Common sense proof Obama is a fake., page 2

reply to post by cbianchi513

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If We, the People... The constituency of the traitors responsible demand further examination, would logic not dictate that congress obey their (supposed) masters?

Absolutly. And I think that is exactly where people who believe this nonsense should be going to voice their opinion.

reply to post by whatukno

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The question was rhetorical... Of course that is what We, the People should do. It is clearly stated in the founding documents.

We have to play by the rules we cherish, or we are no better than that lot in D.C.

Another rhetorical question: What recourse do We the People have left when all demands for redress are ignored?

See: Olive Branch petition to George III.

www.learner.org...

Not specific to this issue neccesarily, but I'm sure you get the point. Perhaps this "Pennsyvania Farmer" should draft an updated copy?

Attention Federal Government: Don't learn from history? Repeat.



[edit on 21/7/09 by cbianchi513]

reply to post by jimmyx

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Actually once you have a drivers license, or even better a passport, you are pretty much golden. You don't have to use your birth certificate. I'll bet the short form Hawaiin certificate got him pretty far as well.

So your argument is not really valid. I wonder if he has to fill out onerous forms to obtain a security clearance, or if he is granted one gratis?

reply to post by whatukno

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The simple fact is that as an American being hired for a job I have to provide documents proving my qualification to obtain employment. One of the documents on the list of those possible is a birth certificate.

This is not a document that has ever been labled a "secret" due to it's nature of use is our society. People having to qualify something to TPTB will probably have to produce this at some point in there life to get a social security card, drivers license or even a job washing dishes.

Why is it that the POTUS is immune to having to do this? Why is it even a question? It does not make any logical sense to conceal it and in fact defys basic common sense.

There is something about human nature that dictates our feelings about things based on that "gut feeling" that gut feeling when something doesn't seem right is because it goes against the grain of our common sense and that is hard to ignore.

reply to post by Helious

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When have you ever had to use your birth certificate to get a job? I have always used two forms of ID. that is my state issued identification card or drivers license and the other is my social security card. The only time I have ever needed to use my birth certificate was to get a drivers license (hmm, wonder if Obama has a drivers license?) or my passport. (Wonder if Obama has a passport)

Common sense dictates that if the republican governor of Hawaii Linda Lingle, and Hawaii Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino, and registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate. Then chances are pretty good that they have his birth certificate and he was born there.

So we have three officials from the state of Hawaii saying that Obama was born there. Who are you to spit in their faces and call them liars?

reply to post by whatukno

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Im not calling anyone a liar. Im saying im one of the many hundreds of thousands of American people who believe in transparent goverment because we as Americans above all else know what tyranny is and what happens when the line is crossed. After all, thats the reason we are Americans to begin with, isn't it?

If that many patriots believe there is something that needs answering that can be satisfied by such a simple gesture, my good friend, please tell me that common sense wouldn't guide you to the conclusion to dowse the flames before they burned into a great and terrible fire.

I would be happy if the original long form was examined by a commitee made up of the congress, not even all Americans would need see it, that at least would put my mind at ease. A man like Obama as charasmatic as he is, he is now doing things he flat out said he wouldn't do, look at the bill he signed today, the same one he critized busch for using and publicly said he would NOT do the same thing, yet today he did.

Who am I to call him a liar? It would seem I wouldn't have, he has made that fact public on his own.

[edit on 24-7-2009 by Helious]

reply to post by Helious

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Oh no, you misunderstood me, I asked who are you to call the republican governor of Hawaii Linda Lingle, and Hawaii Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino, and registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka liars?

Not Obama. But check this out. I think it might answer some questions you have.

reply to post by whatukno

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Interesting video although I do take exception to the producer depicting the people who question the BC issue to be uneducated red necks who just read a news article someplace they can't put there finger on.

The point I am making in this thread is very simple, very stated in all my previous points here. You see, I admit that Obama very well may have been born where he has said, I think that it may probably be a better bet than Kenya, maybe.

Problem is, the fact that he has chosen to fight the release of the original long form of the document instead of going the much more simplistic route of showing it. This is what goes against of grain of rational though to the every day person and the reason this is not going to just go away.

In that video I seen an official representive speeking from the white house on the issue, it isn't like a rogue militia in a backwards state is calling for this, many Americans from all corners of the country consider this to be a real concern because goverment is becoming big and is wading it's toes in all forms of peoples everyday life and it is scary for those who pay attention.

With the radical changes that are happening on an almost daily basis from majority ownership of a mega American autmotive maker to national health care and taking into account the state of the economy and general public panic I think it wouldn't be too much to ask that the leader of our nation perform an act of good faith, a public service to the patriots he has chosen to lead.

