Alleged Ancient Order Of Hibernian Oath

www.residentgroups.fsnet.co.uk...

Here is a link to the alleged A.O.H oath this society has an alleged oath that pledge to kill Protestants is the one that the Knights Of St Columbus is based on according to a Knight that is a member of the forum. He also said the Knights Founder was a member and he modelled the Knights on the A.O.H i believe it especially the blood oaths.

I Wonder why all the Catholic societies have alleged Oaths of Killing Protestants Jews and Masons, if you look at History and the Church you will see that they have indeed helped or had a hand in these evil deeds but deny all these oaths!


[edit on 5-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

[edit on 5-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

I personally don't know that much about these oaths or the Catholic Church, but...my husband used to be in the Knights of Columbus many, many years ago and took this oath. From what he told me, it was very similar to this.

But in all actuality, the word 'Hiberian' caught my eye. I have been researching, a little, about the lost tribes of Israel. Hiberia is associated with the ancient name of the Hebrew people. Check out Betty Rhodes website, www.the-red-thread.net

There are so many twists and turns whenever you read history that you know truth is mixed with deception and it is just a matter of discerning the facts from fiction.

In my opinion, anyone who justifies murder based on religion is severly manipulated. So many innocent people have been killed. Just look at the spirit behind the organization. If it is contrary to God, who is love, forgiveness and mercy, then flee quickly! Anyone killing in the name of religiion is wrong! We have the right to defend ourselves, but never kill someone because they don't share your beliefs!!! As a country, as the United States was, who formed under the belief of Almighty God and the freedom of choice without stepping on others and taking away their inherent God-given rights, we are bound by God to leave man's eternal choices to the judgement of God and not man.

From what I have read in the past, perhaps the Catholic Church believes it is descended from ancient peoples who were given authority over the peoples of earth (either by an alien race or God). Sounds weird, but may be true.

I am certainly no authority, but have read tons of material on ancient, hidden history here and there. If you need references, I can look it up, but will need time to do so.

Kewl... sounds like the oath the Bloods and da' Crypts say when joining da' gang. Primitive butt sniffin' territoriality. Patriotism the last refuge for scoundrels.

reply to post by bjbrown61


Thanks for the reply so your husband was in the Knights and said the ritual was similar maybe more truth in this than the Knights on here are admitting to!

Can you ask him if this is the Oath www.biblebelievers.org.au... and what council or lodge he was a member of and we will see if his brother Knights on here call him a liar. They don't seem to be saying hes a liar about the oath maybe theirs some truth in the blood oath. Thanks Dave

There are some members of the Knights of Columbus here on ATS, may want to wait a bit, they should offer up some sort of reply.

Originally posted by RuneSpider
There are some members of the Knights of Columbus here on ATS, may want to wait a bit, they should offer up some sort of reply.

Ill wait to see if they call this lady a liar because all the knights deny this oath but comming from a former Knight they either have to call him a liar, or deny it which is basically calling him a liar anyway!

reply to post by orangeman dave


It's a shame, in my opinion, that a religion professing Christ can deal out hatred to other religions. This has happened in ALL Christian faiths, unfortunately...although it should not.

I'm not a Hibernian, but I collect fraternal rituals. I have the official ritual of the Ancient Order of Hibernians and the oath is nothing like that, so I'm sure it's a product of a bitter mind. Same goes with the "bogus" oath attributed to the Knights of Columbus. I have the current rituals of the three degrees of the K of C as well. There is nothing offensive or devisive in them. They do not mention killing anyone and do not mention Protestants or Masons at ALL. Here is an iteresting article from a History of the organization....Knights of Columbus actually turned over copies of their rituals to MASONS (insert dramatic music here!) And here is the report:

"In Los Angeles in 1914, the State Deputy of California [Knights of Columbus] submitted the entire work, ceremonies and pledges of the Order to a committee of Freemasons made up of Messrs. Motley Hewes Flint, 33rd Degree Past Grand Master of Masons of California; Dana Reid Weller, 32nd Degree Past Grand Master of Masons of California William Rhodes Hervey, 33rd Degree Past Master and Master of Scottish Rite Lodge, and Samuel E. Burke, 32nd Degree Past Master and Inspector of Masonic District. These gentlemen issued the following statement:

