Shooting at Toys-R-Us in Palm Desert - Over Toys!!!

reply to post by Starwatcher


Agreed...the people of this nation have allowed it to get this bad...noone else. People watch idiots shoot each other over toys, trample to death people over some item on sale, shoot someone and steal their new xbox, shoot someone and steal their new shoes, rob them at gunpoint for their money, allow gangs to run and roam free, etc etc etc etc .....and when the cops and those of us who WANT to put a stop to it by shooting back, kickin some ---, etc...the first thing people of this wonderful nation do is cry foul, scream brutality, want cops fired, jailed, etc....maybe if people started wanting to hang and destory the lives of the ACTUAL scumbags we wouldn't have so many problems..but in a country that makes evil "cool" and society is to stupid to see past it all....we allow it to go on...day in and day it...this is the society YOU wanted by your crying...now deal with it!

The same law under which the law abiding, civil-minded American arms himself , is being used by amoral thugs & criminals to "tool up" .

All men may be equal in the eyes of the law ..... but they are certainly not equal in character . Those in favour of gun ownership, should at least welcome stricter vetting procedures before being allowed to buy a gun .
I know its a right but it needs to shift to being a privilege , if the wheat is ever to be sorted from the chaff.

And as to Turbokids comment that this is why he would bring a gun into a toys`r us , ..... do you really think that what this gunfight needed was another gun ? ( maybe you are just young , and a little reckless )

This is just MHO ,
I am biased , my nations police force are unarmed , ...... i don`t wake at night in a cold sweat at the thought that i have forgotten to lock the front door . Sometimes i don`t think some American`s realise how safe and secure unarmed citizens of other countries are in their homes/ schools workplaces & communities .
Please don`t regard this as a criticism , the urge to defend ones self and loved ones is one of the strongest expressions of human personality.
I just think that every body's quest for "individual protection" is effecting the greater security of your immediate community.

Originally posted by UmbraSumus
I am biased , my nations police force are unarmed , ...... i don`t wake at night in a cold sweat at the thought that i have forgotten to lock the front door . Sometimes i don`t think some American`s realise how safe and secure unarmed citizens of other countries are in their homes/ schools workplaces & communities .

You mean like Mumbai, India?

Dude, in an armed society like America, especially New York City, if some punk whips out a gun in a subway car, 10 passengers will whip out their guns and aim it at the punk's head.

God bless America.

[edit on 29-11-2008 by ATS4dummies]

It is a lot easier for a country to decide to allow greater numbers of its citizenry to arm themselves than attempt to dis-arm a nation. That is something that ATS has taught me , Americans like their guns

..if some punk whips out a gun in a subway car, 10 passengers will whip out their guns and aim it at the punk's head. Originally posted by ATS4dummies

Now why does that not make me feel safer , i`m sorry i couldn`t raise children in such an environment.
I`ll leave you to live it ~ i`ll just watch it at the cinema........ on screen that is .

Originally posted by UmbraSumus

Now why does that not make me feel safer , i`m sorry i couldn`t raise children in such an environment.
I`ll leave you to live it ~ i`ll just watch it at the cinema........ on screen that is .

And when one of your children are the VICTIMS of some scumbag...then what? Are you going to sit back and say, oh well I made sure my children were defensless in a world that is full of pukes?

Sorry but REALITY reaches everyone at some point...those of us who prepare for it prosper...those of us who don't...well we all know that outcome.

[edit on 11/29/2008 by rcwj75]

Originally posted by UmbraSumus

..if some punk whips out a gun in a subway car, 10 passengers will whip out their guns and aim it at the punk's head. Originally posted by ATS4dummies

Now why does that not make me feel safer , i`m sorry i couldn`t raise children in such an environment.
I`ll leave you to live it ~ i`ll just watch it at the cinema........ on screen that is .

Probably because you have been indoctrinated since birth to become part of a class known as "victim slaves" where you see everyone as either a victim (you would call them citizens), part of the problem ("them" in the us vs them sense), or part of the government (your masters).

God forbid you think that people are by and large decent and have enough mental capability and moral fortitude to resist becoming a mindless gun-toting murderer when simply handed a gun.

Everyone who is against an armed citizenry has either a very negative view of humanity or the selfish desire to force their opinions on others. Why would you want either of these kind of people determine Constitutional Law?

Oh, soon enough you will be living *it* whether you want to or not. The irony is that the situation won't be caused by the thugs, criminals, or the armed citizens. The chaos will ensue because of the actions of the very people to whom you slavishly pray will protect you.

Once the current situation we are in becomes a bit more obvious you will find yourself wishing your children had been given the chance to be prepared and not just protected.

Slaves can only receive protection from the government; Citizens are allowed to be prepared by the Constitution.

Jon

EDIT: Fraudulent Slip.

[edit on 11.29.2008 by Voxel]

Originally posted by ATS4dummies

You mean like Mumbai, India?

Dude, in an armed society like America, especially New York City, if some punk whips out a gun in a subway car, 10 passengers will whip out their guns and aim it at the punk's head.

God bless America.

