It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Sir Barnes Wallis 'Swallow' design.

page: 1
2

log in

join
share:

posted on Jun, 21 2008 @ 03:44 PM
link   


The result was an aircraft of great beauty and extreme simplicity. Swallow flew in model form in the mid-fifties. Subsonic tests were made with a model of 30 foot maximum span powered by two small rockets. A supersonic model, 6 feet long attained speeds of up to Mach 2.5.

After years of development and grinding work the government killed the project.

BNW: "And so five of my team and I flew out to Langley Field but unfortunately we overdid it. We convinced the Americans too sincerely that this was a great idea and so they decided to take it up for themselves instead of paying us a grant to do it in England".



Ever seen this before ? I haven't and also I never knew that they built and flew scale test models.. and as for the UK government grinding it to a halt.. Well, like most great stuff it seems the Americans took the idea under their wing.

I wonder what ever happend to this beautiful design ?

Any one got any ideas ?





posted on Jun, 21 2008 @ 06:08 PM
link   
I have never seen that before, very nice design indeed, it looks like something from a Star Wars movie.

It does have a nice "triangle" shape so who knows what happens with the design


nice find I wish I could help you with more info.



posted on Jun, 21 2008 @ 06:33 PM
link   
Doesn't it just ? that it was also a swing wing design with pivoting engine pods that could operate as vectored thrust units amazes me.

I'd love to see if any other info about this beautiful project is about the web.

Daniel.



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 02:20 AM
link   
it is beautiful, the comment about star wars, grey magic seems right on... it almost looks like a pre-cursor to an aurora type plane, and the way its lines are, it seems like it'd be perfect for high-speed flight, that added with a swing wing -all of a sudden low speeds become obtainable and you don't need a run-way the size of the one at area 51- and early thrust vectoring would have made it an incredibly formidable airplane... thanks for the post

raptor1



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 07:17 AM
link   
The version of Swallow that you can see in the photo is a proposed strategic bomber in which the entire tailcone is a nuclear missile that was supposed to be jettisoned after the aircraft had already turned safely for home before firing up and continuing its journey to the target.

This method of delivery was borne direct out of the personal guilt felt by Barnes Wallis that so many aircrew had lost their lives in delivering his bouncing bomb on the famous Dambuster raid by 617 Sqn in 1943.

An SST variant was also proposed long before the Concorde project with the swing wings having the benefit of reducing landing and take off speeds foreshadowing the Boeing 733/2707 of more than a decade later.

A unique feature of both versions of the Swallow was the 'elevator cockpit'. This served the same purpose as the droop snoot of concorde but instead of lowering the nose, the entire flight deck, which was contained in a circular tub, was raised above the fuselage to increase vision. This accounts for the odd window arrangement in the OP's photo.

The engines were not strictly vectored thrust as we understand it, they merely allowed for the thrust line to remain unaltered as the wing swung back and forth as can be seen in the drawing below which shows a much smaller version proposed as an alternative to what later became the TSR 2



image

A variant of this concept was also proposed for a naval fighter, albeit with a conventional fuselage, called the vickers 581 which can be seen below.

It was this design that Wallis took to the USA with him and after taking on his ideas, as mentioned in the first post, the end result was the F-111. The F-111 was not developed directly from the Vickers 581, it was a new design, but Wallis' calculations and research experience was put to extensive use on the latter project.

The only visual clue to any link at all is the way the F-111's wing glove blends into the upper fuselage just behind the canopy. This was a feature of Wallis' type 581, but not of any other VG aircraft before or since.



Back in the UK the Vickers fighter was further evolved into the type 589 which retained its Lightning style wing profile but was otherwise much more like the VG aircraft we are used to. Via the P.45 and AFVG this led directly into the Panavia Tornado.





[edit on 22-6-2008 by waynos]



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 08:12 AM
link   
nice thread Dan, you have been very busy on here lately !!

thanks for the info Waynos.

snoopyuk



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 08:18 AM
link   
reply to post by waynos
 



I thank you good Sir for such an awesome post. That has given me so much to think about and have a good look at in the next few days.

Your time, as every one elses who helps me out is deeply appreciated.