“We hereby certify that by authority of the highest officer of the Knights of Columbus in the State of California, who acted under instructions from the Supreme Officer of the Order in the United States, we were furnished a complete copy of all the work, ceremonies and pledges used by the Order, and that we carefully read, discussed and examined the same. We found that while the Order is in a sense a secret association, it is not an oath bound organization and that its ceremonies are comprised in four degrees, which are intended to teach and inculcate principles that lie at the foundation of every great religion and every free state. Our examination of these ceremonials and obligations was made primarily for the purpose of ascertaining whether or not a certain alleged oath of the Knights of Columbus, which has been printed and widely circulated, was in fact used by the Order and whether if it was not used, any oath, obligation or pledge was used which was or would be offensive to Protestants or Masons, or those who are engaged in circulating a document of peculiar viciousness and wickedness. We find that neither the alleged oath nor any oath or pledge bearing the remotest resemblance thereto in matter, manner, spirit or purpose is used or forms a part of the ceremonies of any degree of the Knights of Columbus. The alleged oath is scurrilous, wicked and libelous and must be the invention of an impious and venomous mind. We find that the Order of Knights of Columbus, as shown by its rituals, is dedicated to the Catholic religion, charity and patriotism. There is no propaganda proposed or taught against Protestants or Masons or persons not of Catholic faith. Indeed, Protestants and Masons are not referred to directly or indirectly in the ceremonials and pledges. The ceremonial of the Order teaches a high and noble patriotism, instills a love of country, inculcates a reverence for law amid order, urges the conscientious and unselfish performance of civic duty and holds up the Constitution of our Country as the richest and most precious possession of a Knight of the Order. We can find nothing in the entire ceremonials of the Order that to our minds could be objected to by any person.”

A committee of forty-eight prominent non-Catholic citizens of Indianapolis, in 1914, published in local newspapers the result of their examination of the facts and litigation concerning the bogus oath. “Knowing,” they declared, after a summary of the history of the “oath” cases, “that the ‘fake oath’ is false we hold that all good citizens will join us in denouncing its circulation in Marion County and in Indiana, to the end that people of all creeds may dwell in peace and harmony as becomes the highest ideals of true and patriotic American citizenship.”
The editor of a Socialist newspaper in Santa Cruz, California, had a collision with the law when he published the “oath” in October, 1914. Since that time, there has been sporadic circulation of the “oath,” as by a person named Crane in Oklahoma in 1917 and by various persons apprehended and charged with pro-German activity during the war. In all cases where the Knights of Columbus have taken part in the prosecution they have not pressed the case once guilt was admitted by the culprits.
In an affidavit attached to a pamphlet issued by the Knights concerning the bogus oath, Supreme Knight James A. Flaherty, Supreme Secretary William J. McGinley and Supreme Advocate Joseph C. Pelletier, declared that “no oath is required, asked for, received or given directly or indirectly in any of the foregoing [rituals, ceremonials and proceedings] or otherwise in the Knights of Columbus; that the alleged Knights of Columbus or Fourth Degree oath is absolutely and unqualifiedly false.”
Amazing as it is that this puerile defamation of the Fourth Degree should have received wide circulation followed doubtless, by belief, it is still more amazing that a publication such as The Menace, confessedly unscrupulous, should be permitted to sow suspicion, lies and strife among citizens of this country. True, the paper has been expelled from certain cities and the Postmaster General of Canada barred it from the Canadian mails, although specimens of almost equally scurrilous, anti-Catholic journalism are tolerated within the borders of the Dominion.
It is difficult to reconcile the spirit of the Declaration of Independence and of the Constitution of the United States with even a mild toleration of false and malicious attacks on any group of American citizens. However, as might be expected, the campaign against the Knights of Columbus through the Fourth Degree has succeeded only in rendering the position of the Order more secure in the public mind and the degree more attractive. It is an institution known and respected; it not only serves its original purpose, by inspiring members to progress in the beneficial lessons taught by Columbianism, but is solicitous to find and industrious
in pursuing special operations that augment the fraternal and civic effectiveness of the Order as a whole. There is ample reason for the declaration of the Supreme Master in one of his official messages, that “the Fourth Degree is an asset of the Nation.”