[edit on 29-11-2008 by ATS4dummies]

Are you serious? If a punk in a loaded subway car pulled a gun and went on a murder spree, a lot of innocent people would die. Furthermore, pulling out terrorist attacks as an excuse for gun rights is ignorant and lame.

[edit on 11/29/08 by peskyhumans]

reply to post by peskyhumans


You obviously weren't clear on his post. What he means is if a punk pulls a gun and starts killing people (like many do) when you have an armed society or one WITH gun rights, that punk can be stopped LONG before he kills more people. Not sure what you think your arguing...but its obvious you and MANY others have no common sense on how to keep things even...its mindsets like yours that have allowed this country to fail, and fail miserably.

Bottom line is when a punk DOES pull a weapon in a subway to kill others there should be no arrest, no trial, no prison...his final day on earth should be the day he made the choice to kill innocent people. To not agree with that makes me wonder where people come from and what they expect!!

EDIT TO ADD: We don't need to blame or hype up terrorism to justify carrying guns and keeping the second amendment alive...we have enough jackoffs who were born and raised in the US to keep that going..

[edit on 11/29/2008 by rcwj75]

The fact that you can probably go next door to MalWart and BUY a handgun makes me wonder why this even surprises people anymore.

Horrific story. Not only for the action the juvenile is supposed to have taken, but (since they were probably arguing over "the last toy") by the level of greed that was the catalyst for this to eventually happen.

Sad, on so many levels.

I grew up in Palm Desert, and people getting shot on 111 in Palm Desert is really a sign of the times.

Palm Desert is pretty much an island of well policed white upper middle class suburbia surrounded by working to lower class minority neighborhoods awash in meth and police corruption. A few older white residents of Cathedral City might take exception to that description, but deep down they know its a slum and they'd give a vital organ to cross the city limit into Rancho Mirage or Palm Desert.

Palm Desert is so well policed that I always went well out of my way to stay out whenever I had a problem with my car registration or insurance or anything like that. If there's anything outwardly wrong with you in Palm Desert, you will almost certainly be speaking with a cop. So through most of my life, I haven't known bad things to happen in Palm Desert.

Vehicle burglaries became rampant several years ago at the Mall (about a mile from Toys R Us, and the College, less than a mile further from the Mall).
Next it was purse snatchings, again at the mall.
Last year there was a string of bank robberies in the highest end shopping area in the city (El Paseo, just 1 street South of 111, maybe 3 miles East of the Toys R Us).
Now people are apparently shooting eachother over toys???

It looks to me like the harsher things get, the less the police can deter crime from coming where they money is. I'm guessing if the economy doesn't turn around soon, way more people will be way further out of line this time next year.
I could be off, but I don't see it. Palm Desert for the most part is not a place where you've got a reason to run around with a gun in your pants... or it wasn't anyway.

reply to post by The Vagabond



Pretty accurate description. I have lived in the valley most of my life as well.

A weird thing I pondered upon this a.m. is this area of Palm Desert, seems to have had a LOT of violence within a small radius in recent times.

There have been multiple homicides just across the street at those One Quail Place apartments in the last decade or so, and I believe there was a hostage / shooting situation across hwy 111 in the Target shopping center.

It's like that 2-3 block radius, despite being heavily policed, seems to be a magnet for violent events...

Bizaare...

Originally posted by UmbraSumus
The same law under which the law abiding, civil-minded American arms himself , is being used by amoral thugs & criminals to "tool up" .

All men may be equal in the eyes of the law ..... but they are certainly not equal in character . Those in favour of gun ownership, should at least welcome stricter vetting procedures before being allowed to buy a gun .
I know its a right but it needs to shift to being a privilege , if the wheat is ever to be sorted from the chaff.

the flaw in your thinking is the belief that these two jokers purchased their guns legally.
puting stricter laws on the purchase of firearms has no affect on the black market. i could have my hands on a full auto AK by the end of the week. but the "law" says i need a special permit, must submit to a FBI background check, be subject to random BATF inspections, purchase the very expensive gun through a dealer etc. you think criminals jump through these hoops? no sir.

And as for Turbokids comment that this is why he would bring a gun into a toys`r us , ..... do you really think that what this gunfight needed was another gun ? ( maybe you are just young , and a little reckless )

first of all i wouldnt have got involved in this incident of two thugs duking it out i would have left the store right away.
reckless? guess what i have a permit to carry a firearm on my person anywhere i go. this morning i walked through walmart, i even walked by young children, pregnant women in the babyfood aisle, and gang members and guess what, nobody got shot. and you know what else? i have been doing this for a long time, still havent shot anybody in a toy store.

This is just MHO ,
I am biased , my nations police force are unarmed , ...... i don`t wake at night in a cold sweat at the thought that i have forgotten to lock the front door .

me either. but if someone did decide to come on in (which is entirely possible, having happy thoughts doesnt deter crime) they would soon regret it. what would you do, call the police?

