It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Are we responsible enough if...

page: 1
0

log in

join
share:

posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 05:37 AM
link   
Imagine this:

Say there comes a day when someone is smart to introduce & implement the "Free-Card""....The Free-Card would be like a passport with your own bank-account attached to it. Now imagine if Everyone in the whole world would get a virtual-salary" from (say a value of 2000 Euro each month) from yes 1 government who is only allowed to manage and make sure we get the virtual-salary each month for Free ofcourse.

Then the governments would bail the whole world (All personal) out in their valuta into the Free-card" value....Taxes will no longer exist :flame
even forbidden) ...

Now, ...would we be able to be Responsible for our surroundings/environment & eachother and Life in general if we had access to a simple but possibly very Free-ing Life like that??

It would also mean that we wouldn't have to work anymore like we do now as slaves....but if we are not able to resolve this responsibly to take care of eachother then it might cause more trouble then freedom?...Or say we could normally do work and get payed on the "Free-Card" extra for the work done...and it would mean just extra income for those who work just like now......

Alright, alot of bussinesses would have to be won over too to accept something like the virtual "Free-Card" as payement...but ...anything is possible now....surely if it is Free and puts the shackles of 90% of the worlds population....

Now, the Big question is....Could we be responsible enough for something like this?

Your thoughts please.....




posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 05:58 AM
link   
By asking if we would be responsible enough for the free card system I have to ask what those responsibilities consist of.

Would we be responsible for road and other state and federal maintenance?

Would we be schooling our children or would there still be public schools?

You have a good scenario going, just need a few more ideas about our principal responsibilities before I can answer your questions.

This is fun...please continue.

[edit on 6-12-2008 by dizziedame]



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 06:25 AM
link   
Well you're right...i wanted to add a few more things as:

Our primal-needs such as Healthcare; - Education; - and environment maintainance & Energy supply: should be taken care of By Government and Free of costs....other then that it is now. Now as it is our primal-needs are taken into bussiness vulnerable to the forces of competition between Businesses and their Price-policies which are frankly disgusting and enslaving us all.

As for the Responsibility...:
If we were all thrown into a situation where no one actually would have a need to work anymore because we all are provided with the "Free-Card" and it;s value each month then there would obviously be a problem where occupation of work-places is concerend. BUT...if we add on top of the "Free-Card" and extra income through working then that problem can be solved too ....as i think it;s in our nature to appreciate that part of being valued for work done.

It's actually just an adding scenario...just the question is would we be responsible enough to handle it and appreciate such a turn around or would we be appreciating this turn-around and then sit-back for the rest of our lives and let everything become sloppy and not taking care of eachother and the needs and calls that would come inevitably with such a turn-around?...

Well?.....



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 07:03 AM
link   
This is all vaguely reminiscent of "Brave New World". No thanks. Read the book. Don't need to experience this "utopia" any more intimately than that.

I was only in eighth grade when I read it - about a million years ago - but the imagery has stuck fast in my memory. I've read many dystopic novels. Honestly, I think it's time we all did. It's clearly where we're headed, particularly because more people are giving these scenarios genuine consideration as viable lifestyles.

I will state categorically here and now that I will accept nothing but my own right to self-determination, a dissolution of borders, a money-free society, small town "government" and entirely free and unbounded education when chosen but never imposed.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 07:12 AM
link   
Thank you, I understand more clearly now.

The free card system seems very close to our welfare system in the USA.

We would, I suspect, have about the same situation we have now. Those that will work will and those that won't will not work.

There will always be a part of society that expects someone else to take all the responsibility and do nothing to take care of themselves or others.

I would have to say we, as a whole, are not responsible enough for the free card.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 07:23 AM
link   
reply to post by dizziedame
 


I don't know about "responsible" enough. Why do we want a system that takes all of our choices away and allows us to be anything but conscious and cognizant at all times? Why shouldn't we make choices and abide by the results of that choice? What would be the benefit of any other system?

