diehard democrat says:

"My father had a secret clearance with the Air Force a while back while he was still in. He claims that he "transported supplies" in a 1-ton pickup.
I read somewhere that one is allowed to disclose secret information after some time, like years and years and years, but does anybody know exactly how long? I'm trying to find out what he really did in the Air Force."

You are incorrect. If a person is privy to sensitive information, whether SECRET, Confidential, SECRET NOFORN, COMSEC, or whatever, he is not permitted to discuss it at all unless the information itself become declassified.

I am sure that 90 percent of the classified stuff I knew when I was a Motorola Government Electronics Division in the '80s and '90s and all of the stuff I knew when I was IBM Federal Systems in the late 60's and early 70's is now irrelevant, but I'm not supposed to talk about it, so I don't. And I think you;ll find that just about everyone who ever held a clearance is the same way.

This, by the way, is a good way to determine someone's credentials; if a person says that he or she is divulging SECRET or TOP SECRET information, or if he says that "because the time is up, it can now be revealed", then that person is lying and you should consider that when you evaluate the information, since it's probably also (as they say in the Russian Marines) "boolsht".

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
diehard democrat says:

"My father had a secret clearance with the Air Force a while back while he was still in. He claims that he "transported supplies" in a 1-ton pickup.
I read somewhere that one is allowed to disclose secret information after some time, like years and years and years, but does anybody know exactly how long? I'm trying to find out what he really did in the Air Force."

You are incorrect. If a person is privy to sensitive information, whether SECRET, Confidential, SECRET NOFORN, COMSEC, or whatever, he is not permitted to discuss it at all unless the information itself become declassified.

I am sure that 90 percent of the classified stuff I knew when I was a Motorola Government Electronics Division in the '80s and '90s and all of the stuff I knew when I was IBM Federal Systems in the late 60's and early 70's is now irrelevant, but I'm not supposed to talk about it, so I don't. And I think you;ll find that just about everyone who ever held a clearance is the same way.

This, by the way, is a good way to determine someone's credentials; if a person says that he or she is divulging SECRET or TOP SECRET information, or if he says that "because the time is up, it can now be revealed", then that person is lying and you should consider that when you evaluate the information, since it's probably also (as they say in the Russian Marines) "boolsht".

Umm, no. Currently, when you are granted a federal security clearance you must sign a confidentiality agreement for 50 years from the end of your clearance. However some items have special protection (i.e. under the Atomic Energy Act) and cannot be discussed at all.

that confidentialy statement is the notorious SF-51 Nondisclosure Statement, which basically says you can not talk about the things discussed unless with other approved personnel with the same clearance status, can not write reports, books, make videos, movies, talk to the media with out proper authorization to do along with other stipulations. If done so you can be jailed for 50 yrs automatic before in depth charges apply. And some things you cant discuss at all or ever. Been there done that alot of times, heck, as much stuff as I have been involved in I probably have a normal dictionary size file with all of those SF-51's I signed and can tell you that majority I dont remember what I signed it for, so I basically dont chit chat about anything.

There's alot of errata and misunderstanding contained in this thread.
I started to compile it all but have run out of time!

For starters:

- There are only three US classification levels: CONFIDENTIAL, SECRET, TOP SECRET (NATO has an extra one, RESTRICTED, which is below CONFIDENTIAL)

- Many of the stated levels are actually Compartments (TK is an example); these are used to restrict the number of people who have access to certain data, the theory being that no one person has access to everything. There is really no hiearchy of compartments, rather some just have less people "read in" to them than others, could be a handful up to thousands. Material can be compartmented at any of the three classification levels.

- Referring to the original list, most of those "clearances" listed aren't clearances at all, they're background investigation standards. For example, no one is "cleared" SSBI; SSBI is the basic backgound investigation required for a TOP SECRET clearance.

- ADP levels aren't clearances, they're designators for people who have access to DoD computer systems.

- Foreign Government Information (FGI) is not a clearance, it's a marking used to indicate information sources

- DISCO is not a clearance, it's an agency (or, rather, a branch of an agency - DSS)

- ISSA and CISSP are IT certifications, no idea what they're doing on such a list

- Some of these terms - Umbra, for example - are obsolete, and were never actual clearances anyway

- The S in SCI stands for Sensitive, not Special

As already stated, Need to Know is the key.

dang it, now my PSD doesnt feel so special...especially now that i think about it, how many civilians shake the presidents hand when hes out on the campaign trail? WHY DIDNT THEY HAVE TO GET QUESTIONED BY THE SECRET SERVICE MONTHS IN ADVANCE OF THE HANDSHAKE???? bastards, the killed my dream of importance

This, by the way, is a good way to determine someone's credentials; if a person says that he or she is divulging SECRET or TOP SECRET information, or if he says that "because the time is up, it can now be revealed", then that person is lying and you should consider that when you evaluate the information, since it's probably also (as they say in the Russian Marines) "boolsht".

My father didn't say that he could disclose that information. In fact, he won't tell anybody because he's afraid the government will find out.

I'm trying to learn when the "expiration date" is for his secret clearance so I'll finally know what he really did in the Air Force.

Originally posted by diehard_democrat
My father didn't say that he could disclose that information. In fact, he won't tell anybody because he's afraid the government will find out.

I'm trying to learn when the "expiration date" is for his secret clearance so I'll finally know what he really did in the Air Force.

If I remember right, the "expiration" is something like 70 years after signing the non-disclosure form. Even then, you could probably still be hauled up for revealing anything damaging. Part of my job used to be to have people sign these forms...I remember joking that they're binding "until you die and probably even longer."

