Half of Gen X Doesn't Expect to Retire

born in the mids 70s:

* no pension savings started
* oil peak ahead
* dramatic aging of the population ahead
* depression within the next 24 months

why would I even hope for retirement? I hope I will be able to live around 300 years , and with the help of cyborg technologies (implants etc) to be able to work another 250 years.

herbalepoch, you Xers are in the process of being assimilated as we speak. I just finished watching Bill and Megan on Fox News. Are they Boomers? Sell outs? The same thing is happening to your generation, sacrificing the moral imperative for a shot at the big time. Get real!

At least the Soulja Boy Presidential Debate Remix was cool.




[edit on 18-4-2008 by Icarus Rising]

reply to post by Double Eights


1. Build a bunker.
2. Stock food/water in it.
3. Buy a dog.
4. Buy gun(s).
5. Hide.


[edit on 18-4-2008 by Pagani]

Originally posted by Icarus Rising

You can call it whatever you want, I call it projecting blame erroneously out of ignorance of circumstances.

So, would you say that you're blaming him for not being aware of something that, considering he himself is a Gen X'er, he has no real personal experience of other than perhaps through his grandparents?

Not ignorance of circumstance, perhaps ignorance of history.

After all, a great many people nowadays who consider themselves to be 'Generation X' have had little or no personal interaction with anyone older than whomever they call the people who sired the baby boomers - I myself (Generation Y) have had absolutely NO interaction with any living individual who was alive prior to the 20th century (perhaps the very late years, bless me ol' grannie afore' she passed on), which i'm certain many baby boomers, and perhaps the odd Generation X'er have.

It's getting to the point where people are looking to the baby boomers for wisdom and leadership, what with ya'll being the most experienced n' all.

What you have to take into account is that a great many people around nowadays don't have any knowledge of the industrial revolution that can be provided via word of mouth - History has changed in order to encompass those who were alive during those times.

Ignoring this fact, is a clear sign of an inability to move with the times.

Now, i'm not saying that you aren't aware of this, but i am saying that there is an awful lot of Boomers and Generation X'ers who aren't.

So the very people who are soon to be the social, economic and political leaders of that which we call our countries, are not aware of the fact that they are in the position of respect and in some cases, prestige.

You might wonder what this has to do with the current perceived threats to our society, and i'll make it simple; Someone has to lead the way.

Here's my take, as posted in another thread, on the emotional aftermath of boomers:

www.abovetopsecret.com...'

Originally posted by kosmicjack
... I am in a hiring position and the candidates are getting more and more dismal as the months/years go by. Tattoos, piercings, bad attitudes, lazy ways and an "F - it" mentality.

At first I was judgmental and condemning, but after long observations I have come to the conclusion that it is really not their fault.

Who then?

One word - BOOMERS. The most selfish and self-centered generation to ever walk the earth. They have discarded everything that was no longer useful, didn't feel good, didn't fit or wasn't convenient - and that includes their kids. Everything from disco to diets, one fad after the other, as a way of "finding" themselves but losing their families and common sense along the way.

There is an entire generation that walks around virtually parentless, but they sure do have some really understanding Boomer roommates/bestfriends.

So much of what we are witnessing is a desparate cry for sorely-needed attention and parameters. They are literally the walking emotionally wounded.

God help us, one day they will be in charge. Oh - But not until the Boomers let go of their last bit of power and influence with their dying breaths. Rest assured, all of the money and resources will go with them and their children will be just as lost as ever.

For now, I just have pity on them (their kids) and try to steer them toward self-respect, good jobs and a brighter future.

More on the financial effects of Boomers:

Boomers and the housing market

About to wreak havoc on the housing market are the 78 million American baby boomers who will “retire, relocate, and eventually withdraw from the housing market,” according to report authors Dowell Myers, a professor of urban planning and demography in the School of Policy, Planning and Development at the University of Southern California, and SungHo Ryu, an associate planner with the Southern California Association of Governments.

Using demographic data to show that individuals in their mid-60s tend to sell more often than buy, the authors contend that when boomers — a “dominant force in the housing market” — start reaching the age of 65 in the year 2011, a market shift will occur. Some retirees will be looking to downsize, others will relocate to warmer climes, while others will move to nursing homes, says Mr. Myers. As they transition out of the housing market or look to sell their homes, in some states there will be “more homes available for sale than there are buyers for them.” Home prices will soften.

