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UFO Evidence: Astronaut Sightings

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posted on Apr, 22 2009 @ 11:24 PM
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Most astronauts are reluctant to discuss UFOs, but some of them do!

Major Cooper is totally convinced that UFOs do exist.

"I believe that these extra terrestrial vehicles and their crews are visiting this planet from other planets... "I did have occasion in 1951 to have two days of observation of many flights of them, of different sizes, flying in fighter formation, generally from east to west over Europe."


A certain professor, who wished to remain anonymous, was engaged in a discussion with Neil Armstrong during a NASA symposium.

Professor: What REALLY happened out there with Apollo 11?
Armstrong: It was incredible, of course we had always known there was a possibility, the fact is, we were warned off!(by the Aliens). There was never any question then of a space station or a moon city.
Professor: How do you mean "warned off"?
Armstrong: I can't go into details, except to say that their ships were far superior to ours both in size and technology - Boy, were they big!...and menacing! No, there is no question of a space station.
Professor: But NASA had other missions after Apollo 11?
Armstrong: Naturally - NASA was committed at that time, and couldn't risk panic on Earth. But it really was a quick scoop and back again.


Donald Slayton a Mercury astronaut revealed in an interview he had seen UFOs in 1951

"I was testing a P-51 fighter in Minneapolis when I spotted this object. I was at about 10,000 feet on a nice, bright, sunny afternoon. I thought the object was a kite, then I realized that no kite is gonna fly that high.

As I got closer it looked like a weather balloon, gray and about three feet in diameter. But as soon as I got behind the darn thing it didn't look like a balloon anymore. It looked like a saucer, a disk.

About the same time, I realized that it was suddenly going away from me -- and there I was, running at about 300 miles per hour. I tracked it for a little way, and then all of a sudden the damn thing just took off. It pulled about a 45 degree climbing turn and accelerated and just flat disappeared."


In 1979 Maurice Chatelain, former chief of NASA Communications Systems confirmed that Armstrong had indeed reported seeing two UFOs on the rim of a crater. Chatelain believes that some UFOs may come from our own solar system

"The encounter was common knowledge in NASA, but nobody has talked about it until now."

"...all Apollo and Gemini flights were followed, both at a distance and sometimes also quite closely, by space vehicles of extraterrestrial origin - flying saucers, or UFOs, if you want to call them by that name. Every time it occurred, the astronauts informed Mission Control, who then ordered absolute silence."

"I think that Walter Schirra aboard Mercury 8 was the first of the astronauts to use the code name 'Santa Claus' to indicate the presence of flying saucers next to space capsules. However, his announcements were barely noticed by the general public. It was a little different when James Lovell on board the Apollo 8 command module came out from behind the moon and said for everybody to hear: 'PLEASE BE INFORMED THAT THERE IS A SANTA CLAUS.' Even though this happened on Christmas Day 1968, many people sensed a hidden meaning in those words."


ufos and austronauts

So now when you hear an astronaut say "santa clause is real", you know theyre not talking about santa clause.




posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 12:29 AM
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What is it with you believers. You are always presenting the same old evidence to help your case. Look for something new, geez. This whole astronaut shtick has been done to death already.



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 12:30 AM
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reply to post by Chovy
 

Yes, Gordon Cooper says he saw UFO's. The trouble is there is no corroboration.

In all, a total of more than a dozen men had responded to my letter (including commanding officers and weather officers) : their opinions were unanimous that no such event had occurred at Neubiberg..
www.ufoevidence.org...

Great, a completely unsubstantiated tale about Neil Armstrong.

Deke Slayton saw something he couldn't identify. He says about it;

Maybe there was something about the environment and the setup that confused me. I don't know. Or it could have been something unknown. (I don't automatically presume that is was from Alpha Centauri, just because I can't identify it.) It's still an open question to me.
He also says,

There have been two or three space program reports that have gotten picked up by the UFO people, but those weren't legitimate.
(Deke! by Donald K. Slayton 1994, p. 50)

Maurice Chatelain was not chief of NASA Communications Systems. In fact, he was never employed by NASA.

"when James Oberg contacted Chatelain's employers he learned that Chatelain was no longer employed by them when Apollo 11 landed on the moon. If he was no longer an employee of a NASA sub-contractor then he could not have been present in any so-called "secret room" where he could overhear the confidential communications of the astronauts on the lunar surface. He was a low-level engineer who worked for a NASA sub-contractor who built the Apollo communications systems. His status as the "head of communications" (as some UFOlogists have claimed), is entirely false."
ronrecord.com...