Not doing so, even though he may in the end be hiding nothing, is what rubs my common sense the wrong way, thats what this thread is about and I don't claim to know where he was born, only that the steps he has chosen to take to conceal the document instead of producing it is not logical in the minds of many, many Americans, myself included.

reply to post by Helious

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But who does he show it to? Everyone? It's painfully obvious that not everyone would even believe the BC if he showed it. So who do you show it to? Perhaps the Chair of the DNC? Wouldn't that be the people that would tell the states that Obama is on the Ballot?

Just as Taitz states. Each state got a letter from Nancy Pelosi that stated that Obama was on the Ballot as the Democratic Candidate. So doesn't it figure that Pelosi as the chair person would have to verify that Obama is eligible in the first place?

I don't think that if Obama showed everyone in America his birth certificate (even though he already has) they would believe him. The question is now, what is the motive behind raising such a stink about an issue that has already been settled?

reply to post by whatukno

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I would be happy if a panel of 12 members of congress viewed it privately and put the matter to rest. I am of the opinion that nobody within our congress has seen his long form just like the rest of the country unless you can point to somebody I am unaware of.

I don't care about state goverment agents of Hawaii, I want congress to take a look, then I would be happy.



[edit on 25-7-2009 by Helious]

Common sense would dictate that there is no such thing as a long-form birth certificate in Hawaii, and that the original paper records are no longer held by Hawaii's medical department as they switched over to a digital medium years ago.

Common sense would tell you that the digital COLB that Obama released is the only birth certificate anyone can get in Hawaii, including Obama.

Common sense would tell you that if Obama released the only birth certificate he possibly can, then he has nothing to hide. If he has nothing to hide, then there is no basis for any of your comments.

Asked for more information about the short-form versus long-form birth documents, Okubo said the Health Department "does not have a short-form or long-form certificate."

"The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models," she said.

Okubo also emphasized the certification form "contains all the information needed by all federal government agencies for transactions requiring a birth certificate."

Honolulu Star Bulletin






Bit hard to talk about common sense when you lack enough to do a little research before you post...






EDIT to fix my link.

[edit on 25-7-2009 by drwizardphd]

reply to post by drwizardphd

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I would make a long post to refute all that you said except that all that you have said holds no merit.

Hawaii does not have any more long form birth documents? They must have ran out! I was born in Michigan, I can send a check for 15 dollars and get mine in the mail with a seal and everything!!!

WOW, Hawaii must be really cutting edge on the cust to being the most advanced American state in the union! We should all move there and get a chip so we don't have to carry ID at all.

Your an idiot, no long form original documents have been destroyed or lost because of digital reformat. There was a long form issued and filed if and when Obama was born there. Please don't attempt to discredit my argument with a weak and ill thought out argument that is just plain wrong.

Get a clue.

[edit on 25-7-2009 by Helious] Edit for manners

[edit on 25-7-2009 by Helious]

reply to post by drwizardphd

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Sir, I am very sorry but you are misinformed. At the time of Mr. Obamas birth, Hawaii issued long form traditional birth cirtificates like every other state in the union.

You may not say otherwise because this is pure fact. To say that these records were destroyed or lost because they at some point in the future decided to do something digital and that the previous forms were perged, lost or destroyed is......... Well, I don't know the word for it, but its silly.

I called you an idiot because you claimed in your post I was stating nonsense for not doing any research and as such my "common sense" was invalid.

It would appear, you have not done your research because at the time of Obamas birth, there were "long form" birth certificates issued in the state of Hawaii and not one of them have been destroyed regardless of there new format.

Be informed before you post, you claimed me to be inept and ill informed, in fact, it is you who are so mis informed.

reply to post by drwizardphd

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If you are attempting to defend the Obama camp, you would probably best serve them by not commenting further.

Indeed, there is a new format that is most certain to be the likely evolution of the documents in question but that has no claim to forms from the time of Obamas birth.

I firmly believe that Obama was born in the United States, at least now I do but I also believe that he has a long form on record and think it impossible it would have been torched because they are using some sort of hybrid now.

There is no evidence of this and one argument has nothing to do with the other. Those who support the presidents right to confirmation though goverment do not need to resort to saying a state has moved to a short form and thats that.

reply to post by drwizardphd

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So, basicly what you are saying is that Hawaii no longer has the long form birth certificate of President Obama?

What your saying based on your research is that it is no longer available, issued or can not be referenced?

Before I respond to your post, I want to understand correctly this is what your stating.

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