reply to post by jamie83
First Jamie, thanks for accepting my challenge in this thread:
I believe I can argue at length for implementing each and every one of these items. I guess that makes me a liberal. That is to say, I am motivated
out of a sense of generosity. (I've always regarded the word "liberal" as synonymous with "generous", and the word "conservative" to be
synonymous with the word "thrifty", both of which are good qualities, but incompatible with each other.)
Here is my liberal take on this. Let me quickly state my positions, and I will discuss each of these in later detail, as required.
#1. Increase taxes on everybody making over $95,000
I would like to see what kind of increase we are talking about. If we are talking about closing some tax loopholes, or very modest increases, I will
accept that with no problem. It is a matter of degree. I don't want to see more tax reductions for the wealthy.
#2. Impose higher taxes on oil companies
Let's tax certain types of revenues and profits. I think this might help lower gasoline costs, in the long run, by promoting serious R&D. (Yeah --
that can work, if done correctly.) I would like to know more. I don't think we are talking major new taxes on an industry we are currently giving
millions of dollars in tax credits to right now.
#3. Nationalize health care.
Our current system is pretty bad right now. Maybe we can show the rest of the world how to do this correctly. Things can't get much worse, so I would
like to see what options are available. Yes, this might negatively affect certain aspects of health care, such as highly exotic treatments that the
richest people are getting right now. (See item #1.)
#4. Immediate withdrawal from Iraq.
Bingo. Good idea. We already won that war more than six years ago. What are we still doing there? We committed a major blunder in going to Iraq and
need to get our "maintenance" troops out as soon as possible, concentrate on covert operations. I would disagree if we were talking about giving up
the war in Afghanistan, or the war in terror. But $8 billion a month -- for Iraqi democracy? This is reason enough to vote for Obama.
#5. Unconditional meetings with Iran, Cuba, N. Korea, Syria, and Hamas
Meet with them. Just don't make any deals that are losing propositions. Frankly, I would like to know what the leaders of these countries have to say
to us face-to-face, rather than the dubious accusations we currently are hearing in the press and administration. After talking with them, we can
decide what to do next.
#6. Increase aid to Africa by $50 billion.
By all means, lets try to get things straight in that continent. It is better than funding Iraq for another half-a-year. Africa is in desperate shape.
Maybe I am too liberal for you, but I can acutely empathize with their pain, and think we can actually help them out, if we are careful. Here, we see
a direct conflict with thriftiness (conservatism) and generosity (liberalism).
#7. Eliminate all U.S. nuclear weapons.
Great idea. We don't need nuclear weapons. Conventional weapons work just fine for us. Having nuclear weapons won't prevent a nuclear attack against
the USA, nor help us if such an attack occurs. Okay – keep 10 nuclear weapons in some Air Force base (you know we will do that, regardless of what
we say in public.) But get rid of the other 49,990 (or whatever) weapons of mass destruction. You cannot convince me that we need this type of
destructive power stockpiled.
#8. Immediately stop funding new U.S. weapon systems
Great idea. Let's stop development of some of these weapon systems, and end this ridiculous drain for useless gold-plated projects of speculative
value. I would like to completely re-assess our current spending on all military projects. I think we need more body armor, and less gold-plated
#9. Eliminate all space-based anti-missile weapons
Do we really need these? What are we trying to achieve with space-based weaponry? (See #8)
#10. Reduce carbon emissions to 80% of 1990 levels, putting the U.S. back to the dark ages.
Well – I don't want to go back to the dark ages. Who is really interested in that? Do we have some politician saying they want to go back to the
dark ages? I'm not voting for that person, I assure you. However, humanity is dumping a whole lot of unnecessary carbon into the atmosphere. You must
not live in Los Angeles (or Beijing) or you would appreciate how annoying all that indiscriminant pollution really is.
So there you go. Let's debate any point at length, or all of them. I will check back to see what you have to say. Be as firm as you want in making
your posts (I can take it.).
I will be pleased to respond to anyone, regardless of what they say.
[edit on 12-6-2008 by Buck Division]