On the other hand, chances are your Dad could tell you more than he has...some folks are over-cautious, and of course some just like to show off (not saying your father is one of those!).

I have a clearance now, for example, but I could tell you 99.99% of what I do for a living.

There is no such thing as a "supreme" clearance

Does the President have his own special security clearance which is a supreme clearance?

Also, are there any clearances from a-1 to d-4 etc?

[edit on 6/1/05 by GodAtum]

Originally posted by StarChild
I could tell you right now that I have a Top Secret-SSBI / SCI / SI / TK / G / B / HCS Clearance, however, you have no idea what I do for a living, right?



Mr. M

I believe that was the clearance Monica Lewinski needed a few years ago to have access to certain sensitive items and materials.

Ok, let's fill in the blanks! Here is an explainatios of the "maze"of abbrivations:

ADP- Air Defense Personnel: Used by People who Work at NORAD

COMSEC- Cryptological clearanace for working with codes

DOD- Department of Defense

Q-General: for people who work in areas where they might come into "accidental contact with classified info

DOE- Department of Energy

DOJ- Department of Justice

SAR- Special Access Required: For compartmentalized "Special Access" programs (these clearances are usually code words such as Senior Crown which was the Code name for the SR-71)

SAP- Special Access Program: Same as SAR (SEE ABOVE)

SCI - Special Compartmented Information: This includes, but is not limited to intelligence

I- Intelligence: A sub-devision of SCI for people who work in places like NSA intelligence section or CIA

SBI/SSBI-Special Background Investigation/ Single Scope Background Investigation: same thing, both refer to a requirement for SCI clearance. (Source: The Puzzle Palace, by James Bamford)

Tim
ATS Director of Counter-Ignorance

Originally posted by ghost

Not to pick nits, but:

COMSEC- Cryptological clearanace for working with codes

This isn't a clearance, it's an acronym for Communications Security (does relate to crypto, though...)

SCI - Special Compartmented Information: This includes, but is not limited to intelligence

Actually Sensitive Compartmented Information

SBI/SSBI-Special Background Investigation/ Single Scope Background Investigation: same thing, both refer to a requirement for SCI clearance.

True, but also used for a "plain vanilla" TS clearance.

Source: Many years of experience.

Originally posted by Azeari of the Radiant Eye

Originally posted by ghost

Not to pick nits, but:

COMSEC- Cryptological clearanace for working with codes

This isn't a clearance, it's an acronym for Communications Security (does relate to crypto, though...)

You are both correct. COMSEC is used to talk about communications security in general, but in order to have access to COMSEC related items (keys,ciphers,codes) a person (in the US military) must sign additional non-disclosure agreements, undergo additional training and be designated (or cleared) to handle COMSEC items.

You should also include the the Highest level: Super Secret.

Originally posted by JBurns
You should also include the the Highest level: Super Secret.

Is there really a Super Secret?

22 years in the DoD and I've never heard of it...which doesn't mean it doesn't exist, of course!

Re: COMSEC - yes, it's both a description and an access...my point (poorly made!) was that it's not a clearance. Clearance and access are two separate things. You can have a clearance but no access, but you can't have access without a clearance.

Nice list there star , a few I saw missing on page 1's list are.

Confidential No Forign
Secret No Forign
Top Secret No Forign
No Desimination
No Forgin Desimination

As well as another I havent seen too many people post on which was changed last year and that is O.R.A.D.R.

It has another abbrivation now but it used to stand for "On or at direct request."

I have some list's somewhere of some other ones I will will try to find and post see if any more were missed.

Falcon

Originally posted by Azeari of the Radiant Eye

Originally posted by JBurns
You should also include the the Highest level: Super Secret.

Is there really a Super Secret?

22 years in the DoD and I've never heard of it...which doesn't mean it doesn't exist, of course!

Re: COMSEC - yes, it's both a description and an access...my point (poorly made!) was that it's not a clearance. Clearance and access are two separate things. You can have a clearance but no access, but you can't have access without a clearance.

I assumed that's where you were coming from, just wanted to clarify.

I as well severly doubt there is an such thing as Super Secret. If have known of a number of black projects and a bunch of other pretty senstive stuff and never heard of this. It's also not on any of the DoD security clearance forms.

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
I had a NATO Secret security clearance when i was in Germany. It was required because I worked around the missiles.

yo, I was in Nuremberg and Furth, GDR
i didn't work on sensitive stuff,
i was a paper shuffler and NATO clearances were pretty much rare
like a handfull at Battalion and a score at Division
~~~~

& everyone:
the clearances a a pain-in-the-buns, you got a lot of
restrictions and off-limits places.... even countries you can't visit,

^^

Originally posted by falcon
Nice list there star , a few I saw missing on page 1's list are.

Confidential No Forign
Secret No Forign
Top Secret No Forign
No Desimination
No Forgin Desimination

These are dissemination control markings, not clearances, and the actual marking is NOFORN.

And it was OADR, not ORADR...this was actually a downgrade/declassification instruction marking, and it meant that a document so marked could not be downgraded or declassified without the originator's consent. It is now obsolete, having been replaced my a more sophisticated system.

explained nicely. interesting combination of qualifiers you have there - but yes, one would know generally what type of work you do because of the combination (not that it matters).

generally, the level (e.g. C, S, TS) and access/qualifier is all that matters.
TS-SI/SAO, TS-SCI etc.

Level 6 was interestingly not present... COSMIC is open source, etc...