[HOAX]Michael Horns Billy Meier photos[HOAX] from C2C tonight

Derek, thank you for your post. This seems to directly conflict with the testimony provided by FIGU's members at the link I provided earlier. Not sure what to make of it. From what I understand, they're take on "Jesus" is that he never existed, so therefore, it wouldn't it be impossible to reincarnate from someone who never was?

[edit on 30-1-2008 by AGENT51]

Pardon me for asking, but what is the current ATS official status of this thread. Is it a hoax-hoax or just a claimed hoax? Or something else? I like hoaxes. That's why I love this title. I thought Micheal Horn worked with C2C? Boy-howdy was I wrong. Everyone should listen to C2C every night they can they are SOOOOO cool. I mean they have microphones and telephones and expose a phony SOOOOOO often. They are my heroes.

Anytime I see [HOAX] in the title I believe it. Pavlovian response and don't read on. This one only has one "[HOAX]" does that mean it's only half an ATS regular [HOAX] or like that drone thing a real hoax of conspiracy by corporatio-Sub-Rosans? I'm thinking the hoax is a hoax... but it could be merely news? C2C quality journalism? They only have the best in [HOAX] technologies and regular credible scholars of such valued studies. Do they pay their guests or do the guests pay them?

The whole "Billy" deal smells like hog lard on challah... I want that sidearm ray gun to add to my rifle collection. Good for huntin' trees.

Vic

[edit on 30-1-2008 by V Kaminski]

Originally posted by AGENT51
Derek, thank you for your post. This seems to directly conflict with the testimony provided by FIGU's members at the link I provided earlier. Not sure what to make of it. From what I understand, they're take on "Jesus" is that he never existed, so therefore, it wouldn't it be impossible to reincarnate from someone who never was?

[edit on 30-1-2008 by AGENT51]

You're welcome and I think that your ability to recognize the contradiction and not claim that it isn't a contradiction means that you are definitely not Michael Horn using an alias.

-Derek

[edit on 30-1-2008 by derekcbart]

Originally posted by Bspiracy

2: you should watch videos of the people in his town and what they have seen. fthose are the most important testimony's as they were THERE and unrelated to his cause

[edit on 21-1-2008 by Bspiracy]

I watched the very first 8mm footage clip on his page

Meiers 8mm footage

and that was enough to see that the guys a fake.

This UFO amazingly swings like it's attached to string....I mean orbits like it's tethered by a Gravitronic Tether.

C'mon sheeple. It's a shockingly obvious fake.

Those Pleadian systems must churn through a lot of string.

Mr. Laforge engage the Twine Drive, I want a complete circle of this C Class Tree before those Skepticians detect our presence.

Please show us the real video that the good towns folk are in possession of?

Weird how only the towns people got the real footage?



[edit on 30-1-2008 by Grimholt]

Originally posted by AGENT51
Well, if you must have an answer, Mr.OldSchool, I simply feel in my own analysis that a duplicate is in order.

Unfortunately... that seems insufficient. You brought the need for duplication into this discussion, even so far as to repost questions from someone who has been rightfully banned from this website. Given your veracity on this point, offering nothing more than, "because," is a cop-out that dodges a very valid question.

So I ask again. Why does this case require from you, and hoax peddler Horn, a completely different standard than all other cases of UFO evidence?

Please. Help us understand why.

Originally posted by johnlear


Those who have allegedly proven him a fake have only done so with alleged findings of nuts and bolts and shelving pins allegedly found on second, third or fourth generation photos posted on the web.

No one allegedly finding Billy Meiers as a fake have ever been to Switzerland or ever talked to Bill Meiers face to face.

But thanks for your post, as uninformed and lacking of facts as it may be.

Whatever...John, why don't you continue to live in your world, and the rest of us will continue to live in the one that has green grass and blue skies.

By the way, I'm glad the intergalactic beings adopted the "red tip" toy designation on their ray guns so they don't get mistakenly mowed down by earthly law enforcement...some fart smellers they are.

Pitif***

reply to post by WhiteWash


Wow I just saw this video? Who is that guy and what is wrong with his eyes? I am definitely not getting in any vans with that guy. Holy cow.

Originally posted by AGENT51
I'm sorry Lotiki, but your posts does not prove your claim. I'm not a Meier follower. You are just sharing information out of context to back up your made up claim. I've backed mine up with a real source

again...show me ONE quote of Billy Meier's where he claims to be Christ. One.

This is a simple matter of what kind of definition do you use. Western society uses the term Jesus Christ and FIGU/Meier use the term Jmmanuel. For the latter Jesus Christ is non-existent and for the former it's the other way around. Capiche?
So when Meier claims to be the reincarnated spirit of Jmmanuel, by 'normal' Western standards he's saying he was who we mistakenly call Jesus Christ. Getting aroused over this particular aspect is somewhat pointless and a distraction. Just look at the claim.

Super thanks for the videos,
from this page:
www.steelmarkonline.com...


That is an expert pilot going back and forth by the tree.
Not quite encircling it.
Didn't think so.
No merry go round ride around the tree.
Mr Lyne suggests only 30 deg of sideways increments is possible.

