Shame For Britain As BNP Win European Parliament Seats

Originally posted by Muckster
Blueorder... I wasn’t even taking to you so pipe down son.

But to answer in the childish way that you may understand...

how about you settle pettle, maybe have a nice wee cup of tea and attain some level or rationality

No it's not

clearly wrong

Er... what?!?!

self evident pettle- there is no 100% pure anything, that does not take away from the rational of attacking multi culturalism, mass immigration etc

No, i was using a snippet of 400 years as an example.

not a very relevant "snippet"

What if a white person who speaks English wants to stab you to death??

clearly I would fear them, now answer my question?

Nope, nothings pure... but Hitler wanted it that way!

Yes, roger irrelevant, now back to the debate

See how annoying this kind of response is?? It all gets very childish when someone replies with little quotes and one sentence answers. So please, either reply like an adult or don’t reply at all.

I was cutting my cloth, now hopefully you can step up your game a little

Originally posted by Muckster
More stars for you sotp... unfortunately i think we are beating our heads against a brick wall

Adolf Griffin openly admits his strong links with the old National Front. The National Front were openly racist... But the BNP are not racist??? Yeah right.

Like i keep saying... they haven’t even got the balls to admit it.

It's all about "degrees of outrage"- why would you not get as outraged at unrepentant trotskyists and communists in the Labour govt- are millions of dead in Ethiopia, Cambodia, Soviet Union not enough for you, see we can all play that game

Deal with the BNP as they are now, man up and stop scurrying around in the past

The BNP's support is concentrated in people who traditionally support Labor. Tradional Labor supporters voted for the BNP, they wanted the immigration plan of BNP to be identified by the voters of UK

Its agenda failed to gain much traction until recent months. But British politics is passing through an unusually turbulent phase, and Mr. Griffin’s party has exploited a drastic slump in support for the establishment political parties, particularly the governing Labor Party, after a scandal over Parliament members’ expenses.

Analysts say the British National Party has tapped into the frustration of working-class voters, particularly in the gritty rust-belt cities of northwestern England, who are disillusioned with Labor.

But beyond resulting from an effort to capitalize on voter unrest, Mr. Griffin’s victory is the culmination of a campaign to modernize the party and shake off a reputation for anti-Semitism and the politics of incitement it earned in a previous era.

Source: www.nytimes.com...

Originally posted by Fang

I was being sarcastic. You know, Mussolini and his triumphs.

I know mate, I was too.

Originally posted by blueorder

oh yeah, right on Rik, yeah, not a great crystal ball you have- drama queen

I was being facetious...sort of. I wouldn't be surprised if things ended up like that under a BNP goverment. I'm sure the Germans didn't forsee the state their country would be left in after the Nazis.

Originally posted by Muckster

More stars for you sotp... unfortunately i think we are beating our heads against a brick wall

Thanks for the stars Muckster, I usually don't get many so much appreciated

And of course you are right - leopards don't change their spots. Not that leopards would be allowed into the country - bunch of smelly African spongers is what they are, lounging about our zoos taking up land that rightfully belongs to proud British animals!

Originally posted by Lazyninja

I'm pretty sure immigration is a bigger deal than you think for the average voting Joe. It's definitely more important to the public than education is, yet the government still has it's driving force behind education, with healthcare coming second.

It's a problem that anyone concerned with immigration is labelled as some kind of racist. However, I'm pretty sure that the only people who throw tags around like that, are either people who are already comfortably in a job, or those who do not have a job and aren't looking for one.

I suppose that depends on the area where you live and the amount of immigrants there. In my area it's a non-issue, but we don't have the amount of asylum seekers or illegals that some places do. We do have an abundance of Eastern Europeans but no-one has a problem with them as far as I can see.
I agree with your point about people mentioning immigration being labelled racists, that is unfortunate, but in some cases that tag is merited. It certainly is in the case of the BNP.