“The Knights of Columbus in Peace and War.” Volume I, pp. 127-129. By Maurice Francis Egan and John B. Kennedy. Knights of Columbus. New Haven, CT. 1920.
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To the OP, Orangeman Dave it seems you belong to the Orange Order. I have those rituals too. They do not mention killing Catholics, but they sure don't like 'em, do they?

reply to post by orangeman dave


Loyal Orange Order's Oath. This is from the internet, so we can assume it's correct, right?

www.iloi.org...

www.nireland.com...

www.nireland.com...

(Note that these guys love Masons too!)

Obligation

I, ..., solemnly and voluntarily promise, that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to his Majesty, and to his lawful heirs and successors in the sovereignty of Great Britain and Ireland, this Dominion and the Province of __________, so long as he or they shall support and maintain the Protestant religion. That I will, to the utmost of my power, defend them against all traitorous conspiracies and attempts which I shall know to be against him or any of them. That I will steadily maintain the connection between this Dominion, the Province of _______, the Mother Country and all Colonies and Dominions beyond the seas, and be ever ready to resist tall attempts to weaken British influence or dismember the British Empire. That I will be true and faithful to every brother Orange-man in all just actions, neither wronging him nor knowing him to be wronged or injured without giving him due notice thereof, and preventing it if in my power.
I further promise that I will not unlawfully have any carnal knowledge of a brother’s wife, sister, daughter or mother, and that I will also honor and respect the chastity of womanhood. That I will ever hold sacred the name of our glorious deliverer, King William III., Prince of Orange, in grateful remembrance of whom I solemnly promise (so long as I remain a member of a Lodge, and if in my power) to celebrate his victory over James at the Boyne, in Ireland, by assembling with my brethren in their Lodge. room on the Twelfth day of July in every year; or, should that day fall on Sunday, then on such day as my Lodge shall, by resolution, at a regular meeting, appoint for such celebration. That I am not now nor ever will be a Roman Catholic, nor am I married to, nor will I ever marry a Roman Catholic, nor educate, nor permit my children to be educated in that faith, or in any Roman Catholic School or institution, except where no Protestant or public schools exist. That I will resist by all lawful means, the ascendancy, extension and encroachment of the Church of Rome, at the same time being careful always to abstain from all unkind words and actions towards its members. That I am not a suspended or expelled member of the Orange Association.
I do further promise that I will do my utmost to support and maintain the Loyal Orange Association; obey all regular summonses, and pay all just dues (if in my power). That I will not unite with, or in any way recognize, any Lodge or body of men purporting to he Orangemen, unless such Lodge or body of men hold a warrant from the Grand Lodge of British America, or from some Grand Lodge recognized by the Grand Council of Orangemen (commonly called the Triennial Council); that I will use all my influence to promote fellowship and brotherly love amongst my brethren, and observe and obey the Constitution and Laws of the Association.
Lastly, that I will always conceal, and never in any way whatsoever disclose or reveal, the whole or any part of the signs, words, or tokens, that are now about to be privately communicated to me, unless 1 shall be authorized to do so by the proper authorities of the Orange Association, of which I am now about to become a member. So help me God, and keep me steadfast in this my Orangeman’s Obligation.
-------------------------------------------------------------
www.orangeusa.org...





[edit on 5-10-2008 by senrak]

[edit on 5-10-2008 by senrak]

Dave, it has been so long ago, he can't remember details. His swearing in was extremely shortened, but he doesn't remember what was included in the oath. He was sworn in a KC hall here in the United States and that is all I can tell you. Sorry I couldn't help more.

He is a Christian now with no organizational ties, bound only to the Lord Jesus Christ who is the only righteous King worthy to rule over all men.

May I ask what faith you are?

We are non-denominational Christians who believe only in the written Word of God. We answer to no man.

I agree Senrak, it is truly said to see a the work of a man who preached unconditional love to be twisted into the most exclusive of faiths, so exclusives that they choose to exclude each other of minor interpretational differences.

But was it not A. Pike (Feel free to correct me if i am mistaken), that said "Christ's church of love and peace has been corrupted into a church of hate and war"?

