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First Amendment being Destroyed

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posted on May, 24 2009 @ 11:31 PM

Now the First Amendment has been attacked by San Diego County.

Home: No place for Bible study
County demands pastor spend thousands on 'Major Use' permit to host friends
Posted: May 22, 2009
5:13 pm Eastern

By Drew Zahn
© 2009 WorldNetDaily

A San Diego pastor and his wife claim they were interrogated by a county official and warned they will face escalating fines if they continue to hold Bible studies in their home.

The couple, whose names are being withheld until a demand letter can be filed on their behalf, told their attorney a county government employee knocked on their door on Good Friday, asking a litany of questions about their Tuesday night Bible studies, which are attended by approximately 15 people.

"Do you have a regular weekly meeting in your home? Do you sing? Do you say 'amen'?" the official reportedly asked. "Do you say, 'Praise the Lord'?"

The pastor's wife answered yes.

This is another outrageous attack on the Bill of Rights, this time the First Amendment:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Forcing people to get a permit CLEARLY violates this free exercise of religion, and CLEARLY IS making a law concerning the free exercise of religion.

Whether you practice religion or not, this should bother everyone, as it is one more step to total control of Americans' lives.

Mod Edit: External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 26/5/2009 by Mirthful Me]

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 08:59 PM
I guess that this doesn't bother anyone? This is exactly what they want- indifference. Wait until it goes national, and it will be too late to stop it.

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 09:08 PM
Hey there. I see your thread and am looking into it for more detail. It's certainly not indifference- just fact checking. One thing that stood out to me in the article was this:

WND contacted a spokeswoman for San Diego County, who acknowledged the description of the incident seemed "bizarre," but who was unable to locate the details of the account. She simply could not provide comment yet, she said, until she could become familiar with the case.

Then the article also mentioned the couple is remaining anonymous so that leaves me cautious as well. Not that I think things like this don't happen- because they do. Even in America. However, I'm waiting for more information to come in and for it to be verified before saying anything further.

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 09:20 PM
Haha, we atheists are winning! But no, that is really messed up when a law is made that inhibits religious rights or peaceful assembly. I think that the problem tho might actually be the gathering itself and not the religious part. Fifteen people with their cars parked out front someones home sounds like a reason for a permit.

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 09:39 PM
reply to post by Hound

Fifteen people with their cars parked out front someones home sounds like a reason for a permit.

If that is the case, then anyone that has a party, gathering, or family Thanksgiving dinner, would be required to get a permit, which, BTW would cost several thousand dollars in studies, etc. In fact, even politicians who frequently hold "roundtables in constituents homes, would need such a permit.

BTW, this is not the first time that San Diego County has tried to shut down religious organizations:

San Diego Settles RLUIPA Lawsuit Brought By Church Yesterday's North County Times reports that a settlement has been reached in a RLUIPA lawsuit brought in 2007 against the city of San Diego (CA) by Grace Church of North County, a non-denominational congregation. The Church had applied for a 10-year conditional use permit to occupy space in a Rancho Bernardo industrial park. The Rancho Bernardo Planning Board refused the request as inconsistent with the community plan for the site. On appeal, the San Diego Planning Commission granted a 5-year permit. Grace Church sued, arguing that the industrial park already has another church and a synagogue in it. Under the settlement, the Church will receive $950,000 in damages and a permit to occupy its space for another 10 years.

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 10:20 PM
The first thing I thought of was the remark Obama made about bitter people clinging to their guns and religion. They're trying their damnedest to do away with the 2nd amendment. I guess doing away with the 1st amendment is running a close second.

I'll bet if this had been a gathering every Sunday to watch a football game, they wouldn't have gotten a knock on the door.

With Obama in office now, I feel that the liberals are more emboldened than ever to set out to strip us of every last right we have. The above mentioned being the main two.

Scary times, these.

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 10:36 PM
reply to post by soldiermom

The first thing I thought of was the remark Obama made about bitter people clinging to their guns and religion. They're trying their damnedest to do away with the 2nd amendment. I guess doing away with the 1st amendment is running a close second.

That's a very astute observation. I hadn't even thought of that remark, but now that you bring it up, it sure fits the bill. Both the first and second Amendment are under attack. I guess they're starting with 1 and 2, and will work their way up to 10 eventually.

Actually, if you look at the Bill of Rights, you'll see that most of them are already under attack, or have been essentially nullified.

* First Amendment – Establishment Clause, Free Exercise Clause; freedom of speech, of the press, Freedom of Religion, and of assembly; right to petition,

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

* Second Amendment – Militia (United States), Sovereign state, Right to keep and bear arms.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed. [5][6]

* Third Amendment – Protection from quartering of troops.

No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.

* Fourth Amendment – Protection from unreasonable search and seizure.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

* Fifth Amendment – due process, double jeopardy, self-incrimination, eminent domain.

No person shall be held to answer for any capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

* Sixth Amendment – Trial by jury and rights of the accused; Confrontation Clause, speedy trial, public trial, right to counsel

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district where in the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense.

* Seventh Amendment – Civil trial by jury.

In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise re-examined in any court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.

* Eighth Amendment – Prohibition of excessive bail and cruel and unusual punishment.

