.

[edit on 16-12-2009 by unityemissions]

reply to post by Jools

Consciousness and memory are two completely different things. The fact that you don't "remember" before being 18 months old doesn't mean anything other than that's when your long term human memory began. You could still have a brain injury, lose all your memories, but still be "conscious" and awake.

You could drink a lot of alcohol, have a "black out" that you don't remember, but does that mean you weren't conscious when your blacking out? It may have been a drunk consciousness, but it's a consciousness never-the-less.

Ergo, it can't be ruled out that our consciousness existed before our birth and will after our death just because our human memory of it doesn't exist. Although, it sure makes near-death experiences a difficult phenomena to explain away, doesn't it?

[edit on 16-12-2009 by harrytuttle]

Originally posted by unityemissions
reply to post by Indigo_Child

 

I'm sorry, but once again, you're being irrational. You assume that since we don't yet know certain things about how the brain works, and how consciousness arises, the mind must exist outside of the brain.

It isn't an assumption; it is a fundamental characteristic of the mind.

It is the opposite of the brain; it is the opposite of the physical.

Science WILL allow us to logically understand the nature of the mind more and more and its connection to the brain.

We already have a better understanding of the nature of astral projection and out of body experiences but logical evidence is different than scientific evidence.

Science relies on physical empirical evidence, so while we may see correlations and logical proof it is not the same thing as scientific evidence.

It is very interesting reading through this thread, I do not understand why any poster here would consider that the possibility of consciousness continuing after death to be a narcissistic/arrogant idea.

It is also equally interesting that when we try to understand the concept of someone leaving their bodies we try to grasp it in a neurological manner...and we can't.

The human brain is nothing more than an organic computer, it computes light into information that is "user friendly." It also stores information and it has the ability to form thoughts as a tool for understanding.

When a human being dies, the computer dies, and you will never find yourself in your mind. The act of consciousness leaving the body is a BIOLOGICAL FUNCTION that we can now PROVE.

Each of us has a gland called the pineal, the pineal gland is formed by cells in the roof of the mouth of a growing fetus...it is then positioned in a very snuggled manner near the back of the brain.

If the human brain is a computer taking in information, who is the one receiving the information??

You are, and you are located in the pineal gland.

There is one major family of psychedelic compounds known as the tryptamine family. This family includes Lysurgic Acid Diethylamide ( '___'), Psylocibin ( shrooms), and Dimethyltryptamine.

Dimethyltryptamine ('___') is the most powerful psychedelic known to human beings, and it is produced by the human pineal gland. '___' is produced by a growing fetus about six weeks after conception, likewise when a human being dies the pineal gland produces copious amounts of this compound around the same time frame.

The effects of '___' mimic exactly the near death experience, the sensation of leaving one's body...

This is all SCIENTIFICALLY BACKED BY RESEARCH AND EXPERIMENTATION.

When you are alive you are here to learn, the human computer (brain) is simply the tool of the "soul" to navigate this existence. When the body dies the computer dies, but the soul retains it's own memories to be synthesized later to prepare for further incarnation.

It should also be noted that no one has ever PROVEN that any experience is inherently "hallucinatory." Prescribing to someone's experience as being hallucinatory is the same logic as staring out to the horizon and declaring that the world is flat because that is how it looks from your vantage point.

www.rickstrassman.com...

We need more psychedelic research...



[edit on 12/18/2009 by dalan.]

Faith can be defined in many different ways.

This of course is my feeling towards what faith is.

My faith for example has nothing to do with what most people perceive God to be. I know not of God (as a deity) but I do feel a sense of purpose. I have faith that after our last dying breath, our consciousness lives on. My belief is that God is energy and all of us are God. Everything known in existence.. possesses some form of energy hence everything being God. I also believe that how we think and how we feel are two very separate functions. How we feel is reflected on an energy giving us an intuitive feeling towards something connected to our consciousness without thought. Thought comes from our fleshly experiences of what we know in the now. I feel happy knowing this and it comforts me. I cannot explain it. I can only share what it is I feel. Whether or not it makes sense to people is besides the point. I don't even know how I came up with this, it was just always there and naturally came about. No thought was involved either as if it was always known to me.

I would like others to share their feelings towards the subject and their thoughts if you don't have problems discerning the differences between the two.

Originally posted by dalan.
The human brain is nothing more than an organic computer, it computes light into information that is "user friendly." It also stores information and it has the ability to form thoughts as a tool for understanding.

When a human being dies, the computer dies, and you will never find yourself in your mind. The act of consciousness leaving the body is a BIOLOGICAL FUNCTION that we can now PROVE.

Each of us has a gland called the pineal, the pineal gland is formed by cells in the roof of the mouth of a growing fetus...it is then positioned in a very snuggled manner near the back of the brain.

If the human brain is a computer taking in information, who is the one receiving the information??

You are, and you are located in the pineal gland.

