How do we survive this?

Hi Everyone,

I'm not sure if you have all heard about the on-going project with regards to the technology and equipment used by the US Army. There's a program called Future Combat System that deals with the upgrade of the technology used by the US Army and its soldiers.

Think universal solider! Seriously, some of this stuff is really out of this world.

Future Force Warrior is a United States military advanced technology demonstration project that is part of the Future Combat Systems project.[1] The FFW project seeks to create a lightweight, fully integrated infantryman combat system. It is one technology demonstration project in a series of network-centric, next-generation infantry combat projects the U.S. military have developed over the past decade, such as the Soldier Integrated Protective Ensemble technology demonstration program, Land Warrior, and Transformation of the United States Army.[2]

Link: en.wikipedia.org...

Video Link: uk.youtube.com...

I was just wondering what you guys thought about the possibilty that this kit comes into service, which it eventually will, imagine the possibilities of our respective governments using it against us!

It would make martial law ALOT easier for our troops if and when they was called to "round us up"

I know it may seem almost sci-fi but I'm not sure futher innovations in this field will ultimately be benefical, however thats a different argument.

The question I pose is this: Imagine such technologies do come into play, how are we as the survivalists going to cope with such a significant disadvantage? i.e. thermal imaging, CCTV networks, UAV's etc

Cheers,

I can tell you, beng inthe Army now, we will probably never see this on a mass scale. The Land Warrior concept has been around for years now, and they are just starting to issue a few to some units.

All of this new gear, is not all it's made out to be also. LW for example is basically a man portable FBCB2 or Blurforce Tracker, with options to see what other using the device see. Nice, but in the end, it will probably be used as a text messnger and map display.

To get to your question on how people can survive it, if it is beng used againt the people, then there is aproblem. If so, there will most likely already be an even bigger problem, like a civil revolution. In reality though, there is not enough of the fancy new toys for every soldier.

I can tell you, what we have now, can be either found on the civilian market or better can be. Often times many of us wish we used some other stuff, because we still have gear from Nam in my unit alone. It's still new and unused from then, if that says any thing.

Originally posted by ADVISOR
I can tell you, beng inthe Army now, we will probably never see this on a mass scale. The Land Warrior concept has been around for years now, and they are just starting to issue a few to some units.

All of this new gear, is not all it's made out to be also. LW for example is basically a man portable FBCB2 or Blurforce Tracker, with options to see what other using the device see. Nice, but in the end, it will probably be used as a text messnger and map display.

To get to your question on how people can survive it, if it is beng used againt the people, then there is aproblem. If so, there will most likely already be an even bigger problem, like a civil revolution. In reality though, there is not enough of the fancy new toys for every soldier.

I can tell you, what we have now, can be either found on the civilian market or better can be. Often times many of us wish we used some other stuff, because we still have gear from Nam in my unit alone. It's still new and unused from then, if that says any thing.

Well to be honest, on first reading about the "Future Combat Systems" I really did think I was reading a Sci-fi novel, some of the concepts really do sound a little outrageous!

I agree entirely with developing systems to help and protect our soliders however doesn't it seem a little strange that their broadcasting this information about whats "in the pipeline"?

Could it be a possibility that this is all scaremongering in an attempt to frighten our civilians and enemies into believing we have or will have something which we actually won't?

Also, doesn't the reliance on more techologically driven/IT based equipment open a new can of worms in the fact that some people are better at exploting IT/Comm's as opposed to firearms and infantry tactics?

Are future wars going to be conducted by mass teams of hackers attacking their enemies IT systems?

There should be no civilians afraid of what the Military develops. If you or others are, then I am sorry and appologize, because we have already failed you and them.

The enemy should be afraid how ever, because we will use it and develop better for future use. Also, what is released to the public at large is what they want us to know. There is a high probability that th device or technology being shown already has a improved version already made.

Again though, most of what is shown won't get to every soldier, and by the time it would if ever, improved and better gear will be getting developed. The concept of the idea is to improve upon what we have, nothing more.

reply to post by Death_Kron


In a sence, that is already happening now. It could be an issue, how ever old school skills and instinct will always win over technology.

In the debate forum, where everit went, there is a old debate on soldiers and technology, and which would be superior. That sums up this question of yours perfectly.