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

* Ninth Amendment – Protection of rights not specifically enumerated in the Bill of Rights.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

* Tenth Amendment – Powers of States and people.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

The Patriot Act allows circumvention of the 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th and 9th Amendments.
In addition, eminent domain has been destroyed by the Supreme Court decision to allow governments to take property and homes, to allow corporations to build shopping centers and other "improvements".

Congress has already passed several laws that violate the 10th Amendment.

Time will tell when the 3rd Amendment is trashed, if civil disobedience breaks out.

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 11:04 PM
very disturbing indeed.
altho i am agnostic, if our gov't can trash 1 right what keeps them from trashing the rest of the constitution?
i will and do fight for my rights that were afforded to me by this great document even if i don't really care on some other peoples beliefs.
but if i allow one to be taken then what is stop the others from being taken? why we have to fight to keep all of them.
and noone has mentioned the 13th amendment btw. wtf is "mandatory volunteer service?"
oxymoron if i ever heard of one- but they are forcing it.
my gf's son came home with a book saying he has to do 60 hrs community service or he will not be allowed to graduate.
but that is on another thread.
if we allow one to be taken we have set in motion to have that constitution burned and stamped out!!!!!!

posted on May, 26 2009 @ 11:24 PM
This very greatly disturbs me. If it is just a matter of permits because of parking or local ordinace maybe I see requiring that , but asking all the other questions is very scary to me indeed. If this doesnt bother others just because thay are atheist or just plain hate christians that is so short sited as others will be next if this type of constitutional raping is not stopped. I myself am a little more distured as I am a follower of Yahushua and have a gut feeling things are going to get worse for all followers of Yahweh Elohim and Yahushua (Jesus by many). I pray for religious freedom that was provided by the constitution.

posted on May, 27 2009 @ 01:09 AM
Pagans have been dealing with this for years.

It ain't right.

posted on May, 27 2009 @ 01:28 AM
Not surprising. There is a reason they are trying to attack the second amendment so hard. With out 2A we have no way to defend the other amendments.

posted on May, 27 2009 @ 01:54 AM
i think this made the msm,,, i remember seeing vidfeo of this,,,,

i or hopefully someone can find the video footage

unless this is another new case

posted on May, 27 2009 @ 01:59 AM
reply to post by ProfEmeritus

1st and 2nd are under attack. 4 trough 8 are already dead. It's easy to destroy freedom when you do it in small incriments. Noone will realise it untill it's too late.

posted on May, 27 2009 @ 12:06 PM
reply to post by ProfEmeritus

The funny thing is, it may not even take an outbreak of civil disobedience.
If the swine flu takes off this fall with devastating effects like some are claiming, that might be all it takes. In this administration's mind anyway.

posted on May, 27 2009 @ 07:53 PM
This country was a haven for those oppressed for centuries. In a few short years, the United States has become unrecognized as that haven, because of the politicians that have been systematically destroying the freedoms we have enjoyed.
It's about time that we say "enough".

posted on May, 28 2009 @ 10:21 AM
It's all very well and good to be outraged about this. I certainly am. The next, and most important, question is this one. What do you, and I, and rest of America do about it?

Those of us who would do something about this are going to be handicapped by the very thing these powermongers want, and are getting, most: Apathy.

Many, dare I say most, Americans have better things, supposedly, to do with their lives. How do we propose to wake them to the danger? I'll be honest, I really don't know how we're going to go about it...

posted on May, 28 2009 @ 10:29 AM
reply to post by seagull

Indeed it is a very lonely place to see the world as we here on this board see it.

[edit on 28-5-2009 by Anonymous Avatar]

posted on May, 28 2009 @ 11:27 AM

Originally posted by shortywarn
i think this made the msm,,, i remember seeing vidfeo of this,,,,
i or hopefully someone can find the video footage

The local TV station broadcast the story and provide a link to the video.

Assembly, religion, guns, search and surveillance, uniform bankruptcy laws, impairment of and sanctity of contract, ex post facto laws ... .

The list of Constitutional rights trampled in the first 5 months of this year just keeps growing.

How much does it take before someone responds? What's next if you don't?


posted on May, 28 2009 @ 11:32 AM
This has been going on for quote a while. Go to a protest march or anything of that nature. You will be hearded into one area, he "free speech zone", surrounded by police, and the minute you step across their lines you are arrested and made to look like an anarchist.

You are no longer allowed to protest outside of the white house. You can't burn a flag(not that I advocate it, but it is still a personal expression). It's a federal offense to fly a flag upside down. People are being pulled over for bumper stickers. Kids are being stopped for what clothes they are wearing or how they speak.

The first amendment was spit on long's just now that people are taking notice...

posted on May, 28 2009 @ 11:54 AM
I have to call for a reallity check in this thread..

First of all, the story posted, if true is wrong. I think religion is insane, but it's a right. And rights are good.

Second; To all those who claim the Obama administration is attacking the second.. Please re-evaluate this! Just recently, Obama signed in a gun bill. A bill that allows you to carry your concealed loaded weapon in a national park. That's right, he signed in a PRO-Gun bill.

If you want to see how he really is doing, you can note the fact that even the Brady campaign is upset because he isn't meeting their needs.

I love the second ammendment, but I will stick with reallity, not over-exagerated fears.

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