Originally posted by blueorder

Deal with the BNP as they are now, man up and stop scurrying around in the past

The BNP were and still are a bunch of racist thugs, no matter how much they try and deny it. The only way to deal with them is to vote wisely and make sure they never get into power.

reply to post by blueorder


Unfortunately Blueorder i have dealt with people like you before... You are a prime example of someone who tries to goad people into response that can be seen as over the top... so that you can then sit back, point the finger and say "see, that’s how they behave"

Just remember one thing... BNP support represents a tiny number of angry people in this country. Hardcore BNP supporter are even rarer. Our society is so mixed now, and many white people have mixed relationships, friends from different backgrounds and even people from ethnic backgrounds who are role models and heroes. It would be extremely unlikely for the BNP to ever hope of winning a general election.

Most level headed people see the BNP for what they are. Stagnant, repugnant, narrow minded bigots that are forever looking back (through rose coloured glasses) at some 1950's utopian dream Britain that never really existed.

I find that most people who have such views normally haven’t travelled much; normally stick to one area and one group of people and so become isolated and fearful of the outside.

You think this country never had poor people, joblessness and housing shortages before immigrants?? You want to go back to Victorian society? Oh what a glorious part of British history... when England ruled the waves!!! And Children were sent up Chimneys, Poor people were sent to work houses, no health care, no social care, old people had to live with their family’s or simply face an early death with no support!
Britain had its bad points long before immigration.


I have made my point... I know that you will continue to goad me with your childish responses. I believe you are a Racist at heart. I will no longer respond to you because I do not feel I can have a sensible adult conversation with you... so go on... get the last word in. You know you can’t resist!

reply to post by Muckster


So what??


We are at breaking point, hospitals, housing are stretched to the limits, unemployment at its highest in a long time. Britain needs to take care of its own before trying to help the rest of the world.

We've been fllooded with europes trash, criminals and anyone else who wants a free hand out. We need to get rid of the illegals, make it harder for people to just come and settle in Britain.

Norway (3-4 times the size of the UK), population 4 and a half million.

Uk population 65 million, enough said.

reply to post by Horus12

We are at breaking point, hospitals, housing are stretched to the limits, unemployment at its highest in a long time. Britain needs to take care of its own before trying to help the rest of the world.

I agree with some of your points. I agree that we should tighten up our borders. But voting for BNP is not they way to go about it. The BNP are not just talking about stopping illegal immigrants coming in, or sending home illegal immigrants that are already here. They are talking about, and their policy states this, paying for British nationals of ethnic backgrounds to go back to their land of origin!!

If people can’t see that they just want a white Britain then they are blind or mad.

And if someone wants a purely White Britain then, in my opinion, they are racist!

reply to post by Muckster


Well for the record I have never read all of the BNP's policies (nor voted for them), but some I have seen and some I could agree with.

I believe any imigrant from where ever needs to conform to the British way of life, our heritage and our culture. It's being thrown down the pan by the PC brigade and they need to be stopped.


The anti-fascist brigade or whoever they are, are laughable in their fascist attempts to silence a democratically elected MeP(s) having listened to them, it is nutjobs like that I am far more weary of.

I trust no MP and will hold my vote until I find someone worthy of it.

reply to post by Muckster


Actually chap, I stated in my reply to you that some interbreeding happened, but not on a massive scale, as people were even more xenophobic back then than they are now. Hence why I said 69% of people are descended from the original Britons who were here pre-Roman invasion, this is backed up be several recent genetic studies of the UK population.

The invasions replaced the top level of society each time and some took local wives. For example, the Norman invasion only brought over 10,000 Normans (Ironically, alot were Breton, who are actually original Post-Roman Britons who fled England in the Anglo-Saxon invasion....that's another story). The common man remained the same throughout the invasions, the culture, however, was changed by the invasions.

You're entire reply to my post makes it look like you reacted without reading it properly. Might I suggest you read it again to gain some clarity.

More protests before BNP meeting

Protesters have gathered outside a pub in Manchester where the BNP leader Nick Griffin is to hold a news conference.

Mr Griffin was forced to abandon a similar event outside Parliament on Tuesday after he was pelted with eggs.

Mr Griffin, who has been elected to the European Parliament for the North-West region, called on other political leaders to condemn the attacks on him.

