A double minded man is unstable in all his ways...

I want to live a normal existence... you know, start my own business, get married have kids etc... but for some reason I seem to always go round in circles because of my interest in conspiracy type stuff...

Like for example, I want to start a signwriting business like my dad, but I can't get over this seemingly very real sense of DOOM and GLOOM in regards to the world around me... it just seems like a waiste of time putting all my effort into setting something up, if the world is about to end and Jesus Christ is going to return soon. I feel like I should just give up all worldly ambition, and concentrate all my energy on having my life right with God and doing His will.

now i know what some of you are thinking... this guys suffering from depression.. but I believe it's more to do with my dads intense interest in end time bible prophecy, and the fact that I have had the fear of God installed in me from the moment I learnt to talk.

I am Agnostic by the way, I have been a born again Christian in the past but always end up getting discouraged, and turning back to my old ways...

The bible says that a double minded man is unstable in all his ways... I can see how this is true in my life, because I constantly switch from a state of not believing, to wanting to believe, to believing, and as a result have failed to achieve any measure of material 'success' in this world. (going round in circles)

I want to know how many of you out there are in the same or similar frame of mind as what I have described above? Do you live the majority (or even just part) of your life in a state of confusion about this world, and perhaps a sense of urgency or guilt about the fact that there really might be a Hell waiting for all of us who fail to truely seek after Jesus with a genuine and sincere longing for forgiveness?

reply to post by savetimerushonline

I know exactly what you go through. Same sitch here, since I was about 10 or so, I got interested in prophesy from my mom. The problem this causes is that you go no where in life constantly feeling as if everything will end and that you have no purpose, but to wait for it...don't do this. I've done it since I was 10 and it has been 25 years of nothing but letting myself down and selling myself short.

The rapture isn't what it is made out to be, if you believe in that. The anti-christ spirit is the "waiting and doing nothing" while pointing the finger at everyone. Anti-Christ fools everyone by this tactic puffing up our pride in to believing that we are selves could never be this character of the diabolical devil servent. It won't be a man, but many men and women who believe they are "saved" and will be on the privy side of disaster, yet that's not what The Most High says. "In the day you do evil, then I have forgotten all the good you did and in your sin you shall die" Likewise, "In the day an evil man turns from his sin and performs my ways, feeding the sick, looking after widows, binding up the broken then that man shall live". The end of the world happens every day, just not for all. "Every eye shall see..." When you take your last breath, its the end of the world...peace brother

You make some good points I guess, but I don't feel any more confident about what direction I should take in my life...

thanks for your input though. Much appreciated.

If you can see your personal conflict, then you can override it.

Plus, you should see the conditioning. I mean you were conditioned to want to marry and have kids and etc since you said "normal existence" which suggest you following what you think is a standard of some kind to live out.

Rather be your own self, not try to be what you were conditioned by others to be.

reply to post by savetimerushonline


The only real way is to keep your interests in the world as a hobby and set yourself a good goal to achieve with your life, this will keep you somewhat stabilized in the Doom and Gloom area.

As much as there are problems in the world now, there always have been... there's no point in worrying about it until something happens because you could waste your whole life worrying and nothing might happen. And if it does, why fear death? You are either going to go carry on some other way OR completely cease to exist, in which case, you wont know anyway. As long as you die happy and in good conscience, thats what it's all about really.


[edit on 12/8/08 by Dermo]

Hello. I can relate to what you are expressing. I'm sometimes hesitant to give advice on things like this, not knowing the person, but here goes.

Around 1993, my Bride and I looked at the way of the world, and our perception of patterns. We sold everything we had, and moved to the Caribbean. This was not a knee-jerk movement, but one precipitated by a couple of things:

1) disaster -- two earthquakes that came without warning, and only by the grace of God were we one or both of us not injured. During the Loma Prieta earthquake which had an epicenter in Santa Cruz, near S.F., I would normally have been on the lower deck of the Bay Bridge at the time it collapsed. That particular day, I had an intuition that seem crazy, and went all the way (out of my way) south, to the San Mateo Bridge, and then north again to our house. I was on contract at that time as a S&R team member and hazmat responder, and ended up crawling in that horribly crushed space anyway, with team members and dogs, trying to save some lives. 66 people died there alone. My darlin' was in travel status and at the epicenter of the Northridge earthquake. I was one of the responders. One of the hardest things I've ever done in my life was to continue my job, with my team, and not veer off and go looking for her. She was uninjured. She knew what to do, and did the right thing. It was two extremely long days before we were able to make contact with each other.