The second video shows wobble, no Tesla helicopter engine.

The third video shows sparks or plasm shedding off parts on the
right side.

The fourth video shows the cake saucer and there was a slight
wobble and not rock solid as it looks in a smaller video.

The saucer is sort of a free energy device using the electrification
of air. I almost wonder if Ford took the Tesla coil out of the Model T
because it gave better gas mileage.

Making us pay more is an INSIDE JOB, number of inside jobs
broken: zero.
Looks like Bill Meier is being played by the insiders, and making
something out of it..

Originally posted by derekcbart
Here are the images I mentioned in my earlier post.

This first one is from The Silent Revolution Of Truth DVD. This is a photograph taken by Guido Moosbrugger. It is described as a "fiery red big disk" with "glittering drizzle that rained down from that disk."

-Derek

On page 66 of the book "Through Space and Time", this image has been in print for several years now. The caption under the picture reads as thus:

Location: Semjase Silver Star Center
Source: Quetzal

Quetzal demonstrates the burning of static electricity in the parking lot of the center. "Billy" Meier can be seen in the center of the burning.

--------------
I'm going back through this case with a fine tooth comb now and I'm seeing contradictions on both sides.
I'm using this one image as a quick illustration since I knew where it was in the thread and was easy to quote both sources.
I haven't seen the video "Silent Revolution of Truth" yet but will shortly. I have a hard time believing they called this a space ship when in the book it says something completely different.

My point is as I'm going through this case again I see statements being taken and blown out of proportion, mis-interpreted, false accusations, conflicting testimonys etc...

It's SOOO large/ time consuming though plus I completely missed the "raygun' thread that I'm going through and I wonder if I'll be done reviewing everything before the end of 2008, which for some people will be too late anyway as the world will have been destroyed by whatever flavor cataclysm of the week.

Still not 100% debunked though. Sorry, it just isn't. If you read the books written on both sides it just conflicts even more.. sigh.
I am coming up with some surprising differences to what I remember though.

I HAVE seen the part in Silent Revolution of truth titled "The Skeptic" and I would be interested in comments as a retort to Horn's comments. Plus I would like to see the rest of the data / interview if possible.

Edited for TeslaandLyne: I briefly checked the video links of ever2020 you asked about earlier and the sheer amount is suspect but from what I've seen there are a couple of nice vids.. the setup and execution of some makes me scratch my head. Especially the "text in the sky"

b

reply to post by sputniksteve


Hey Sputniksteve,
that Lunatic Was Marshall Applewhite of the Insane Heaven's Gate Cult.

He committed suicide with 38 other members in Rancho Santa Fe, California by mixing liquid with rat poisoning and cyanide.

Enjoy more here:
Marshall Applewhite
and Here:
Heaven's Gate Cult

reply to post by Bspiracy


Hmm... That would be interesting. I am not familiar with that book. The quote from Moosbrugger is exactly what he is saying at the time that picture is showed on-screen. At the same time though, it is definitely not caused by "burning static electricity."

As I mentioned earlier, I am "the skeptic" from the DVD special feature called "The Skeptic" and I would be happy to answer any questions of yours that I haven't addressed already. Earlier in this thread I did point out that they twice changed their story of several years after interviewing me because I had shown how wrong they were. Also, and I cannot remember if I had mentioned this on the thread earlier, I am in the middle of reviewing the DVD for the IIG website. When the review is posted we will also be posting our recording of my being interviewed so that you can see my complete presentation as it originally existed without the editing that was done for the DVD version.

-Derek

[edit on 31-1-2008 by derekcbart]

Originally posted by derekcbart
reply to post by Bspiracy

 

As I mentioned earlier, I am "the skeptic" from the DVD special feature called "The Skeptic"

Yup, knew that was you and I have to say that you did a fine job in explaining your point. I see you are a night owl as well. Seems we that work with digital media and related tend to do that..
I was sent "the skeptic" via the internet from a friend per request. I've been slammed with some projects lately and had it playing on one laptop while I was working on another and I intend to watch it one more time soon..

A couple of questions for you:
'The Skeptic" vid: The panoramic montage.
The one image that fits on top of the panoramic with the tree in the image that disappeared because of Semjase moving it. It fit like a glove but also seemed to have the atmospheric blending that satisfied my cursory examination. Quick comment?
-- He didn't have a rebuttal for some of your comments.

--off topic.. who in the hell was shooting your interview? the way they zoomed in on you was a tad creepy. It's a known characteristic that excessive movement generates mistrust. Your interview compared to the mounted interview of Horn was just odd and I wonder if the movement was intentional for that reason..


2: The wedding cake night image with the alleged model car etc.. Gold in tone. Do you know the exposure setting? I've taken a few night exposures with a small penlight that looks just like a spot light as reflected in the spheres. It depends on a few things and for that question I'm asking off the top of your head. I'll get to it sooner or later in my quest to revisit this case in detail.