I could go on forever about this sort of thing. My mind is racing at the moment with things I would love to explain, but this is a simple forum.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 07:29 AM
link   

Originally posted by CosmicEgg
This is all vaguely reminiscent of "Brave New World". No thanks. Read the book. Don't need to experience this "utopia" any more intimately than that.

I was only in eighth grade when I read it - about a million years ago - but the imagery has stuck fast in my memory. I've read many dystopic novels. Honestly, I think it's time we all did. It's clearly where we're headed, particularly because more people are giving these scenarios genuine consideration as viable lifestyles.

I will state categorically here and now that I will accept nothing but my own right to self-determination, a dissolution of borders, a money-free society, small town "government" and entirely free and unbounded education when chosen but never imposed.



Cosmicegg...i think i see your concern for being controled...but i don't see if we take responsibility ourself and stay on top of so called politics (and not the "oh no please i don;t want anything to do with that attitude as now) why our right for self-setermination or a dissolution of borders and as i said too, a money free society, small town government with would be impossible.....clearly you don;t trust the existing system as it is now neither?



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 07:31 AM
link   

Originally posted by CosmicEgg
reply to post by dizziedame
 


I don't know about "responsible" enough. Why do we want a system that takes all of our choices away and allows us to be anything but conscious and cognizant at all times? Why shouldn't we make choices and abide by the results of that choice? What would be the benefit of any other system?

I could go on forever about this sort of thing. My mind is racing at the moment with things I would love to explain, but this is a simple forum.


Cosmicegg...i think you didn't read this simple forum well enough....nowhere is stated that our choices would be taken away.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 07:40 AM
link   
reply to post by CosmicEgg
 

You are wise beyond your years.

Even though I am a simple minded person I do enjoy hearing more complicated conversation.

Do continue. I'm always ready to listen to our youth and future leaders.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 08:00 AM
link   
I agree with Cosmic Egg. This is a system for people who pass on their responisbilities and lose their freedoms because of it.

You know what gives the ruling elite it's power? Centralization of the power. You know what systems like this and all 1 world government systems are? Centralization of Power.

You know what gives the power back to the people? Decentralization. Where the people are in charge of themselves and dealing with the responsibility that comes with it. The ruling elite class no longer exists because there is no centralized power to corrupt and take over/manipulate.

Not to mention centralized power is just a bad idea in general, even if the people in charge were of the best intentions. You have 1 program for the entire population. Changes come very slowly and you are stuck with this 1 program. You as a person have very little say in this system with your 1 vote in 6 billion. The people in charge change slowly, and you have to vote for 1 person on 100 issues. Even if you had everyone vote on the issues themselves, you are still just 1 person in 6 billion. This allows the majority to rule over the minority as well - thats what happened with slavery and civil rights loss.

When you have decentralization then instead of 1 program, you have 100's. Each program working to be the best. Where in 1 program you could only try 1 new idea at a time, you have 100's of programs able to try new things out that work. Each program is also more able to adapt to the needs of that community. When something works well in a program, the other programs are free to adopt those programs. When 1 program does bad, you have plenty of good examples to look at to fix it, all tested and proven. In a centralized government you're just stuck to promises and hope that the politican makes it better. You in your local community make up a much larger % of the vote, this means you have more say in how the program you live under works. Instead of 1 in 6 billion, you are 1 in a few thousand. Thus, the power is actually in the hands of the people, and people in China aren't ruling over the rest of the world, only their own lives and communities.

This is the system the US was actually founded on in the beginning. It was followed until about 100 years ago. Before we centralized healthcare and education the US was #1 in the world in all fields that could be measured. And for exactly this reason. There was also a draw to small towns because the smaller the town the more power the individual had. Where as in centralization there is no draw to the small town and they are turning into ghost towns.

Every single person that falls victim to centralized government does so because they imagine themselves as being the one in charge or the things being done as they would want it. But I'm sorry, it just doesn't work that way. The people who manipulate and corrupt will find a way to get themselves in power, because that is what those kind of people do - try to get as much power as possible. All that is really happening is you are gift wrapping the world for them.