2) Random violence that nearly touched us. I'm going to skip the details of this. People died, she did not.

Long story longer, we moved here, and began a minimalist lifestyle. We both work, and we live simply. Our "carbon footprint" is a pittance.

Now here's the semi-advice part: We first set up a hurricane preparation kit, followed by improvements to our house, to make it stronger, followed by establishing a garden, which continues to feed us to this day. We learned the benefits of local plants, and which fish to eat and how to catch them.

I suggest to you that if you prepare for a Situation X by gathering knowledge of survival skills, acquire some goods (it doesn't hurt the pocketbook so much done a little at a time), and then do some research into which situations might affect you and yours personally, and make adjustments to mitigate the impact of those situations. Rotate your food and water stocks, acquire things you like.

Go ahead with your goals. To echo an old saying, if you are prepared for the worst, and hoping for the best, you have done all you can do. Then, you can approach your goals with open eyes, and hope.

Nothing you do toward your own benefit and advancement will ever be wasted time. The thing that is most worrisome to me about your post is the sense of giving up... sort of like -- it all feels like it's going downhill, why should I do anything if nothing I do will change things? Listen, this, in one way or another, has been the feeling of young folks for several generations, perhaps ALL generations. It's a sense of disenfranchisement, and it's real, but the way one can combat that feeling of helplessness is to take positive control of your destiny.

I hope this doesn't sound preachy; I don't mean it so. I just wish someone would've shared the same with me when I was wandering and not sure of which way to go. 35 years ago, when I was feeling as a leaf on the wind, the only time I wasted was that which didn't have my own goals in mind. One day it clicked: NOBODY was going to help me, or mentor me, or make things better. Yes, there were things that were horrific about the world that I didn't feel I could affect. Since then, I have focused on the positive things I COULD affect. It made all the difference.

I still feel that feeling of impending doom, but my heart is light, knowing that I've not crawled in a cave, safe from the world and sacrificed the joys of life. I am READY.

Be prepared, but most of all, LIVE. Laugh. Love. ...... and we'll all see each other on the other side, hopefully. If not, we've made our best effort while we could.

Cheers

[edit on 12-8-2008 by argentus]

Originally posted by Dermo
reply to post by savetimerushonline

 

And if it does, why fear death?


[edit on 12/8/08 by Dermo]

You say

Why fear death? well the bible teaches that all sinners will end up in eternal torment in a place called hell... thats why I fear death while I am in my current state of not following Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by Mabus


Rather be your own self, not try to be what you were conditioned by others to be.

I agree... but you would probably say that being my own self would mean ignoring the christianity I have preached at me by my dad my whole life, and chasing after my worldly desires right?

Originally posted by savetimerushonline

Originally posted by Mabus


Rather be your own self, not try to be what you were conditioned by others to be.

I agree... but you would probably say that being my own self would mean ignoring the christianity I have preached at me by my dad my whole life, and chasing after my worldly desires right?

One has to uncondition themself from other's traditions and ways by choice when it conflicts inside.

More like not doing everything you hear that you feel you shouldn't if it only causes conflict in yourself. There is no worldly desires here in this life. You can desire a better world always. But there is individual natural-based desires to how you and the body you have work. Proceed with caution to your sole nature apart from others in what you fulfill in this life with the world, unless you care nothing about your well-being or calm state of mind. If someone can preach to you Christianity, then you can preach to them something different. That different can be what changes them in how they talk to you without it being seen as for changing their belief or view with all due respect.

Try not to be good (a hypocrite), or fair (the corrupt giver or the corrupted allower), or wicked (obvious evil doer and iniquity spreader) like other ppl deem or get deemed if it only conflicts with your thought or will. Just be a real you, a raw you not in suffering any inner conflict. Then you should feel smooth in ways and dealings. Those who wont accept you for your individual or your natual nature... just let them not with checking them to what they are doing. It could be they act like their crap dont stink or they have an inner conflict they are not trying to admit and fix. Plus, you shouldnt care about who accepts you and who doesnt if you are keeping untouchable to any conditioning by others.