Why can't the brain do both?! Parts of the brain are used for deciphering sensory information. Not the whole of the brain. Feedback loops provide us with a sense of being. It's continuous. Our self-awareness is nothing more than a constant integration of the data already collected via the brain. I have yet to hear someone explain to me how it is that a brain-damaged person can change personality, if we are not our brain?! Someone can turn from a "normal" individual to a psychopathic serial-killer simply from brain damage.

To think that we're something other than our body is personality disorder. To think that our body is just a tool is personality disorder. This has been known for sometime now.

reply to post by Monts


I simply don't know. All options are open for me.

The two main options are:

1) The matter is the mind - which means that indeed when the physical body dies, my consciousness ceases to be.

2) The mind over matter - which means that my consciousness created this body, and will exists after death.

I don't honestly care which opinion is real. It won't change my way of living in any way.

-v

I absolutely believe that our collective energy continues on in some matter. I have no idea as to how or where but I can't imagine that all that we are just stops living after our body and brain stops working. I hope not anyway. That would make it all rather pointless, in my opinion.

Originally posted by unityemissions

Originally posted by dalan.
The human brain is nothing more than an organic computer, it computes light into information that is "user friendly." It also stores information and it has the ability to form thoughts as a tool for understanding.

When a human being dies, the computer dies, and you will never find yourself in your mind. The act of consciousness leaving the body is a BIOLOGICAL FUNCTION that we can now PROVE.

Each of us has a gland called the pineal, the pineal gland is formed by cells in the roof of the mouth of a growing fetus...it is then positioned in a very snuggled manner near the back of the brain.

If the human brain is a computer taking in information, who is the one receiving the information??

You are, and you are located in the pineal gland.

Why can't the brain do both?! Parts of the brain are used for deciphering sensory information. Not the whole of the brain. Feedback loops provide us with a sense of being. It's continuous. Our self-awareness is nothing more than a constant integration of the data already collected via the brain. I have yet to hear someone explain to me how it is that a brain-damaged person can change personality, if we are not our brain?! Someone can turn from a "normal" individual to a psychopathic serial-killer simply from brain damage.

To think that we're something other than our body is personality disorder. To think that our body is just a tool is personality disorder. This has been known for sometime now.

The brain only a piece of hardware that synthesizes the information that comes from the body.

The brain is physical just like the limbs.

The mind is the non-physical observing entity that responds to the message the brain creates.

To think that you are your body is an illusion.

Yes there is consciousness after death, and you gotta believe in Jesus as your Savior if you want to go to be in a place of perfection with God after you die.

God created you, you are not a god, and God is not you, and we are not all part of God, and God is not in everyone or everything, but if you humble yourself and repent of your sins to God, the Spirit of God can dwell in you.

And I just pissed off lots of people who like to think they can save themselves, but they are fooled, and are running from the truth.

And the aliens, ascended masters, Space Brothers, those are demons and principalities. Of course there are angels too, but if you are contacted by an angel, he will tell you straight up that he is a servant and messenger of the One God.

If you go trying to contact spirits and have out-of-body experiences you are practicing witchcraft which we are not supposed to do and you will not contact any angels, you will be contacting demons who will lie to you.

Don't be fooled.

reply to post by Chainmaker


That might be so from your religious point of view, but to straight up say others are wrong just because you put all your faith in a book written 700 years after Jesus died.. is pretty narrow.

Originally posted by Jezus
The brain only a piece of hardware that synthesizes the information that comes from the body.

The brain is physical just like the limbs.

The mind is the non-physical observing entity that responds to the message the brain creates.

To think that you are your body is an illusion.

Actually, it takes in information not only from our body, but from the environment as well. The idea that the mind is non-physical is nothing more than belief. How am I to observe without sensation or imagination? Where does sensation and imagination come from? The brain. Their is no observer without the brain. It's really not hard to grasp at.

Sometimes reality is just not as interesting as fantasy. You will die one day. Worms will eat your brains. This is nothing to fear. It's just the inevitable.

Originally posted by unityemissions
Actually, it takes in information not only from our body, but from the environment as well.

Your body takes information from the environment.
Your brain synthesizes this information into consciousness.
Your mind observes and responds to the conscious experience.

Originally posted by unityemissions
The idea that the mind is non-physical is nothing more than belief.

The idea that the mind is created by the physical brain is nothing more than an illusion.

The mind is fundamentally non-physical, it responds to the physical.

Originally posted by unityemissions
How am I to observe without sensation or imagination? Where does sensation and imagination come from? The brain. Their is no observer without the brain. It's really not hard to grasp at.

Your mind is the entity that "feels" a sensation.
Your brain creates the sensation.

The brain can not "feel" anymore than the left toe can.
It can only pass the message.

Originally posted by unityemissions
Sometimes reality is just not as interesting as fantasy.

I disagree.

Originally posted by unityemissions
This is nothing to fear.

I agree.