[edit on 6-12-2008 by badmedia]



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 08:01 AM
link   
CosmicEgg, my mind is racing also. I am currently being treated with massive doses of antibiotics, prednisone and hydrocodone cough syrup.

The prednisone has somewhat affected my eyes and I may not be reading the cough syrup directions correctly and could not be taking the properly prescribed amount of the elixir.

I, too, was in the eighth grade once long ago. But I still have many of your dreams and expectations.

I want nothing I did not earn and I want the freedom to do with my life as I please.

Public education and borderless boarders are two of my favorite causes.

As you know we are failing on both fronts.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 08:13 AM
link   
@Badmedia....

Firstly, i think Cosmicegg has taken this topic to his/her own direction in assuming our choices would be taken away and of centralisation....well, if that's the problem then there is a solution for it...

To not let the politics centralise us....only their system to get us paid for every-month ....and this i wanted to say to dizziedame" too....why would we not earn or deserve it?....who told or taught you that?....Why do we need to be ashamed of something what seems like a wellfare system but is as a matter of fact not. I would like you to take a different look at it and try to see it as your birth-right just as is our other primal-needs as education and energy-use...not to mention healthcare...

I'm just trying to look at the current situation with new-eyes and without catholic (or whatever other themed) shame....

[edit on 6-12-2008 by ElisahumanE]



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 08:50 AM
link   
reply to post by ElisahumanE
 


I gave you legitimate understanding and reasons why these things are bad ideas.

People should feel bad about welfare. To the point where they want to get rid of the reasons they need it to begin with. And that would be the federal reserve that inflates the money supply, increasing the prices on everything which makes the people on fixed income hurt the most, and thus even more reliant on others.

But you don't offer people economic freedom where they can be self reliant and not have such a hard time, you tell them to embrace their conditions? That somehow, despite spending way beyond what we can actually afford, it's supposed to be better?

If you want to fix things, it's like this. #1 get rid of the fed, let the government print up money from the treasury under strict regulations so that the money is kept in direct proportion to the amount of goods and services being used. This is so that the money itself keeps it's value and you suffer from neither inflation or deflation. This removes everyone from the economic slavery, and fixes our economy.

Next, you decentralize the social programs and put them back into the hands of the communities. Where the people once again have actual say in their lives and politicans on the state and federal level aren't deciding how to handle the problems of the community.

You then remove all income tax, this is a free country. As you do not have all these federal programs and bureaucracy you do not need to charge income tax. Instead, all taxes are to be paid by the corporations as intended, as they are soulless entities. The corporation pays taxes based on it's profit after costs and labor. So if costs a corporation $5 to make a product and they sell it for $20, then $15 of that is taxable. For this reason they will want to pay the employees more, as that results in less taxable money. And while the corporation may try to raise prices to get extra income after paying these taxes, they will still be in price competition with others.

You also go back to using the constitution properly and any job not specifically listed is off limits. This removes the corporations ability to manipulate and knock out competition through regulation. It also keeps the government in check on other issues.

I'm sorry, but this fantasy land of endless government money that pays for everything simply does not exist. Every dollar that is created is a tax on the people, and every time a dollar is created and dumped into welfare you have actually just made the poor even poorer than before. Proven by history itself as all these budgets have been increased time and time again without positive results.



posted on Dec, 6 2008 @ 12:07 PM
link   
Oh look, i think we're already heading in the direction i mentioned...

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Milwaukee neighborhoods could print own money


www.chicagotribune.com

Residents from the Milwaukee neighborhoods of Riverwest and East Side are scheduled to meet Wednesday to discuss printing their own money. The idea is that the local cash could be used at neighborhood stores and businesses, thus encouraging local spending. The result, supporters hope, would be a bustling local economy, even as the rest of the nation deals with a recession.

"You have all these people who have local currency, and they're going to spend it at local stores," said Sura Faraj,...
(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
www.infowars.com
www.topix.com

Related AboveTopSecret.com Discussion Threads:
Massachusetts town adopts their own local currency



new topics

top topics



 
0

log in

join