That Christian religion is against our Lord's given gift called nature where their is desires and needs and instinct and interition (sp?) and judgeable cognitions. Our Lord is us. We are our own Lord. We are to rule our own lives.

[edit on 12-8-2008 by Mabus]

Originally posted by savetimerushonline

Originally posted by Dermo
reply to post by savetimerushonline

 

And if it does, why fear death?


[edit on 12/8/08 by Dermo]

You say

Why fear death? well the bible teaches that all sinners will end up in eternal torment in a place called hell... thats why I fear death while I am in my current state of not following Jesus Christ.

New Testament God is also a very forgiving guy. I'm an atheist, a Satanist(LaVey) even but I'm still a decent person. I've always believed that on the off chance that I'm wrong, that God made us in his image, and put us here, then he made me the way I am, he slapped together the eternal skeptic that demands proof, that thrives on reason and logic rather than blind faith.

He can't hold against me something of his own design.



Besides, fire and brimstone hell doesn't exist.





On the OP's topic, I know how you feel, a few years back I realized just how stupid and backwards the doom and gloom prophecies of the near future are, though I still feel it in the back of my mind every now and then, the only idea that really bothers me anymore is the fact that the world is going to be ruined by stupid people.

sheesh it's honestly all just so confusing... I honestly think its impossible for me to reverse the conditioning I have been subjected to from an early age.

my dads intense interest in end time bible prophecy, and the fact that I have had the fear of God installed in me from the moment I learnt to talk.

I am Agnostic by the way, I have been a born again Christian in the past but always end up getting discouraged, and turning back to my old ways...

Well, I can most certainly relate to this in some ways.

I grew up in a very religious house, as my father (and mother) were both pastors. So, I too had the "fear of God" instilled in me from the moment I popped out. And that word fear actually WAS fear for many things: sex, drinking, etc.

I am what is called a "born again Christian" too. However, I do not follow all the religious doctrine that was crammed down my throat most of my life. I still have my faith in God, I still believe many of the things I believed when I was young. But these are things that I cant explain why I believe them. But I do NOT believe everything I was told as I "grew up in the church". I do not go to church now, probably never will again. And I do not read my Bible - like I used to EVERY DAY when I was growing up. I have major issues with that that whole subject (the Bible).

sheesh it's honestly all just so confusing... I honestly think its impossible for me to reverse the conditioning I have been subjected to from an early age.

Over my adult life (since I moved out of my parents home), I have had major conflict in regards to what I have been taught verse what may be truth. Its still a struggle in my life. It has caused problems for me and at other times, no problem at all. It might always be a struggle, because the fact is: I was raised in a very very strict home and told to live life a certain way...to have certain beliefs. And as I get older, I fight all of that based on my own research and own experiences in life.

I still am not at peace with what I actually believe. But I refuse to let it affect my future. I try really hard to live one day at a time. And all awhile keep my mind open and research as much as possible.

At this point in my life, my belief is solely focused on God and who I feel he is - not who others tell me he is. I dont focus on all the dos and donts of what is taught in the man-made Bible.

And again, I try and live one day at a time.

Good luck in your journey. I hope you find the peace that you need. Just try and live one day at a time!

Im not sure I helped at all. But I wanted to share my similar upbringing and conflict so you know that your not the only one!


[edit on 8/13/2008 by greeneyedleo]

I'm sorry to be such a bore, but you diagnosed yourself correctly in your OP.

You're suffering from depression.

To hell with tracing the emotional trauma or conditioning that may have caused it. That doesn't work. There are more effective ways to treat depression nowadays. See a doctor and get yourself on the road to recovery.

Good luck, my friend, and get well soon.

Originally posted by greeneyedleo

I do not go to church now, probably never will again.

thats the same as my parents... they came out of the church system when I was 4 years old. What happened when Jesus entered the temple (organised religion) back in his day? HE WAS THROWN OUT... it's no different in our day... it's organised religion that will embrace the antichrist when he first appears.

[edit on 13-8-2008 by savetimerushonline]

[edit on 13-8-2008 by savetimerushonline]

Originally posted by Astyanax

You're suffering from depression.

this is true... i do feel sad.