The “sell-off” will create a sizeable hurdle for the housing market, because as Mr. Myers puts it, “It isn’t money that buys property, it’s warm bodies. If you don’t have enough warm bodies to fill up the space, the space stays empty.”

The report points out that the ratio of those aged 65 and older to working age (25 to 64) adults will increase by 67% between 2010 and 2030, and that when these older adults try to sell their “high-priced homes” to a “relatively smaller and less-advantaged generation” — a cohort whose buying power was diminished through the housing boom’s price increases — there will be more homes for sale.

I haven't even addessed social security, health care, the residual effects of their failed global intiatives or the past 16 years in the White House.

So no, I don't misunderstand. I am laying responsibility where it belongs - on Boomers. I don't expect them to gracefully accept it, however, because they are nothing if not "special", the exception to every rule and God forbid anyone interfere with their personal experience. In this thread alone they have blamed their parents and their kids, casting about for moral cover and social or cultural justifications.

[edit on 18/4/08 by kosmicjack]

How do you figure? You are the one blindly projecting blame and feeling sorry for poor little old you. I am just pointing out the fallacy of your argument. The Boomers have not been in control, it is as simple as that.

Maybe you wish you were a Boomer, some kind of generational envy. I'm sure you would have done things differently, and we wouldn't be in the mess we are in now.

Like Roland says in "The Gunslinger", the world is moving on, has moved on. Deal with it.

People do the best they can under the given circumstances. There is no crystal ball, no magic wand. You can't undo what is done. Deal with it.

reply to post by Anti-Tyrant


I'm not the one doing the blaming. I am simply pointing out flawed reasoning and logic. Do you think the Boomers chose to be born en masse? Do you think they chose to be born into this time in history? People do the best they can under their circumstances. They make mistakes.

Hindsight is 20/20.

kosmicjack and others like him need to learn the power of forgiveness, and trust in God. Tomorrow is in His hands.

edit: thanks for the correct spelling of en masse

[edit on 18-4-2008 by Icarus Rising]

reply to post by Icarus Rising


I am not blindly projecting blame, I am stating the case. I am not feeling sorry for myself, only society at large and subsequent generations who will have to endure the effects.

Your "get over it" attitude is what many have come to expect as a typical Boomer response. They blame their parents. They blame their kids. They endlessly justify their own actions and bad decisions.

reply to post by Icarus Rising


No one is making the absurd suggestion that they "asked" to be born en masse. Only that their selfish obsession with their collective group and individual experiences has had a devasting impact on society.

And as your points illustrate, they are slow to acknowledge and change their attitudes. Forgiveness is much easier when someone has accepted responsibility and seeks a new relationship paradigm.

I didn't say get over it. I said deal with it. If you need someone to blame for your bitterness about the past and your bleak outlook on the future, look in the mirror. Take responsibility for yourself and your circumstances, and stop trying to force it on others. The only thing your toxic attitude will end up doing is poisoning you and those you care about.

Been there, done that, not going back. I was in college when Reagan came out with the MX missile, the most destructive device ever created by man. He called it the "Peacekeeper". I read 1984 in 1984. I used to cry in my Cheerios, too. Its no way to live.

I got saved by Christ three years ago. Now the worst thing that can happen to me is I get to stay around and take care of my son and do the Kingdom work. Not a bad deal if you ask me.

reply to post by Icarus Rising


Just remember while staying around and doing the Kingdom's work, you need to remove hate from your thoughts and heart and love everyone, even those that piss you off on threads, forums, blogs, paper, billboards, ads, sites, news channels, me a Gen-Xer, him or her the Gen-Zer, the early or late boomers, all previous generations and especially the now and future generations...

boasting about being saved and actually living the dream are two different things. Just like claiming donations to charity on your tax returns, once you claim them, their waisted in the sense of God's eyes, do it in private and don't let the world know, otherwise your just looking for justification from people, not God.

EDIT: a little off topic on 2nd paragraph

[edit on 18-4-2008 by WalkOn]

Thanks for saying that. I was convicted over the tone of that last response and was planning to come back and clarify.

I am not boasting about my salvation, though it may sound that way to some. I am very humbly thankful to be saved. Salvation doesn't end suffering either, just puts it in proper perspective. The Kingdom work is very difficult, as well. I am glad to have the opportunity to give it my best effort. I can only hope to present myself as an acceptable sacrifice in the service of my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.

There is no retirement from the Kingdom work. What I am trying to get across to kosmicjack and others similarly disaffected with their lot in life is summed up in Phillipians 4:8

Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

I have done a poor job of it and ask forgiveness from those I've offended. The natural state of man is to avoid suffering and take the easy way out. The spiritual nature of man is to do what is best for all, as revealed by God. It isn't always easy, it isn't always fun, but it is the right thing to do.