Sometimes i don`t think some American`s realise how safe and secure unarmed citizens of other countries are in their homes/ schools workplaces & communities .

im not sure which country your from but im guessing its the UK based on some of your spelling and your overall attitude towards guns.
if thats true i dont think i have to remind you that ever since the "gun ban" over there that gun crime has gone up. i'll provide links if you wish.
i sincerely hope that your law enforment is somehow able to keep you safe wherever you may go, and i hope nothing ever happens to you, but some folks need a reality check to come around. there are no "safe" places.

Please don`t regard this as a criticism , the urge to defend ones self and loved ones is one of the strongest expressions of human personality.
I just think that every body's quest for "individual protection" is effecting the greater security of your immediate community.

i very much disagree, the states in america with the highest gun crime have the strictest gun laws.. DC for example.. find me a state with a well armed citizenship and i'll show you a state with less gun crime.

lets see how restrictions on guns is working for other folks shall we?

in the UK

A new study suggests the use of handguns in crime rose by 40% in the two years after the weapons were banned.

news.bbc.co.uk...

Australia

Crime involving the use of guns is on the rise despite tougher laws - but gun control lobbyists maintain Australia is becoming a safer place.

The number of robberies with guns jumped 39 per cent in 1997 to 2,183, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, while assaults involving guns rose 28 per cent to 806 and murders by 19 per cent to 75.

www.sightm1911.com...


in contrast.

The gun policy in Switzerland is unique in Europe. The personal weapon of militia personnel is kept at home as part of the military obligations. This, in addition to liberal gun laws and strong shooting traditions, has led to a very high gun count per capita. Switzerland has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world, but also one of the lowest firearm related crime rates in the world.

en.wikipedia.org...


www.telegraph.co.uk...


i wish all my disarmed friends across the pond the best, i hope you dont regret it some day.

-turbo

this is great where are the video tapes? there is nothing funnier then watching the unwashed masses do everything they can to save a buck. no wonder their at the bottom of the barrel in life they must be desperate even more so witha democrat in office soon. fact is the majority of the population is not in the upper 10% and thus fail at living the american dream and this proves they are graver threats then previously imagined. perhaps they should be coraled for events such as this to prevent loss of life and loss of members of the working class. without them who will bus tables?

reply to post by DimensionalDetective


Yeah, One Quail Place had a violent reputation even back when I was just a kid. I'm pretty sure that's some kind of federally subsidized housing... basically the palm desert equivalent of "the projects". The problems on 111 are a much more recent development.

Well you have a choice to remove Black Friday if you want, if you do indeed value life over bargains, just stop the frickin' discount day, come on America what price is a persons life worth? I feel if you put it to vote you will all still want your precious "Black Friday".

reply to post by spitefulgod


Heh, true.

But try using that reason with the mega-corps. I think you and I know better than to believe they value a "peon's" life over how much more wealth they can aquire.

Maybe next season they can change the name to "bloody Friday".

reply to post by arcnaver


I wouldn't rob anyone, no matter the size of weapon I had.
This is just a disgusting lack of respect for human life.

Like an abused child loves his abusive family, or an abused woman stays with her abusive spouse, so Americans love their guns no matter how much pain an suffering they cause.
They have become so used to the violence in their everyday lives they refuse to believe that it is any different anywhere else.
Like junk yard dogs - growling and fighting over their stinking territory.

Believe us when we say there really are flower gardens and lush forests, figuratively speaking, outside of that hell you know and defend so proudly.

On the other hand, just go on re-creating your hell. Some of the rest of us are working on maintaining and improving a much less violent reality. Even if you were here, I know you wouldn't believe it, because your spirit is already too poisoned with hate and distrust.
What a shame.

The only connection this has to Black Friday or consumer culture is that a point in time for certain people to gather in one area was created. Its no different than the stupid gang tards using a New Haven church picnic on the green as a convenient spot to shoot each other and establish a little street cred with local witnesses.

The gun law nonsense is moot. Unless of course somebody can explain to me how making it illegal for me to have and carry a gun will keep a murderous thug from acquiring and using one to murder. I've been waiting some 30 years for a gun-grabbing ignorant to explain that to me.

This real story has been lost to the coincidence of the day and the ignorance of the articles audience. The real story is there are a bunch of barely functioning retards out there who think it is perfectly acceptable to end another human beings life over petty crap. Gun or no gun, Black Friday or no Black Friday, this idiot would have still been an idiot. I have yet to see any sort of law or ban or other legislative big-government fairy tale plan that would have stopped that. He would have stabbed him, beat him, run him over, choked him just about anywhere,

If it makes you feel better keep blaming guns and Christmas. It is easier but it wont get you anywhere.

Originally posted by wheresthetruth
The worst of this is that someone woke up and made a decision to take a firearm into a Toys R Us, probably one of the most populated retail outlets in America on Black Friday. This is as much premeditated murder as it gets. The very act of taking the firearm inside the store should be enough to get the death penalty.

This happened in California! They have more gun control than just about any other state!

And for your information those with conceiled carry permits often take their firearms on ALL shopping trips. Toys R Us, Walmart, the grocery store, you name it. I certainly do. The decision isn't "should I carry" it is only "should I not because it's illegal where I am going".

Though I would bet the average CCW permit holder would be one of the least likely to throw themselves voluntarily into a mob of Black Friday shoppers.