[edit on 13-8-2008 by savetimerushonline]

Originally posted by savetimerushonline

Originally posted by Dermo
reply to post by savetimerushonline

 

And if it does, why fear death?


[edit on 12/8/08 by Dermo]

You say

Why fear death? well the bible teaches that all sinners will end up in eternal torment in a place called hell... thats why I fear death while I am in my current state of not following Jesus Christ.

If this is going to turn into a religious debate, i would just like to say..

Being brought up as an non-practicing Irish catholic, i was always taught that..
Jesus and God gave unconditional forgiveness to anyone that wanted it, whenever they wanted it... simply because they wanted it.
That is was important that you lived a moral life, tried to keep a clear conscience and devoted small portion of your daily activities to God... ie prayers of thanks etc.
But mainly, that if you simply believed in his message of love and forgiveness..then you will be saved.

It was all the old testament writings that held the idea's of torture and eternal torment.
The idea of going to church came centuries after Jesus died, so did most of the fear mongering associated with Christianity.
It is for the reasons of fear and control that the religious zealots and radicalists use the concepts of pain, suffering and distress in their teachings of christianity.

Everyone gets what they really want out of it, maybe you should change your mindset and try find something good in it. It might make you happier.

Jesus is loud these days. You can hear him calling when you are silent.

All I can say to you, OP, is keep listening, listen more, and listen more intently every day to the silence in which you hear the Truth speak the loudest. That's what I'd tell myself if I wasn't so double minded myself...

Forget the whitenoise of the world and its troubles. Don't be distressed or alarmed - war, famine, drought, disaster - these troubles will come, but rejoice - the Lord has overcome the world.

What have you got to lose by believing and seeking God? Time? The world? Are these things of any real consequence? Who would gain the whole world but forfeit their soul?

The Word of God is the breath of life, the sweet and safisfying manna from heaven. It's all you need to sustain you when you are striken by spiritual confusion. Dwell in the Word of God. I don't just mean reading the Bible, I mean dwelling in God's very presence silently and patiently.

If you have even an ounce faith, express it. Make it real through your actions. Don't give up on life. That is the definition of death. Let your light shine. Wear the Word of God on your forehead AND in your right hand. Your right hand is your power to act and express your faith in God. God will provide opportunities for you to manifest your faith and make it LIVE.

And as a Christian, what is our faith and hope in? Resurrection. Believe it, seek it, LIVE for it. this is the power of Christ living through us, to live in the faith and hope of Resurrection, the power of God over life and death.

People think this is just dogma i'm typing here, but its as real as the breath you draw as you read this.

Remember God's greatness and love above all else.

If you are concerned about your sin or your aimlessness or about going to hell, seek God and meditate on the abundance of life and love to be found through faith in the Risen Christ.

[edit on 13/8/2008 by sollie]

Originally posted by sollie
Jesus is loud these days. You can hear him calling when you are silent.

All I can say to you, OP, is keep listening, listen more, and listen more intently every day to the silence in which you hear the Truth speak the loudest. That's what I'd tell myself if I wasn't so double minded myself...

Forget the whitenoise of the world and its troubles. Don't be distressed or alarmed - war, famine, drought, disaster - these troubles will come, but rejoice - the Lord has overcome the world.

What have you got to lose by believing and seeking God? Time? The world? Are these things of any real consequence? Who would gain the whole world but forfeit their soul?

The Word of God is the breath of life, the sweet and safisfying manna from heaven. It's all you need to sustain you when you are striken by spiritual confusion. Dwell in the Word of God. I don't just mean reading the Bible, I mean dwelling in God's very presence silently and patiently.

If you have even an ounce faith, express it. Make it real through your actions. Don't give up on life. That is the definition of death. Let your light shine. Wear the Word of God on your forehead AND in your right hand. Your right hand is your power to act and express your faith in God. God will provide opportunities for you to manifest your faith and make it LIVE.

And as a Christian, what is our faith and hope in? Resurrection. Believe it, seek it, LIVE for it. this is the power of Christ living through us, to live in the faith and hope of Resurrection, the power of God over life and death.

People think this is just dogma i'm typing here, but its as real as the breath you draw as you read this.

Remember God's greatness and love above all else.