I wont go casting blame at modern christians for the sins of their respective churches, especially for sins commited before our grandfathers were born, but we all know that the vatican and other religious hierarchies have waged war on any they could call sinners

Dave, whenever I wrote this morning I just remembered him saying he took this oath and that was over 25 years ago. So I asked him this morning and he said it was too long ago and he honestly couldn't remember any details. He just remembered it wasn't as long as what was on the web site you referred us to. And he didn't remember anything being bad in it. (Of course he drank beer a lot back then, so he may have been too plastered to know what was going on :lol.

Originally posted by senrak
reply to post by orangeman dave

 

Loyal Orange Order's Oath. This is from the internet, so we can assume it's correct, right?

www.iloi.org...

www.nireland.com...

www.nireland.com...

(Note that these guys love Masons too!)

Obligation

I, ..., solemnly and voluntarily promise, that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to his Majesty, and to his lawful heirs and successors in the sovereignty of Great Britain and Ireland, this Dominion and the Province of __________, so long as he or they shall support and maintain the Protestant religion. That I will, to the utmost of my power, defend them against all traitorous conspiracies and attempts which I shall know to be against him or any of them. That I will steadily maintain the connection between this Dominion, the Province of _______, the Mother Country and all Colonies and Dominions beyond the seas, and be ever ready to resist tall attempts to weaken British influence or dismember the British Empire. That I will be true and faithful to every brother Orange-man in all just actions, neither wronging him nor knowing him to be wronged or injured without giving him due notice thereof, and preventing it if in my power.
I further promise that I will not unlawfully have any carnal knowledge of a brother’s wife, sister, daughter or mother, and that I will also honor and respect the chastity of womanhood. That I will ever hold sacred the name of our glorious deliverer, King William III., Prince of Orange, in grateful remembrance of whom I solemnly promise (so long as I remain a member of a Lodge, and if in my power) to celebrate his victory over James at the Boyne, in Ireland, by assembling with my brethren in their Lodge. room on the Twelfth day of July in every year; or, should that day fall on Sunday, then on such day as my Lodge shall, by resolution, at a regular meeting, appoint for such celebration. That I am not now nor ever will be a Roman Catholic, nor am I married to, nor will I ever marry a Roman Catholic, nor educate, nor permit my children to be educated in that faith, or in any Roman Catholic School or institution, except where no Protestant or public schools exist. That I will resist by all lawful means, the ascendancy, extension and encroachment of the Church of Rome, at the same time being careful always to abstain from all unkind words and actions towards its members. That I am not a suspended or expelled member of the Orange Association.
I do further promise that I will do my utmost to support and maintain the Loyal Orange Association; obey all regular summonses, and pay all just dues (if in my power). That I will not unite with, or in any way recognize, any Lodge or body of men purporting to he Orangemen, unless such Lodge or body of men hold a warrant from the Grand Lodge of British America, or from some Grand Lodge recognized by the Grand Council of Orangemen (commonly called the Triennial Council); that I will use all my influence to promote fellowship and brotherly love amongst my brethren, and observe and obey the Constitution and Laws of the Association.
Lastly, that I will always conceal, and never in any way whatsoever disclose or reveal, the whole or any part of the signs, words, or tokens, that are now about to be privately communicated to me, unless 1 shall be authorized to do so by the proper authorities of the Orange Association, of which I am now about to become a member. So help me God, and keep me steadfast in this my Orangeman’s Obligation.
-------------------------------------------------------------
www.orangeusa.org...

Well Mr Karnes you should know if they are true or not as you once claimed to be a member of the Orange Order!

I dont understand what you mean by these guys love Masons too? They seem to get on pretty well with one another if it wasnt the case i wouldnt be an Orangeman and a Mason?

Alos if you want to believe a group aligned with a Church as Beacon of Light quoted Waged war on what they called sinners be my guest you are more gullable than i thought ;-)



[edit on 5-10-2008 by senrak]

[edit on 5-10-2008 by senrak]

[edit on 6-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

[edit on 6-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

[edit on 6-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

[edit on 6-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

Originally posted by orangeman dave
I dont understand what you mean by these guys love Masons too? They seem to get on pretty well with one another if it wasnt the case i wouldnt be an Orangeman and a Mason?