Originally posted by Icarus Rising
...Salvation doesn't end suffering either...

That's one thing that many non-believers don't understand, when being saved that just means that you've opened the door to be tested and tried very heavily by both sides, but even greatly tested as Jesus was in the desert by the evil one. Just means our lives will be a much harder road to walk.

Amen on your last statement Icarus.
Peace be with you and all those that are out to test us.

Originally posted by tomfrusso
How can anyone expect to retire???

This is what has been taught to us in schools and it's what we see on the news every night. Its what we read here on ATS every day.

Nothing but doom and gloom.

well, I am 44 years old and I have been saving money for 20 years. I have over 400,000 in my retirement plan and by the time I retire I will have close to 2.5 million, a house that is 7 years away from being paid off, college for my children is funded...

maybe you folks need to learn some self reliance and stop worrying about all the "bling-bling"......

don't count on some one else.....

don't blame anyone else....

save your money....

don't make stupid investments....

don't invest your 401k in high risk investments.

diversify, diversify, diversify

and always use Dollar cost averaging....

social security....what a joke and besides, my mother's ss check is only 1100 per month.

How can anyone live on that?

You folks need to stop buying SUV's, homes you can't afford, vacations you can't afford....

Get the picture -----TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF..........

I read to this point in the thread and that's all I can stand. People, stop whining. Stop complaining. Maybe if you spent less time on ATS blaming the NWO and the cigarette smoking man and whatever other phantoms may or may not be out to squeeze every last penny out of your livelihood, you could spend that time thinking of a solution to your problems. If you thought social security would take care of you when you retired, well that's your bad.

Kudos to this poster here for getting it right. If everyone would simply take care of themselves there would be a lot less to complain about. You're supposed to start saving for retirement in your 20s and if you didn't, that's your bad as well. It's no one's fault but your own if you didn't save, didn't read the fine print on your mortgage, didn't think you needed to finish high school, or whatever.

There is still time. Stop blaming people, shut the web browser, and go out there and solve your own damn problems.

And another thing...to all these people saying "stock up on ammo", "stock up on beans and rice", "build a bunker". It is getting to be a bit ridiculous. So ridiculous in fact that it's starting to be more annoying than funny. No matter how bad things get in the first world they will not be bad enough for people to start doing things like that. People forget that even if wheat stocks are low and there is a bad harvest, Western Europe, Canada, and America are basically all arable land. There is plenty of land to feed everyone inside these borders, and if need be, this land will be farmed. Worst comes to worst, it's a couple tough years. LOL it's not the apocalypse.

[edit on 18-4-2008 by sc2099]

The important thing to keep in mind, imo, is that everything that happens is God's will. We are being shown, in no uncertain terms, that we are incapable of saving ourselves. That is why God brought the Law into the world through Moses, to show man that we are all hopeless sinners in desperate need of the Redeemer promised to Abraham.

The Boomers are not responsible for the state of the world today, just as the Jews are not responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus. It is God's will. He loves us so much that He gave His only begotten Son that we might not perish, but inherit eternal life. Praise God!

Peace be with you, as well, WalkOn. Keep the faith. Romans 8:18,28


[edit on 18-4-2008 by Icarus Rising]

Originally posted by Icarus Rising
Ahabstar, you wouldn't even be here if it wasn't for a Boomer in love, so check yourself before you wreck yourself. Dry off behind the ears before you go spouting more of your patricidal nonsense. What happened to the Boomer Revolution? They had kids and got a mortgage, tried to provide a better life for their children, and look at the thanks they get from you. I can only hope you don't get manipulated and controlled in the very same way.

Rare is the time when I reach for the cold hard steel of the poison pen and despite wanting to make that exception for you I will try to restrain. First it takes two to have a child, usually by love but many of my fellow X'ers were the products of lust or "Love Children". The instability of marriage and family truely reached an epidemic during the 70's and 80's as the fallout of the Sexual Revolution brought about the the worst of the lot, the "War Orphans". Not the children of Vietnam vets; no, the children that had to deal with confused roles of open sexuality, traditional machoism vs sensativity for males and being the fairer sex vs completely equal for females. This transended all racial, gender and social-economic backgrounds.