Originally posted by ADVISOR
There should be no civilians afraid of what the Military develops. If you or others are, then I am sorry and appologize, because we have already failed you and them.

The enemy should be afraid how ever, because we will use it and develop better for future use. Also, what is released to the public at large is what they want us to know. There is a high probability that th device or technology being shown already has a improved version already made.

Again though, most of what is shown won't get to every soldier, and by the time it would if ever, improved and better gear will be getting developed. The concept of the idea is to improve upon what we have, nothing more.

I would disagree because I'm sure many civilians are actually afraid of what their militarys develop as they think there is a chance they could use that equipment against their own people.

Well what is even scarier is the fact the some countries are not realising what they have already developed, personally I think there are probably some out of this world weapons that have been developed and ready to use, but people including soldiers, air men, navy crew, fighter pilots don't even know they exist.

I do agree though that most of the kit won't get to EVERY soldier, working in the telecomms field myself I find it highly unlikely if not impossible to electronically network every soldier, battalion, piece of equipment, tank, aircraft together.

Originally posted by Death_Kron
I agree entirely with developing systems to help and protect our soliders however doesn't it seem a little strange that their broadcasting this information about whats "in the pipeline"?

Could it be a possibility that this is all scaremongering in an attempt to frighten our civilians and enemies into believing we have or will have something which we actually won't?

could it be an attempt to justify the billions spent on the military budget when soldiers are running around with gear bought back in the late 60's!!!

Originally posted by pieman

Originally posted by Death_Kron
I agree entirely with developing systems to help and protect our soliders however doesn't it seem a little strange that their broadcasting this information about whats "in the pipeline"?

Could it be a possibility that this is all scaremongering in an attempt to frighten our civilians and enemies into believing we have or will have something which we actually won't?

could it be an attempt to justify the billions spent on the military budget when soldiers are running around with gear bought back in the late 60's!!!

Well exactly! We have wiki articles on the so called advanced technology of the future and yet we have soldiers running around with SA80's that are jamming left, right and center!

Wouldn't it make more sense to improve what we currently have rather than try to invent something new and completely different?

Either way, if the technologies are made that are shown in the above video and martial law/army turn nasty, we're all going to be in trouble!

Well, if the day happens that this country uses some thing against the nation of people with a hostile intent, I will be the first to resist and uphold my oath. There is a thread on this subject already, so we should not have to detract from this one.

Let me assure you though, members of all branches of the armed forces would side with the people no hesitation. We all took the same oath, and the older vets can vouch, it wouldn't last long.

[edit on 18-10-2008 by ADVISOR]

Here is a link to that debate thread I mentioned above, it is a fairly decent one and should cover the topic well.

Technology vs. Soldiers

Originally posted by ADVISOR
Well, if the day happens that this country uses some thing against the nation of people with a hostile intent, I will be the first to resist and uphold my oath. There is a thread on this subject already, so we should have to detract from this one.

Let me assure you though, members of all branches of the armed forces would side with the people no hesitation. We all took the same oath, and the older vets can vouch, it wouldn't last long.

Well its nice to hear you say that to be honest! Cheers

The only thing on that matter I would say if that humans are ultimately humans, and just like any other human being soldier or coffee shop worker we all have emotions and are all susceptible on some level to psychological manipulation.

It's the same with police forces, the superiority complex kicks in and with even more advanced technolgy then who knows what could happen!

A SERE exercise wouldn't be the same if you was being monitored by satellite, thermal imaging, electronically tagged

reply to post by ADVISOR


Thanks for the link, I'll definately check it out tommorow however I'm checking out now because its time for sleep!

The increasing reliance on advanced digitally-networked warfighting is, IMO, an achilles heel of the system and lo-tech weapons such as the RPG can be adapted to take advantage of this weakness



For instance..using the design principle show below, and with access to a basic machine-shop could develop EMP warheads for RPGs ...perhaps out of the reach of a band of our average civilian survivalists, but not to a well skilled force with engineering knowledge


(link to thread)




[edit on 18-10-2008 by citizen smith]

As impressive as all this is, war isn't won by technology. Sure, it helps, but the fundamentals of war will never change. Spirit, skill, and determination will always win, and with the advent of guerilla warfare and now terrorism, a few determined people can cripple and even crush a country with a few precise strokes a thousand times more than standing armies and a nuclear missiles can.