Should we save America or just let it Fall? - Seriously

I don't know what to think anymore.

Do you like the concept of America?

Is there a better alternative as far as countries go?

What can you as an average citizen do?

Do you even care?

What do you care about?

Personally I think that if something is to be done to save the concept of America it will have to be done by a small but very motivated and dedicated group of believers.

It is apparent that the masses just don't give a crap 'bout nothin'.

I think it is about to get bloody and I think the lights around the world are about to go out. The entire human race hangs by a thread, I hope you realize that. We're such a stupid species we might just wipe ourselves out. Game over.

Is this the best we can do?

Stop the financial Apocalypse of the U.S. - Tommorrow is a better day
www.abovetopsecret.com...

America is cool..as far as an alternate country to live in i wouldn't know. . I care about alot of things but its wierd how todays events have been unfolding. Maybe i'm a little concerned. . Online forums get the messege out but not through. The best thing to do is to get our voices heard until the masses do start caring. But maybe the world aint as simple or as complicated as we may think.

People do not know what to think or HOW to think.

Snap out of it.

America gives us the most freedom of any country in the history
of the planet. Is it perfect-of course not.
It's a work in progress.
Americans have used their freedom to become the most innovative
and creative people ever on the planet.


Have you been creative or innovative or stagnant or stale?
America is you.
America is what you make it.
It's only a bit 0ver 250 years old.
You want to throw it away without even trying to be creative.
That is pathetic to the point of extreme wimpdom.
That is what is called a poverty of vision in the extreme.

Too many people do not fulfill their own potential.
They are not carrying their own weight.
They are insincere, parasitical and a burden on the community.
Since they are stale and stagnant they whine instead of seeing the
VAST POTENTIAL of the MAJESTIC CREATIVITY of America.

America is made up of individuals. All different in variety.
Sure there have been misleaders like Bush who have squandered
it's resources and lacked vision. But would you blow up the starship
Enterprise just because there was a temporarily bad Captain?
That would be idiotic in the extreme.

I know exactly how you feel... however I don't think we have one bit of say in the matter.

You have to understand something... The United States is just a country. it's just a piece of land.

It might be our home, but it's not our permenant home.


Try to think more like this... when you have all the money under your controll, and then you have all the military under your controll.... what do you want to controll next?

Not the people... but the minds of people... and even more importantly... if you get greedy enough... you want thier souls.

America can fall for all I care... As long as I have a soul that belongs to God in the end, I don't care what happens.

Come on.
Ever seen 'Saving Private Ryan'?
Do you know what people have gone thru to give us the freedom
that America gives us?
No one is holding you back except your own mental poverty.
You are free to create the best rock and roll band if you want.

People in African villages have to walk miles just for water.
There's no toilet paper, coffee, tv, internet, freeways and on and on.

Have a little appreciation and self-respect-please.
Who is blocking you from developing the next spaceship, electric car,
solar powered home?
Anyone can buy a used electric guitar, learn how to play then
create a rock band. Then have hordes of babes throwing their
panties at them. Rain forest tribes, Chinese laborers can't do this.

Any American can do be CREATIVE if they are not lazy and dumb.

If America falls, a large part of the world economy goes with it, and much of the world will be plunged into an economic depression. Large numbers of people will starve to death. All in all, not a good thing if you value human life.

Originally posted by Electricneo
No one is holding you back except your own mental poverty.

Ummmm, yes and no.

Yes - I agree we are only limited by our thoughts.

NO -Our entire society is sinking in quicksand - We have too much dead weight holding us back.

Its hard to be creatively free when your ideas are bought and sold or shelved in the market place.

Tho not impossible. Its not as easy as some here make it sound. If it were that easy, the country would not be in the shape it is in now.

Its one thing to speak from above, but another to see the glory from below.

In other words, try to see it from all angles, not just the ones that look good. It will give a more accurate preception of what is going on, and what is reality.



Cheers!!!!

reply to post by Electricneo



look I'm just saying that our country was built on genocide, slavery, and war.

yes... The USA is guilty of genocide.




when I see videos like this... I start to agree with the OP.

not only did we kill off all the Indians, but I'm pretty sure our leaders are drinking blood out of it.

Have you ever loked at a birdseye view of Washington D.C.?

What symbols do you see?