And yes, James Lovell did make that Santa Claus comment on December 25, 1968. But it was on Gemini 6A that Schirra pulled his joke, not Mercury 8.

On the Gemini 6 flight, Schirra and crew mate Thomas Stafford reported to Mission Control (completely deadpan) that they'd seen "some kind of UFO" consisting of "a command module and eight smaller modules in front. The pilot of the command module is wearing a red suit" (Santa Claus). Then, they played "Jingle Bells" on a harmonica and a set of sleigh bells they'd smuggled aboard with them.
www.imdb.com...

[edit on 4/23/2009 by Phage]



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 12:42 AM
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I wish Neil Armstrong would join ats. I'm sure he would make some interesting threads.



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 01:19 AM
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Oberg's critique of Cooper is pitiful.

He's actually suggesting pictures from the Edward AFB saucer landing, are already published in a book ? And that Cooper and the camera crew were exaggerating ? It was only..... A WEATHER BALLOON ?


Get outta here.


And since Oberg couldn't find anyone to corroborate Cooper's testimony about getting scrambled to chase saucers over Germany, it must be a fabrication ?
Events like that are highly classified. Most people do keep their security oaths.

Oberg talked to Librarian of Congress official Marcia Smith, about her involvement with President Carter's secret UFO studies. But he won't discuss that matter. Give me a break. I wonder how much they're paying him ?

I'll trust the MIT PhD Astronaut over a science "journalist".


[edit on 23-4-2009 by Schaden]



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 01:43 AM
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reply to post by Schaden
 


No one said Cooper's 1951 sighting was a fabrication. There is no reason to doubt that he saw something. But no one else claims to have seen anything, even though Cooper says others did. So Cooper broke his "security oaths" by talking about something he saw? Did Slayton do the same in his book?

Cooper was not present at the Edward's incident. This has been confirmed.

Regarding the May 2nd, 1957 Edwards AFB case, after carefully examining what Jim Oberg says about it (and checking it against others' research), it appears we have to give him his due here and say astronaut Gordon Cooper did indeed insert himself into this case which he apparently wasn't actually involved in. Jim is correct about Cooper in this instance.

www.cohenufo.org...
There is also no indication that the object had three "legs", landed, or took off, as Cooper tells it.



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 07:04 AM
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Originally posted by Schaden
Oberg's critique of Cooper is pitiful.

He's actually suggesting pictures from the Edward AFB saucer landing, are already published in a book ? And that Cooper and the camera crew were exaggerating ? It was only..... A WEATHER BALLOON ?


Get outta here.


Aside from exhibiting your own closed-mindedness, you misrepresent what I have written. James McDonald, the leading pro-UFO scientist of the 1960's, described this event to the US Congress in his testimony. There was no 'Cooper' -- even the primary witness Gettys asserts that he didn't even know Cooper was at Edwards at that time, much less was 'his boss'.

Did you read it and misunderstand it, or just chose here to misrepresent it?


And since Oberg couldn't find anyone to corroborate Cooper's testimony about getting scrambled to chase saucers over Germany, it must be a fabrication ?
Events like that are highly classified. Most people do keep their security oaths.


Again, I urge people interested in the story to read my original -- and along the way, calibrate this guy's accuracy in retelling what he claims he read.


Oberg talked to Librarian of Congress official Marcia Smith, about her involvement with President Carter's secret UFO studies. But he won't discuss that matter. Give me a break. I wonder how much they're paying him ?


Typical delusional defamations... As long as folks keep getting away with this kind of stuff, these threads will never get anywhere real.


I'll trust the MIT PhD Astronaut over a science "journalist".



Who's he talking about here? Imaginary characters?

[edit on 23-4-2009 by JimOberg]



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by JimOberg


Oberg talked to Librarian of Congress official Marcia Smith, about her involvement with President Carter's secret UFO studies. But he won't discuss that matter. Give me a break. I wonder how much they're paying him ?


Typical delusional defamations... As long as folks keep getting away with this kind of stuff, these threads will never get anywhere real.



Am I even talking to the real Jim Oberg.

I'll play along.

You do know Marcia Smith ? Do you deny exchanging emails with Grant Cameron concerning Daniel Sheehan's testimony ? Do you deny calling Smith on the phone to inquire about what Cameron told you of her involvement, along with Sheehan, in two classified govt UFO reports for the Carter Administration ? What is your version of events ?

Because Cameron claims you clammed up after talking to Smith. And would not tell him the details of your conversation with her, to check the validity of Sheehan's story. Not even a simple explanation. Like Marcia says Sheehan is full of it. Or Marcia says Sheehan is correct. Or Marcia says she can't talk about it....