No, I am far, far removed of a wet behind the ears youngun. And I must say that your use of street language brings an image to mind as goofy as Ron Paul giving gestures of "Raising the Roof" during a rally. Born 1970 and a near photographic memory that goes back to the summer of 1971 when both my Great-Grandmothers died. One Great-Grandfather read articles of Civil War battles when he was sent into town to buy a newspaper as a boy. One of many things I remember from childhood was asking my grandfather (a WWII Artillery Sgt.) why there were problems in Israel and the Middle East over the Yom Kippur War. Grandpa fought in the Battle of the Buldge and was part of the units that entered the camps. I can't imagine the memories of horror that I made him relive while trying to answer my questions about the ugliness of hatred and war. Another article I remember reading as child was when the original Smokey the Bear died.

If you think I am bitter about being from a broken home or whatever, guess again. My parents are still married and have helped me through some tough times, but not everyone of my generation is that fortunate. it is them that I speak for because I can look around myself and see what is going on and speak on their behalf and encourge them to brainstorm solutions eventhough we were never given the keys.

You see, the greatest offense of the Boomers is that of love. They wanted their children to never go through the hardships that they went through. by oversheltering and protecting their children, Gen X lost valuable lessons that will not be passed on to their children either. And that is a very big problem. Both late X and Y have their parents come in to job interviews to help them negotiate their wages for Pete's sake. That is where the failure is. Lost life lessons. Like fishing, auto repair, simple household repairs. Ask a 20-30 year old to point out a maple, oak and walnut tree to you. I can almost bet they get it wrong.

And the bit about patricide was satire. Read it again and maybe you will see the humor in it. As for me, I'll be alright, I was taught the things I needed to know by both my grandfathers and can pass that knowledge on should I ever have children of my own, provided of course I can find a woman that isn't still shell shocked and knows what she wants.

And you can take solstice in the fact that you only have to depend on us in your golden years...we have our children and grandchildren and they are really screwed up.

[edit on 18-4-2008 by Ahabstar]

Wow, I thought I was the only one.

I'm a 'cusp' Boomer/X-er ('65). I've managed to save squat, I'm 2-4 paychecks away from homelessness, and I have never considered financial wealth a form of 'success'. I just never received th memo, I guess. (No cable for 2 years).

Some background: My wife and I met 9 years ago, neither of us are 'Jones-ean materialists'(couple of earth-loving hippies more like it[stop reading now]). We both work in odd fields (audio production and yoga instruction and nanny-ing). We tried the home owner path to retirement. We bought a dilapidated mid-19th century 3 family in the NE US. We made the mistake of marrying the DIY ethos with with easy credit and using a home equity line of credit( appraised at 200+ % of the market value stated!) to finance our restoration dalliance. It may have worked had we been more sophisticated. I will freely admit that.

It didn't work out so well. The biggest snafu turned out to be a medical issue (as they say "out of the blue"). My hip pain, of 7 years, turned out to be stage three degenerative osteo-arthritis. Who knew?( especially at 43!). Luckily, we were able to afford private health care if we moved out of our house and into a rental (owned by friends, in another state). Our work situations turned out to be less than stable (A post's worth of info on this topic, we actually worked for folks who were part of the NWO.....long sad story, Dow , Getty, Rockefeller, No #!). I digress.

What I'm trying to get at, through personal experience, Is that I sincerely believe the young have been sold down the river by their elders. I have proof.

It looks like this. During the 70's and 80's banks were controlled (to some extent) by the Glass Steagall act Click here
During the late 90's 'Slick Willie'(Who I really, really, really wanted to believe) repealed the Glass Steagall act. Several economists and analysts have criticized the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act as contributing to the 2007 subprime mortgage financial crisis. [5] [6]]Repeal of G.S. act


Since then, we've been under the rule of 'shrub junior'(another boomer). His claims to fame have included the "Patriot Act" Wiki Patriot Act. Not only is the 'shrubster' at fault, but 'Daddy Bush' of diminishing markets and lost and his cadre of criminals("how you say?Cheney?") but the list goes back to the vaulted REAGAN era, and before) We are in deep, deep, doo-doo.

Not only is the war of Imperial aggression not going as well as planned( can you imagine?) but the banking system (YA know, the fractional reserve that was spawned 300+ years ago by the chuckle-heads in charge of GREAT BRITAIN). So TPTB are actually in a position of weakness (at least in this hypothetical situation).

I guess what I'm getting at is that the boomer futures traders have had their fingers on the pulse of our current situation. We are the result of the machinations of the market for the last 40 years(and before). But our current situation is far worse than that. We've been sold for the Chattel property we are. The level of our debt and the acceleration of our debt has been egregiously co-opted by the PTB, what's the API on your credit card? Your car loan? your mortgage? (End of Life
]How long will it take to 'work off?'.