I don't know man... but America doesn't look so great anymore in my eyes.

i think actually that we are past the brink....the point of no return. Whether its worthwhile or not, i dont believe we can save america now even if we choose to. Our government is thrashing in the dark trying to mitigate the fall, but i think much of what they do to forestall it is just in fact going to make it worse.

reply to post by pexx421


Im not so sure about that. I think America will be saved, it just will be saved in a different way and become a different America from what it once was. It wont be the land of abundance anymore, it wont be the land of excess anymore. It will be the land of regressive progression..ie divided into have's and have not's and be something to the likes of how the world is depicted in Blade Runner, the have not's below, the have's above. No in between.

Seems almost like that now doesnt it?

Time will tell.




Cheers!!!!

america falls then we are all screwed

this isnt 1492 and we can sail the ocean blue for better places to raise children

there are no more red skinned whose land we can conquer

if america fails

the world is truly doomed to armageddon

what must be done is the righteous must overcome the evil and make this a land that our forefathers wished it to be, and died to create

the corrupt must be disarmed and stripped of power replacing them with the righteous

not religious

we must separate church and state and leave it that way, if america is to survive

if the earth with us as humans as the dominant species is to survive and thrive, we must rid our leaders of the ignorant ones and find a way to create a nation based not on greed and power but humanity and compassion

Burns, thats kind of what i meant by past the brink. I didnt mean that the US was going to fall off the face of the earth, or that all americans were going to die or anything like that..... i just meant the death of the "american dream". The death of "truth justice, and freedom for all". Not that it ever truly existed, but in the past we have been able to at least feel we were fighting for that. I think those illusions will soon go.

I think the issue is what are you going to do about it. It is not a question of can I do anything about it. WHAT are you going to do about it?

Things to ask yourself:
Do you like living in America?
What exactly about America do you have a beef with?
(after identifying this then you can proceed to the next question)
How can it be fixed?
What are you going to do to help the "fix"?

Look, I love America. I live in it and I have more freedoms and opportunities than the rest of the world. No, I do not like all the history of America as one already pointed out that America was built upon slavery and murder. But in the history of civilization, what country was not built upon by some form of slavery or murder?

My beef with America is that it seems that our governmental system has forgotten the "representation by the people" and focused on the "for the people". I view our government like a waterwheel. The people are the water. the water which goes into the wheel are our votes. Water goes in (we vote) our votes count and the wheel turns. It seems that either not enough water is going into the wheel or someone has jammed and is manipulating the wheel from turning. Eventually, the back-logged water will flood the wheel by force and one of two things can happen. The wheel starts turning again or the water overtakes and demolishes the water-wheel house. Take it or leave it but this is my analogy.

My encouragement is that we do not give up on our governmental system. Continue voting and participating. Inform others. Encourage others. If you do not have a solution to the problems but know someone who does and is trustworthy, back them up.

As you see bills you object to being presented, you may be asking yourself, "What can an average American citizen do?". The answer is we have always had the power to change things. We just never did anything. We have to put most of the blame on ourselves for allowing this civil liberties being breached. Senate has already passed this, it is stalled in congress, though.

If the majority of the registered voters in that person's precinct demand they vote one way regarding a bill, the representative is most likely going to vote your way. Otherwise we will not vote for them nest term. They will not be re-elected. Most representatives want to be re-elected. All of us need to spread this secret to all and all of us need to start exercising our voices and votes.

Here are Direct links to find both your congressman and Senate so you can contact them.
Find and write your congressman
Find and write your Senator

If worse comes to worse and revolution is the only option left, at least you can say I tried and gave it my all and you can feel better about participation in the revolution. Otherwise you are just part of the problem and not part of the solution.


[edit on 1/27/2009 by Amaxium]

America is just like the Roman Empire. Just like the Roman Empire, America is destined to fall just the same.

So to answer the question, I think something should be done to delayed the falling of America. That's where President Obama comes in at.

To me, the thought of the US falling would actually help humanity. It is only at times of despair, that humanity will realize its' faults.

All things come to an end at some point, spawning the ideals and understanding of the mistakes in the past.

Just think .. In our day in age, how many of you think even half of the worlds population would be able to survive with nothing. If the US were to fail and crumble, It would force us back a couple hundred years. That does not mean we wont go on, but remember and re-invent the skill we have lost over the years.

Funny how the folks who claim that the US is a "work in progress" start screaming whenever anyone wants to make a truly significant change.

The US is toast, a zombie nation staggering on because the world needs it to, but no matter what it probably hasn't got much more than a year at most. It will fall like the USSR did for the same reasons: a lack of money and a failed philosophical system.