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 09:04 AM
link   
Reminded me of this.




posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 10:21 AM
link   
Great thread Dan and Great post Waynos!! It makes you wonder what the RAF would be like now if some of these great aircraft designs from the forties and fifties had gone in to production. Some of the designs remind of some of the aircraft from Jerry Andersons Thunderbirds!! The RAF would have been overcome with request to join and fly some of these beautiful aircraft.

[edit on 22-6-2008 by Kurokage]



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 12:30 PM
link   
reply to post by waynos
 


Waynos,

You forgot to mention that Barnes Wallis made no bones about the fact that he reckoned that the Americans messed up the F-111 by putting a tail on it, or that this was the subject of an on-going and rather bitter disagreement between Wallis and Vickers.

The Winged Wombat



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 01:25 PM
link   
Nothing to add to this really, jusst think the plane looks like Johhny Quest's jet.



posted on Jul, 28 2008 @ 05:23 PM
link   
reply to post by waynos
 


In fact the engine pods could be vectored to right or left turn as well as providing climb and descent capability. Thus doing away with flaps, tailplane and rudder - all of which Barnes claimed upset the aerodynamics of the variable geopmetry wings



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 12:49 PM
link   
Chapman Pincher, a really great defence reporter, told the story of the Swallow front page in the Daily Express 9th may 1958. The Express may be able to help with some information.



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 01:20 PM
link   

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
reply to post by waynos
 


In fact the engine pods could be vectored to right or left turn as well as providing climb and descent capability. Thus doing away with flaps, tailplane and rudder - all of which Barnes claimed upset the aerodynamics of the variable geopmetry wings


Not on any of these designs they couldn't. Wallis recognized that would overcomplicate things, but he did hold that idea as an eventual goal on some future variant of the Swallow for the same reasons you mentioned.



posted on Oct, 20 2008 @ 12:47 AM
link   
reply to post by Dan Tanna
 



posted on Oct, 20 2008 @ 02:00 AM
link   
reply to post by Dan Tanna
 


DAn,
Not only do I recognise the "Swallow" model in the picture you posted earlier this year....I had the privilidge of helping work on it. The one we see shown, was in fact submitted from memory, by Sir Barnes Wallis to the 'powers that be' for further funding etc(re your subsequent story.
Quite ironically, a couple of the AUS F111's crashed near my home at the time, .in latter years.
Clubhouse
(a psdonym taken from where we worked on the devlopment of the Swallow at Brooklands )..need more proof..?



posted on Nov, 4 2008 @ 05:45 AM
link   
reply to post by Clubhouse
 


Hi Clubhouse I'd be interested to know what year you worked on the Swallow. To the best of my memory the last Swallow to fly was in 1957 in Cornwall. Did further development take place after this. Brightdawn



posted on Jan, 8 2009 @ 02:22 PM
link   
reply to post by Dan Tanna
 


ANYONE NOTICE SLIGHT RESEMBLANCE TO AMERICAN STEALTH FIGHTER IF THIS AIRCRAFT WASALLOWED TO BE DEVELOPED FURTHER BY THE BRITISH GOVERMENT AT THE TIME WE WOULD HAVE BEEN FURTHER AHEAD WITH AIRCRAFT DEVELOPMENT THAN WE ARE NOW BARNES WALLIS WAS A GENIUS OK ADMITTED IT REQUIRED MORE RESEARCH AND TWEAKS TO ALLOW THE AIRCRAFT TO BE ABLE TO ACHIEVE SAFE FLIGHT BUT HE WOULD HAVE DONE IT YOU CAN BET.



posted on Jan, 8 2009 @ 02:59 PM
link   
I don't know if anyone else here is a model builder, but Fantastic Plastic are kitting a 1/144 Swallow soon.

They also do a really nice Avro 730 as well as a lot of other SF & experimental aircraft.

The guy responsible, Allen B. Ury, also has probably the most thorough collection of models of x-planes, spacecraft, and SF vehicles out there, the Fantastic Plastic Virtual Museum.

Awesome stuff!



posted on Jan, 21 2009 @ 07:02 AM
link   
reply to post by Dan Tanna
 


I once saw a drawing (obtained from somebody in the aviaition industry) for a two seat version. Not so futuristic, but it still had swivelling engines and swing wings and, incredibly, pre-war aerofoil sections!!



new topics




 
2

log in

join