If you are concerned about your sin or your aimlessness or about going to hell, seek God and meditate on the abundance of life and love to be found through faith in the Risen Christ.

[edit on 13/8/2008 by sollie]

This is truth so I must witness.

Thank you Father for your witness which you are witnessing to those with an ear to hear and an eye to see. Please lead every man, woman, and child whom all exist to you, because you are in all and with all in our midsts. Please forgive us, all your people for our double mindedness, and turn our hearts back to the only way of life that you promised, generation to generation forever.

Your children know your voice and the rush of waters they pour out of, they learn to see threw confusion, because of the flood you send to drown the pride of us and being dead we are judged, and you have judged your people, as you have come with your reward for every mankind, it is with you.

Not one of us has generated, except you went forth and prepared a home for us in our mothers womb, dividing us even from one cell, it is your work as the homebuilder building temples of living flesh to house our blood, the river of life, safe from the wilderness of the external body and the disintegration of death, disbanding all of those with us who labored us, our ancestors, your people. For when we see and lift our heads and you have given us site, first we see the dead of us, thousands apon thousands, and when they see the light you have lit to kindle, they crowd and push in, even to the point of terror in this body. Be with us as a banner, for many gnash. Many I do not know. Many are not male, that is to say ReMembered and thus MALE.

Your children, you scourge, correctly so for we are so stubborn. Still, stubborn or not "YOU TAKE NO PLEASURE IN THE DEATH OF MARK MISERS", because you yourself are judged with us, open our hearts again to turn back to you, to the word from your mouth and not from the doctrines of men.

In these days your word, which is a trumpet, because of trumpet meaning ,"reverberation in the ear" and "incising" from your original word written down in the Greek, we are realizing these strange effects are you, these things which others ridicule us for, and outcasting us, because we hear you and say so to them when asked. I pray they hear too, the good message, the good transmission, the new generation whose feet are blessed on the mountain tops of those about to go down to the pit. We know you exalt the low and level the high, a pure picture of your equilibrium and your justice. We are getting the witness of Jesus, but now we are hearing it and never before did these things have meaning, yet you came to your disciples, the ones you are striking down in your anger, the ones being your slaves, the ones who knew not regeneration of woman to come back again. And we are thanking you to you in your displeasure and in your heat, and in your scorn, for you are so frightful and when your peace is gone the mockers will know, but forgive them also, for your love is forever and you chase after your inheritance, the ones who you are remembering.

"In 3 Days I shall raise this temple"...."To the lord a day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as a day"....and in this very year does the morning of the third day break....and just as the mayan our brothers have keyed us too, the bible is a cycle in a cycle and it is as double edged sword, cutting even to the marrow and the center and we are realizing canon is the name of Cain and is the spear in your salvations side and is avenged 7 spirits deep making the last worst than the first....

Peace

The bible says that a double minded man is unstable in all his ways... I can see how this is true in my life, because I constantly switch from a state of not believing, to wanting to believe, to believing, and as a result have failed to achieve any measure of material 'success' in this world. (going round in circles)

You quote the Bible and then testify that you know that the Bible is true as is evidenced by your life. You already stated that you know that the Bible is true. You then turn around and deny God and His word by saying that you are Agnostic. You know the truth but choose to deny it. You are without excuse.

Just by posting on this board, you have proven that yet another part of the Bible is true.
Romans 1:20 - For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

You clearly know that the Bible is true but you purposely choose to deny it. How are you any different than Satan? Satan knows God but denies Him. That's all you are doing. You can now even testify that Satan exists since you are doing the same thing that he does to God. If you choose to continue to deny God as Satan does then you are choosing to spend eternity with Satan. So on judgement day, every one of us that have read your thread can now testify to God that you knew the truth (because its right there in black and white on ATS, Lord) but he chose to deny you anyways, Lord. I'm sure you won't be 'agnostic' on that day.



[edit on 14-8-2008 by checkers]

Forget the white noise and the negative replies OP, and just focus on seeking God and Truth. God is Good remember. You dont have to turn your life upside down. Don't strive. Just seek in your heart and mind with patience and perseverence. Don't stress. peace

checkers, remember that you too will be held to accout for all your words.

[edit on 14/8/2008 by sollie]

[edit on 14/8/2008 by sollie]