He was warned by the Police not to set this meeting up or attend it, I guess he just loves the publicity.

Oh dear that is twice now, So guessing you all whom support the BNP will blame this on the other POLITICAL PARTIES? Not on the ordinary citizen who sees the BNP for what is it!!! It is not hire a mob it is ordinary citizens who are disgusted that even a party like this exists.


BBC NEWS

He was warned by the Police not to set this meeting up or attend it, I guess he just loves the publicity.

Oh dear that is twice now, So guessing you all whom support the BNP will blame this on the other POLITICAL PARTIES? Not on the ordinary citizen who sees the BNP for what is it!!! It is not hire a mob it is ordinary citizens who are disgusted that even a party like this exists.

Thats twice the protests have fallen for the orchestrated misdirection to focus on a well-crafted 'media-kettling' strategy.

And yet more pointless ranting and public tantrums from the same group that brought us the 'G20 aimless sulking in a police kettle-cordon' event

The trouble with the BNP is that although they have correctly identified the concerns and fears held by a good portion of the British public, and are very good at exploiting and encouraging those fears, they do not offer any practical solutions.

What we're dealing with in Britain (as with the rest of Europe, US, Australia) are very complex social problems. Immigration from less developed countries has largely been a post-war and post-colonial phenomenon. It is bound to have caused alienation and resentment, which is particularly evident in more deprived areas (where the BNP's main support base can be found).

The answers to these problems, in my view, can be found by collectively getting our act together and sorting out the economic mess that has been left behind by the collapse of British manufacturing, mining and shipping industries (to name just a few).

Politics should be about identifying and sorting out problems so that people can live happily and get along as best as possible, not about creating confrontation and encouraging ill feeling in order to gain support and power, which is my main issue with Nick Griffin's lot and why they worry me.

The demographic of Britain has changed radically over the last 50 years. There's no going back from that, and for me personally it's not really that much of an issue. As far as I'm concerned people are just people, we're all pretty much the same. I know however that that isn't the case for everyone, and I am comparatively lucky in terms of having a decent job and living in a reasonable area (with a very mixed bag of races and religions).

What we as a nation should be doing is coming up with intelligent strategies and policies which a) improve the standard of life for everyone, especially the most deprived and b) remove the social and economic barriers which cause friction between different ethnic groups, which is best done through education and strengthening local communities.

Just kicking out everyone who isn't "British" enough is a facile, enormously expensive and dangerous tactic which will only cause more fear, more resentment and more hatred on our streets.

The problem is that the rest of us who are opposed to the BNP are relying on politicians to come up with the answers for us. Sadly, I don't think they will, and I think that unless we can organise ourselves and start thinking our way out of these problems, this country (and the West in general) is heading into very stormy waters over the next 5-6 years.

reply to post by mattpryor


Well i think that has to be one of the most level headed and intelligent replies ive seen so far regarding this topic.

A star for you my friend

And yet more pointless ranting and public tantrums from the same group that brought us the 'G20 aimless sulking in a police kettle-cordon' event

Wrong, the complaints that were lodged with regards to the G20 protests and the way the police handled them was not only just from that group, others were invovled also, and innocent bystanders or do you need reminding of this?

reply to post by stumason

You're entire reply to my post makes it look like you reacted without reading it properly. Might I suggest you read it again to gain some clarity.

I’ve had a look at it again, and to be honest I don’t see the problem... I’ve admitted my mistake about the Shetlands. I never stated that the Romans wiped out the indigenous population and replaced them with their own. I am just making the point that many people have visited these islands and have mixed with the locals. Therefore it is very difficult to find someone these days who is pure British (100% descended from the original aboriginal tribe’s people)

However, to me, being British has little to do with racial background; it is more to do with loving these beautiful islands we inhabit. If people come to this country and work hard and show respect to its heritage, culture, and adopt it as their home, then I don’t see a problem. The BNP, however, do!

I see that you are an English democrat... to be honest I know very little about English Democrats but I will check out the link and have a look.

I don't need to know English politics to know the pendulum always swings.
They're sick of the ruling party so now they want change.
The left wingers must've really been bad if England is shifting right.
Same for France and the rest of Europe, soon the US.

