reply to post by neformore
Not sure it was this thread, or one related....you were correct in your assumption that judging the relative heights of the contrails, when produced
by the airplanes, is not accurate as viewed from the ground.
You were just a little off as to the actual separation standards of real jets in flight.
In the high-altitude realm (above 23,000/FL230) the standard, when in Radar coverage, is 5 NM horizontal. It is 2000 feet vertical, unless both
airplanes are RVSM certified (RVSM = Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum). Then, it's 1000 feet.
The RVSM pertains to the airplane's pitot-static system, and technological improvements that guarantee more precision, at higher altitudes, than in
If one airplane is 'in trail', along the same route (airway) and same altitude, then the separation is usually 20 NM. Consider, that at cruise
speeds, at altitude, a jet is moving at approzimately 7 miles per minute. 20 NM gives about 3 minutes separation.....but, even if the one 'in
trail' increases by 30 knots, it will only 'creep' ahead....that's why ATC will impose speed restrictions....they will ask the one in front to
increase speed, if possible, or tell the one 'in trail' to decrease....or, if possible, offer an alternative route, if there's no conflicting
See....this is part of the 'chemtrail' myth...a lack of aviation knowledge. I think some people think that every airplane must fly a particular
Route at all times. Not the case.
There is the 'Flight Planned' Route, filed with ATC prior to departure....but, given the dynamics involved, one can be re-routed after take-off,
given a more direct route to a waypoint downline....can change altitudes, any number of things.
Neforemore, I see you'e in the UK, but you may be interested in a website that tracks flights here in North America, including Canada and
Mexico....called 'FlightAware'.....lots of good aviation info there, I have referred some 'chemtrail' believers to it, to no avail. They won't
Finally, I've noticed some 'chemtrail' advocates mentioning the U-shaped contrails they've seen. Very simple explanation....holding patterns.
I hope to find a link to a graphic, but I will have to describe in the interim.
A standard holding pattern consists of a 'racetrack' pattern, where the 'INBOUND' leg to the holding fix is defined as two minutes. In small
airplanes, the turns are assumed to be 'standard rate'....that is, a 'two-minute' turn....two minutes to complete a 180.
[another edit to add....a standard holding pattern is a two-minute inbound leg, but in the interests of passenger comfort we request, say....'20 mile
legs', for instance, and if there are no traffic conflicts, at our altitude, it is usually approved)
The radius of an airplane's turn varies by speed, and angle of bank. At a high altitude, in a holding pattern, the maximum speed is 230 Knots
(exceptions are made if the airplane's minimum clean config speed is higher than 230K) The standard commercial jet banks at 25 degrees, with
occasional over-shoot to 30 degrees.
This results in a very large "U-Turn"....and, if a conditions are right for a contrail to form, then it will show up.....I have personally seen my
own contrail, as I come around again, in the holding pattern. It's fascinating.
Finally, sorry for being long-winded....a commercial jet, whether it be passenger or cargo, must accont for all the weight onboard. To imagine that
there are thousands of pounds of 'chemicals' being sprayed without anyone's knowledge is simply ludicrous. Because, it would take thousands of
points [edit here....meant to write "pounds"] of some substance, in order to satisfy the claims of the 'chemtrail' enthusiasts.
BTW....there is no equipment to delilver these alleged chemicals, anyway!!
Everyone does know that a pilot pre-flights the airplane before EVERY flight.....right????
[needed to edit for spelling and punct)
[edit on 5/13/0808 by weedwhacker]
[edit on 5/13/0808 by weedwhacker]