3: Wedding Cake and Lid: The match is really close I admit. I've found a few higher res images online of the drum type and I've overlayed the lid directly on the wedding cake ship. I've matched angles, lightened the lid, matched color density etc.. I would like a higher res image if possible so I can marry two high res. I'm searching for a lid here in town as it's obviously a common type. Do you know where a higher res than what Jeff posted earlier is ? Once found, I'll make a small vid or export and animated gif showing the process.

----
The Ring of Fire:
That illustrates my point I tried to make earlier. If they have one explanation in the book I have here in front of me and then in the vid they say something completely different, it goes to show how screwed up the people that try to tout Billy are. It's why I can't really stomach Horn and a few others because it makes the case impossible to defend. The source of all this (Billy) is getting old and has no way of following his followers to make sure they are properly getting the word out..

ED - knew i forgot something - The SPECTRAL analysis in answer to your explanation for how they devised the elements in the metal samples.. Not my vein.. answer for that as well?

b

[edit on 31-1-2008 by Bspiracy]

[edit on 31-1-2008 by Bspiracy]

Originally posted by Bspiracy

Originally posted by derekcbart
Here are the images I mentioned in my earlier post.

This first one is from The Silent Revolution Of Truth DVD. This is a photograph taken by Guido Moosbrugger. It is described as a "fiery red big disk" with "glittering drizzle that rained down from that disk."

-Derek

On page 66 of the book "Through Space and Time", this image has been in print for several years now. The caption under the picture reads as thus:

Location: Semjase Silver Star Center
Source: Quetzal

Quetzal demonstrates the burning of static electricity in the parking lot of the center. "Billy" Meier can be seen in the center of the burning.

Hmm, I wonder about some things. Did Guido Moosbrugger really take credit for shooting that picture? I know he's a staunch supporter of the case, allegedly witnessed some of the events and wrote a book about it but if the pic really shows a feat of pyrotechnics than that would make Moosbrugger quite suspicious. It could mean he's 'in on it'. Subsequently he would have zero credibility. There's the off chance he got tricked perhaps. Nonetheless lets go easy on this whole business for now.

I have a question about the pic. In order to catch the display (as shown in the pic) you'd need to make a lot of rotations per second, but does the camera itself need to be put on a lower shutter speed? Perhaps some of the (old) photo experts guys can answer that.

Since when did some idiot swinging a flare over his head being photographed at night with a tripod mounted camera on slow shutter speed become proof of Aliens, lol?

Billy and his supporters are a crowd I will never understand, and don't want to . They, and their ignorant supporters, make us all look like utter fools for even being involved in Ufology.

reply to post by IgnoreTheFacts


Thats not a flare. That is Mieres heroically standing within the Twine engines red zone o death which lies directly underneath the enormous dark intergalatic transportation Flare...ship.

Thrust forward and beyond!

IgnoreTheFacts -- "Since when did some idiot swinging a flare over his head being photographed at night with a tripod mounted camera on slow shutter speed become proof of Aliens, lol?"

My point in the post above is that it is NOT proof but was originally declared a demonstration. If the current Vid "Silent Revolution" says different than what I have in print then there is a clear rift in the supporters.

-----

TerraX - Yes, it would have to be a slower speed. In the image above if you look at the reflections on the cars you notice a similar effect as the wedding cake night shot. Meaning the reflections are very distinguished and if you were to crop the forward car out of the rest of the image the reflections could be interpreted in many ways.



b

Originally posted by mister.old.school

Originally posted by AGENT51
Well, if you must have an answer, Mr.OldSchool, I simply feel in my own analysis that a duplicate is in order.

Unfortunately... that seems insufficient. You brought the need for duplication into this discussion, even so far as to repost questions from someone who has been rightfully banned from this website. Given your veracity on this point, offering nothing more than, "because," is a cop-out that dodges a very valid question.

So I ask again. Why does this case require from you, and hoax peddler Horn, a completely different standard than all other cases of UFO evidence?

Please. Help us understand why.

Those questions are valid to you. And I commend you for it. I think just for the sake of argument someone should make a duplicate but thats just my opinion. And who knows, I might be making the model someday. Relax Mr.Cool Ice.



[edit on 31-1-2008 by AGENT51]

[edit on 31-1-2008 by AGENT51]

Originally posted by AGENT51
Those questions are valid to you. And I commend you for it. I think just for the sake of argument someone should make a duplicate but thats just my opinion. And who knows, I might be making the model someday. Relax Mr.Cool Ice.

You're evading the point that you yourself elevated to a level of high importance within this discussion. You're the person who placed high importance on answers to Horn's inane questions as some unique measure by which all "debunkers" must be judged.

Since you brought Horn's "standards" into this discussion, and repeatedly injected the need for answers to his questions, I believe it is only fair that you provide your rationale for doing so.

Again, why will replicating the hoax by building models provide insight into analysis of fraudulent photos and videos?

Incorrect. I simply re-posted his questions to see if anyone could answer them. You are the only one who attempted to. And you answered with "irrelevant" to almost every question. You can keep asking me the same question if you want to.



For the most part, I am satisfied with this discussion and do not feel the need to further it into thread hell.

[edit on 31-1-2008 by AGENT51]