Besides, what's wrong with survival?
I doubt it's racial otherwise this would have occurred years ago.

Maybe the Brits are tired of illegals and/or non Brits that are taking over their country.
Maybe they'll ask for their guns back too.

So...are Kenya, Japan or Iran facing their native peoples becoming "a minority" in the next century? (Yes, well, we know that minority status hasn't worked out for Native Americans or most other indigenous peoples, or South African whites barbarically tortued and murdered in "robberies" where nothing is stolen, but as my dear ol' pappy said "Son, if we fire enough rockets at the Sun some of 'em astronauts 're bound to survive...eventually" ).

But what's wrong with the BNP, specifically? (I like the views of "democracy" these guys possess. Shut them up if we don't agree with 'em! - Hitler would be proud...but he probably would've used rifles, or police dogs at least).

I mean, we've got a member of "The Society of Black Lawyers" here whining about the BNP "not letting in non-indigenous-whites" (something about throwing stones while living in a glass house here, methinks) - and have any of you read up on Malaysia's "son of the soil" program towards "natives and Malaysians"? The politicians are probably laughing their behinds off that everyone's worried about the BNP!.

And in regards to the "Romans/Anglo-Saxons/Vikings/Normans were about as genetically and physically dissimilar to the indigenous Brits as West Indians and Pakistanis"...yeah.

But back to the BNP's policies:
Maybe some Brits have realised that no other political party gives a rats about mass-migration (outside protecting Brits from dangerous, welfare-abusing immigrants like RUSSIAN BALLERINA DANCERS! AH MOTHERLANNDDD!

Ah well - I guess there's less protests in the Third World now, seeing as the West has been the dumping ground for possible malcontents for the last 20 years

The problem is, that while multi-culturalism and mass immigration are espoused by the upper middle classes in the UK, it is usually the working class who are economically and culturally affected by it.

The unskilled and semi-skilled see their jobs being taken by immigrants who are willing to work at a lower wage while the middle and upper classes are rarely in economic competition with the mass majority of immigrants. British tradesmen also see their jobs being taken by Eastern European tradesmen who are willing and able to work for significantly less money.

The working class don't have the money to live in affluent areas and are more or less forced to live the multi-culturalism while the upper & middle classes live in their wealthy and almost exclusively white enclaves largely insulated from foreign cultures and foreign religions in the UK.

The upper and middle classes do directly benefit from the mass immigration because it pushes down the cost of goods and services that draw their labour from the less well off members of the work force.

In effect, mass immigration has the effect of making the poor, poorer (their incomes decrease) while making the middle and upper classes better off (their purchasing power increases due to a drop in the prices of many goods and services).

Mass immigration is just another ploy by the ruling elite to redistribute wealth from the poor to the well off and the rich.

Originally posted by gpzrd350
The problem is, that while multi-culturalism and mass immigration are espoused by the upper middle classes in the UK, it is usually the working class who are economically and culturally affected by it.

There's more than a grain of truth in your argument gpzrd. But what it demonstrates is that this is an economic issue, not a race issue. The reason eastern European builders have come to Britain to work is because they earn more than they do at home, but we pay them less to do it. It's not the fault of immigration, it's the fault of what inspired the immigration in the first place.

The reason Griffin stance on immigration is so absurd is that it suggests that by removing the immigrant workers you remove the problem. You don't. In effect you create an economic disaster for the country by removing cheaper labour and forcing running costs up wildly. That isn't a sustainable way forward.

My own view is that Nationalist politics are simply outdated. They don't work any more because the concept of nation has changed. It might be regrettable to some degree, we may lose some things that we held dear, but on the other hand globalisation gives us so much in return.

Even taking the moral argument out of the equation for a moment, racism is at root irrational and illogical. Racial prejudice simply doesn't stand up to science. Attempting to make it political is to build a house on sand.

LW

For those traitors, those liars, those smoke and mirrors merchants who dismiss Britain as a "land of immigrants", your arguments are ridiculous- you refer back to the Romans

Does that mean we should react in a similar manner........

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