I meant that web-site from which the Orange info came.

I was being VERY sarcastic. That group hates everyone....kind of like how you apparently hate Catholics. Otherwise why would you have posted that "baiting" message about the Order of Hibernians (whose Obligation is NOTHING like what was on that site) would you?


[edit on 6-10-2008 by senrak]

Originally posted by senrak

Originally posted by orangeman dave
I dont understand what you mean by these guys love Masons too? They seem to get on pretty well with one another if it wasnt the case i wouldnt be an Orangeman and a Mason?

I meant that web-site from which the Orange info came.

I was being VERY sarcastic. That group hates everyone....kind of like how you apparently hate Catholics. Otherwise why would you have posted that "baiting" message about the Order of Hibernians (whose Obligation is NOTHING like what was on that site) would you?

[edit on 6-10-2008 by senrak]

You are a fool Karnes if you are going to resort to the old Anti Catholic chestnut because you cant win an argument, dont post.

If by posting some evil deeds that the Vatican have done or an alleged Oath makes me Anti- Catholic then so be it not once have i said anything about everyday Catholics i just have a gripe about the evil stuff they have done.

I see you never replied to the bit about you being an orangeman or not, well is this their Oath or not Brother?

I think we might have a cowan here people

Btw do you think any order would give anyone a copy of their rituals? I already asked but ill post again you are so gullable and Either a cowan or Anti Orange as you have baited their alleged Oath so dont call me anti anything brother! or alleged brother you probably have read some of these rituals you beileve to be true and are passing yourself off as a Mason.

reply to post by orangeman dave


Yes Dave, you're just as hate-filled as you were several years ago when you posted Anti-Catholic info here. You dare to say that I am not a Mason? Fine. I don't give a fuzzy rat's *** what you think. But I do know this: you didn't learn all this hatred and bitterness in Masonry, therefore YOU are the cowan (even if you hold membership in a Lodge) You learned all this hatred in the Orange society. Glad I was smart enough to get away from it....since I was fooled into it by people who said "this is a great, God-loving, patriotic fraternity" So, you're right. I was a fool. A fool for getting involved in that BS.

Why don't you take your hatred somewhere else? Please?

reply to post by senrak


But thats where youre wrong nothing i have posted is Anti Catholic their are links to facts (attrocitites) comminted by the Vatican which i didn't see you defend.

Why dont you take your Vatican defending BS somewhere else if you are not going to let someone post links and ask questions about the Vatican without jumping on and saying Anti-Catholic this that and the next thing.

Their must be hundreds of People posting on here about the Vatican holding secrets, twisting the truth, inquisitions why dont you post round them all and tell them they are ANTI Catholic as well.

As for calling the Orange Order B s**** think what you like im glad to be part of a Protestant Society that only wants people to follow their faith i leanred no hostility in the Order it just opened my eyes to the evil doctrines of Others

Also dont Hijack my post if you want to post alleged Oaths start your own thread

[edit on 7-10-2008 by orangeman dave]

reply to post by orangeman dave


This is absolutely disgusting.

I can't say for sure, but if these oaths are real then these organizations are truly blindfolded and walked down a road to ruin.

People argue up and down that the Masonic organizations are horrible people, dead set on ruining the world and controlling everyone. As a Mason myself, I can tell you point blank, that is not in the cards. We are for a better world, end of story.

These organizations openly endorse the murder of innocent people who happen to believe something contrary to them? That is completey insane.

Completely.

I am sincerely disgusted by these oaths and would hope that they are indeed fabricated and far from the reality.

If not, may the architect have mercy on their souls.

reply to post by bjbrown61


Hiberian is not the correct spelling it is Hibernian.

ur twiste'd. 'orangeman dave' says it all.

The Ancient Order of Hibernian oath doesn't even mention any other religion. It is strictly about making Ireland a free nation, supporting the Irish heritage and culture, and supporting and protecting the Catholic church. Stop trying to smear the Hibernians and trying to spread hate. Also, anyone that supports English oppression also supports hate crimes, division, and treachery. Like I said, stop putting this type of junk on the internet. Your'e a traitor to your own country and a coward.