You've held a highly compartmented security clearance Mr. Oberg ? Do you understand the concept of need to know ? Your position is ET visitors and flying saucers are bunk ? Did you take over Klass's job ?



[edit on 23-4-2009 by Schaden]



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 05:22 PM
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Originally posted by Schaden
Am I even talking to the real Jim Oberg.

I'll play along.


Always happy to answer questions.

Not accusations.

And certainly not fantasy-based thinly-disguised smears.

Please try again, and this time pretend you're a grown-up.

I've been a colleague of Marcia Smith regarding the Soviet space program throughout the 1970's and 1980's. I've never seen any 'classified' UFO reports she may (or may not) have produced -- there was one monograph, unclassified, I was aware of, that I did read. At some point she retired from the Congressional Research Service -- we haven't been in touch since then.

Our communications are private. Learn to live with that.



[edit on 23-4-2009 by JimOberg]



posted on Apr, 23 2009 @ 07:32 PM
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Ok sorry if my snide comments offended you Mr. Oberg, it was rude. But I think I accurately represented your view.

The weather balloon was not your direct analysis, it was the Air Force's, but your article agreed with that assessment saying "this case looks pretty solid", despite Dr. Mcdonald's detailed Congressional testimony about the two witnesses seeing:

a "domed-disk UFO"


He and Gettys both said it had a golden color, looked somewhat like an inverted plate with a dome on top, and had square holes or panels around the dome. Gettys thought that the holes were circular, not square. It was moving away from them, seemed to glow with its own luminosity, and had a hazy, indistinct halo around its rim, both mentioned."

"The photos were shortly taken by base military authorities and were never seen again by the men. In a session later that day, Bittick [was] informed that they had seen a weather balloon distorted by the desert atmospheric effects".


www.ufoevidence.org...


Does any of that jive with a weather balloon ?

You said you started your investigation by talking to the Edwards AFB PAO, who remembered the incident but in a different way ?

Major Robert F. Spence's official AF explanation quoted in your article sounds like disinformation to me. You stated the 1st hand witness Getty doesn't believe the balloon explanation. So why do you side with the AF ?
I guess if you don't believe there is a conspiracy or the idea the govt keeps UFO information highly classified, you'd have no reason to doubt what a public affairs officer tells you.

You said Cooper played no role at all. I presume you made that statement because the two witnesses didn't realize Cooper was there at Edwards AFB. Certainly if a UFO was filmed, and had to be forwarded to higher authorities, the duty officer would be involved in that process.

As I recall, Cooper said in an interview the order came from Washington NOT to develop the film, but that he did see the negatives with his own eyes. He spoke of following the chain of command to higher and higher authority. He was a second hand witness to the actual UFO, but was involved. He's said the Air Force isn't involved in the coverup because he'd have known about it. That's one instance where I must disagree with him. There are classified operations general and flag officers are not fully brief on, never mind a colonel.


Now, in fact those photographs did not vanish after all: they had been sent to Project Blue Book, at Wright- Patterson AFB in Dayton, Ohio, per regulations


Are you aware of General Bollender's 1969 memo that states "reports of UFOs which could affect national security are not part of the Blue Book system" and Hynek said he felt "used and abused" after having worked on the UFO problem for USAF for 2 decades and yet "all the hardcore UFO cases, with pilot-UFO close encounters so close they could read writing on them, were going upstairs".

UFO events involving natl security are routed per JANAP 146 and they are classified. A UFO sighting at Edwards AFB would count as involving natl security. It's very hard for me to believe the AF was completely forthcoming.

I'm curious to know the providence of the photos cited in Steiger's book. Were they declassified ? You mention researchers that got a hold of them ? That's got to be some kind of record. A UFO incident sparks up the media, researchers ask for the files and photos taken by military spec theodolites, and the Air Force turns it over ?


You noted the AF explanation never got any press. I wonder if it was because of the IMO weak explanation ?
Another damn WEATHER BALLOON.


That's a bummer you can't address Daniel Sheehan's story involving your friend Marcia Smith. He's certainly a very credible person in my estimate.
I believe you did ask her about it. What she said to you, only you know.
If Ms. Smith is under security obligations, I would not expect her to break that oath, or you to betray anything she told you in confidence.




[edit on 23-4-2009 by Schaden]



posted on Apr, 24 2009 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by Schaden
Ok sorry .... But I think ....
Spence's official AF explanation quoted in your article sounds like disinformation to me... So why do you side with the AF ? ...
I guess if ....
I presume ...
Certainly if ...
As I recall...
I wonder if it was because ...
That's a bummer ...
He's certainly a very credible person in my estimate. ...
I believe ...
I would not expect her to break that oath...