Every early capitalist got his startup money the old-fashioned way: he stole it. He either stole the accumulated wealth outright (gold and silver), or stole from the future (slavery, nonsustainable lumbering and farming techniques). The truth is that if you actually work to make things, creating wealth in that way is too slow for financier-capitalists. Since they can't make fortunes quickly like that anymore, they turn to hedge-funds, CDOs, and other "exotic" financial instruments to get their wealth fix, and the result is a bunch of funny money billionaires and a collapsed economy.

Capitalism needs some limits, without them ruthless wealth-building will never end.

What we need is a discussion of what exactly it means to be a citizen of the US, what benefits we derive therefrom, what responsibilities and duties we owe to our fellow citizens and what the costs are. We need to define the social contract we live under.

In discussing benefits and costs let's try to keep them definable and measureable.

For instance, I am not particularly threatened by Islamic terrorists. None are threatening me, my family or friends, or any of their buildings or businesses. I have offered no threat to them, I don't interact with them, their families or businesses in ways that would annoy them enough to get violent with me. However, some of my fellow citizens have done these things to them, compete with them in business and annoy the holy hell out of them. Those people, my so-called fellow citizens, are calling upon and deriving a benefit based on our social contract, the Constitution: mutual defense against enemies. But their enemies are not mine, and I derive no benefit from whatever the outcome is, I just get stuck with the bill both in blood and money, while they are making money in ways that require me to defend behavior I find criminal and reprehensible. What kind of social contract is that?


So to answer the OP...I think the nation's gone beyond salvage, but the Constitution's ideals aren't.

reply to post by In nothing we trust


America will not fail. I think we have just lost our way and we will find the path again. It is the people that make our nation great not the idiots in government.

We need to get back to a government that represents the people and has our best interests in mind instead of corporations and special interest groups. I think the Democratic and Republican parties are so corrupt that they can't be salvaged. We should revolt against the two party system and start voting for a new group of politicians uncorrupted by the machine in Washington. The biggest problem to overcome is that most American sheeple follow what the MSM tells them. They don't bother to do their own research. You either vote democrat or republican because that is all they see on TV and in the news papers. It is massive brain washing that is tough to get away from. Once you do the news becomes nothing but comedy and the manipulation becomes so obvious.

I do not think there will be violence. I think Americans will come together and help each other in bad times. We survive together as one nation or we die together.

We are a country composed of misfits.......We are a GREAT LAND. When it is time for us to be what we are meant to be we will stand. Like in WWII the Japanese stated, "We have wakened a sleeping Tiger......" we will rise. Yes we are in a tough time right now. But think of your own lives......have you not gone thru tough times?? Yes and have you not emerged stronger. WE are finding our mettle. Each generation has to endure assaults......this is our generations attack. Our grandfathers mothers had the Nazi's and socialism too.....and the depression......but also witnessed after the bad the great good. WE will emerge even better. There are those that will stand and be leaders. Each generation has leaders. Usually they don't know it until they are needed. God will preserve us as a salt of the earth if we will turn and repent and face our God. He will be out God and we will be his people.......We are being disciplined for our greed.......but we are loved nontheless. ...........Blessing and hope.

Originally posted by apacheman

..I am not particularly threatened by Islamic terrorists. None are threatening me, my family or friends, or any of their buildings or businesses. I have offered no threat to them, I don't interact with them, their families or businesses in ways that would annoy them enough to get violent with me. However, some of my fellow citizens have done these things to them, compete with them in business and annoy the holy hell out of them. Those people, my so-called fellow citizens, are calling upon and deriving a benefit based on our social contract, the Constitution: mutual defense against enemies. But their enemies are not mine, and I derive no benefit from whatever the outcome is, I just get stuck with the bill both in blood and money, while they are making money in ways that require me to defend behavior I find criminal and reprehensible. What kind of social contract is that?

apacheman,

So what you are saying is that since you nor any of your friends and family have been attacked by Islamic terrorist that it's not your problem and you could care less if they kill your fellow Americans as long as you don't know them. I guess you were lucky enough not to have any friends or family on those planes that were plowed into the Pentagon and WTC or working in those building on that day. No friends on the USS Cole when it was bombed or in the Kenya Embasy when it was destroyed.

You're right all those people who died in those attacks were asking for it including the poor innocent children that were on those planes. They must have been competing with them in business and annoying the holy hell out of them.

People like you make me sick giving excuses for terrorist actions against innocent civilians.



[edit on 1/27/2009 by Erasurehead]