And, of those years, how many could've been devoted to working through your 'original
problems'.

Dis-jointed yet somehow prescient? or, at least, not out of the realm of possibility.

Gram

reply to post by Ahabstar


Please. You had me worried with your poison pen pledge. Nice to see you can take what you dish out. I rarely start the mud-slinging, but occasionally (less and less often) get in the pit and fling it with the best of them.

Hard to fathom memories from less than two years of age. Mine start at about three, and they are technicolor, like my dreams. It can be a mixed blessing, as I'm sure you know. Your observations on open sexuality and sheltering are astute and relevant to my own experience, the former in my own childhood and the latter as I try to raise my own son without his mom smothering him completely. Both my parent's and my own marriage ended in divorce. Difference is, I am sticking around and staying engaged with my son as my dad failed to do with me. We patched things up later on, which made a big difference. Accentuate the positive, eliminate the negative.

I had a chip on my shoulder for most of the day today. Not hard to tell from some of my posts, eh? The check yourself line was meant to be what it was. You are a good sport, and I apologize for my rudeness. This turned into a touchy subject for me, and I failed to heed the words of the Book of James and bridle my tongue.

Peace.

[edit on 19-4-2008 by Icarus Rising]

Originally posted by Icarus Rising
My wake-up call was the Nixon Impeachment. Agnew resigns as VP over tax fraud, Ford is appointed VP, Nixon is impeached and resigns, and Ford becomes President and pardons him before any charges are ever brought. Nobody ever cast a single vote for a ticket with Ford on it, and he becomes President of the US and pardons the biggest crook (well second biggest now) to ever hold the office. I was only 10 at the time, but even then I knew something stunk to high heaven in Washington.

The 2000 election was a real kick in the balls to me, too. Katherine Harris as Secretary of State for Florida and also Bush's Florida campaign co-chair, certifies the election result when a recount was mandatory. Can you say "conflict of interest"? USSC Justice Scalia, appointed by Reagan when GHW Bush was VP, then casts the deciding vote to give GW Bush the White House. What a farce!

Ahabstar, you wouldn't even be here if it wasn't for a Boomer in love, so check yourself before you wreck yourself. Dry off behind the ears before you go spouting more of your patricidal nonsense. What happened to the Boomer Revolution? They had kids and got a mortgage, tried to provide a better life for their children, and look at the thanks they get from you. I can only hope you don't get manipulated and controlled in the very same way.

I think most of the dissing on the boomers was tongue in cheek in this thread.

Congrats to the guy with the great retirement plan. Not everyone is as fortunate in that regard and not everyone even has the opportunity to put money aside but that's not to say they wont later in life. On my first full time job they kept telling me to put money in retirement but after bills and college loans there is not much left.

Mid 70's Gen X'er here

I have several IRA's which isn't bad I suppose.

I am a commercial real estate appraiser so I knew that the housing market was being churned and a crash was gonna happen. I saved up for the crash but too bad for me I didn't think such a large chunk of the economy was invested in mortgage backed securities. This sub-prime issue is spilling over and affecting commercial loan availability which is slowing down business.

What worries the hell out of me is that the current recession will effect the people with the good credit. Many people have adjustable prime mortgages and those mortgages are due to adjust soon. The economy better be fixed by then. If the adjustable prime mortgages also start failing then we might as well bend over for the economic train wreck that will screw the country. I am not optimistic .

For those that can properly manage your finances for retirement, I wish you the best.

But what happens if the dollar becomes more like a peso or becomes worthless altogether?

What happens if your investments are exposed to questionable securities?

What happens if your pension gets wiped out? Look at the Bear Stearns employees.

What happens if you thought you were smart and invested in precious metals but the government decides to confiscate it? They have done it before.

What happens if you are sued and have to spend everything you own just to pay the lawyers who defend against lawsuits trying to grab everything you own?

What happens if you or a loved one gets sick? I have seen medical bills wipe out even the most well planned retirements.

If you have any wealth, I can assure you that there are wealthier and more powerful people scheming to get your wealth.

There was a guy that said invest in relationships. I agree. As of yet, the powers that be aren't trying to take your friends with the same effort as they are trying to take your money.

Besides when we are all 80 years old and trying to get some work at that labor camp, you will be glad to have friends there with you to comment on how cold your soup is.