This tells us a lot about what you believe, and new evidence that I've found is clearly not in that category. It's clear I'm wasting my time.

Enjoy yourself.



posted on Apr, 24 2009 @ 01:47 PM
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reply to post by JimOberg
 


That was a very poor quality rebuttal Jim. It did nothing to refute the points made.

[edit on 24-4-2009 by Malcram]



posted on Apr, 24 2009 @ 02:56 PM
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Originally posted by Malcram
reply to post by JimOberg
 


That was a very poor quality rebuttal Jim. It did nothing to refute the points made.

[edit on 24-4-2009 by Malcram]


Yes, I agree it was not a rebuttal at all. I couldn't figure out what the 'points' were that needed rebutting -- I'm sure he believes all the things he posted, and I doubt anything I have to say will change that, so where's the value of another spitting contest?

Regarding Cooper's stories, the most frustrating angle is this: Cooper and Mitchell spent a year training together (1968-9) as the backup LM crew on Apollo-10. Cooper could have been expected to talk a lot about his UFO experiences, especially as Mitchell would have been one of the most receptive listeners you could imagine.

But Mitchell has politely (as always) demurred from disclosing anything he learned from Cooper about Cooper's 'UFO experiences'.

That's frustrating. There's a big temptation to speculate about why Mitchell finds such accounts non-reportable, when he passes on accounts of much lower credibility from other people he's talked to. But such speculation can quickly degenerate into fantasy -- as we see around here all the time.

Maybe we should all pass the word that the next time Mitchell speaks in public, he should be (politely) asked to tell what he learned about UFOs from Gordon Cooper. It can't hurt Cooper, or himself -- unless (speculating) the tales Mitchell heard in 1968-9 were strikingly different from tales Cooper told later in public. That would harm Cooper's credibility.... and might not help the pro-UFO arguments.

Nah -- shouldn't speculate too wildly.

But the reason the question is important is that other people who reported Cooper's stories from that time period did report stories that bear little resemblance to those he told to UFO conventions in later years.

For example, an associate of Cooper's told me that about 1971 the version of the 'fleets of UFOs' story he heard Cooper tell, occurred not in Germany but in the American midwest.

For example, in 1973 Cooper -- on tape -- told an Italian UFO writer named Ferrando that he had recently been a witness to a UFO landing in Florida where landing legs left imprints in the ground -- and years later, that landing story had become transferred to Edwards AFB, California.

For example, Stuart Nixon, then head of NICAP, told me in 1976 that he had discussed UFOs with Cooper 'recently' and Cooper mentioned the excitement over the 1951 German sightings -- but then added that it all died out when it became clear -- and he agreed with the conclusion -- that they had been jet-stream entrained weather balloons. Why would Cooper have told NICAP that (NICAP probably still has Nixon's own written report in its archives), and then ten years later, told a different story to UFO buffs?

For example: when completing my first draft report on the 'Gordon Cooper UFO sightings' in 1982 (YES -- nineteen eighty two), I mailed him a copy (we had exchanged several letters on the subject). To check out how closely he read the text, and to jog his memory, I placed several tracer-factoids in the report, that gave inaccurate factual information that I thought Cooper knew -- and would thus correct. One tracer-factoid was a report on my earliest account of the Germany 'fleets' story, in which I wrote -- deliberately wrongly -- that the official debunking explanation had been 'seed pods'. The witness had actually told me that the official prosaic explanation had been 'migrating spiders', as my contemporary notes showed. But years later, when Cooper recounted the story on Art Bell's show, he ended with ridiculing the official explanation that he remembered being given by the AF -- 'seed pods', he snorted in derision.

But the 'seed pod' meme was my counterfeit tracer-factoid from my manuscript I had mailed him [again, with no intent to deceive -- just to validate how well he reviewed and corrected what I explicityly said was an unfinished draft report]. It lodged in his memory and many years later popped forth as an allegedly authentic event-recollection.

Why did Cooper's UFO stories mutate so bizarrely during this period? Mitchell may be able to cast light on this mystery. He won't.

It's a question deserving of serious discussion -- and Ed Mitchell could (if he wants) make a significant contribution to understanding what was going on. But -- he doesn't.

We can all take action to encourage Mitchell to change his mind on this -- dare I say it? -- coverup, that he is in control of.

The other service Mitchell could do is help clarify why Cooper was booted from the astronaut program at this time, ostensibly for malperformance in training. He had every reason to be bitter -- and vengeful.

PS Thanks for the candid rebuke -- always welcome.



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