reply to post by Johnmike
Why do you even waste your breath? Or in the case of the computer, the energy to type?
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reply to post by Sublime620
It's less of a waste than other things.
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reply to post by Johnmike
Not if you add in the brains cells I lost after it nearly exploded from another neo-conservative commentor who clearly didn't watch the movie.
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 Originally posted by Sublime620
Not if you add in the brains cells I lost after it nearly exploded from another neo-conservative commentor who clearly didn't watch the movie.
Unless it's free, I encourage everyone to not watch it unless there's some serious redeeming factor. Who's neo-conservative?
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i think that if you are a mormon and live in utah, i want you to stay there. i don't want to see your "missionarys" coming on to my property. i
will have the police come out and arrest you for tresspassing. i do not want any taxpayer money (mine or any other liberals) going to your state. i
don't want you to be involved in any of my communities political elections or in any decision making capacity that will have an effect on myself or
my family. if you act or do something that is not inline with my own moral values, i will file a lawsuit against you. i will also seek out those that
support you and make sure they "understand" that they are puttung themselves at "risk" for trying to change the way my community operates.
and why do i say these things...because mr. anderson in the movie has shown me the proper "conservative mormon" way to live my life.
[edit on 26-1-2008 by jimmyx]
[edit on 26-1-2008 by jimmyx]
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reply to post by radiodjguy
what i'm more concerned with are the people that pulled 200,000 dollars from the donations to the collage. they don't believe in education, they
believe in indoctrination to a right-wing philosophy. and we have no idea who those people are or what power they wield over people that do not
believe as they do...the real control and how to find it, is given in my "signature" below
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reply to post by Johnmike
Just wondering what you are talking about in this post:
Was it sarcasm? Did you not watch the movie? What does "unless it's free" mean?
I guess this is why one line posts are discouraged. You've made about 3 one line posts and I have no idea what your point is.
[edit on 28-1-2008 by Sublime620]
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I fail to see why anyone, especially a college educated person, would want to have either of those clowns speak anywhere. Neither Hannity nor Moore
seemed to be saying anything substantial, just bashing the opposing viewpoint. This is the kind of "intelligent discourse" that people pay to get?
Pathetic. Total waste of money, in my opinion.
That being said, I completely support their right to speak their opinions, and the right of the students to hire them. (You've got to use that budget
somewhere, right?) I think the locals who were all whipped up about not wanting to expose their children to Moore's ideas need to remember that the
University has many students from other places (at least as far away as Africa) who are not subject to the decisions of other student's parents. If
you don't want your child to hear it, keep them home. The other kids have paid to be there, too, and shouldn't be affected by what the locals may or
may not want.
I also think that if they (the locals) want to keep the outside world out of their town so completely, they should not be allowed to join in making
decisions affecting the outside world, such as who the President is. Voting for idiots and then hiding away from the mess said idiots create just
isn't right, to me.
The video itself I thought was pretty well done, giving both sides without resorting to complete cherry-picking editing to make one side or the other
look like raving nutjobs. My compliments to the film makers on that, I'm sure it wasn't easy.
Definitely worth the watch. Thanks for hosting it, ATS. 
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I live in Salt Lake City UTAH!! dun dun dun ;-)
I have to come in and say that in SLC, just SLC there are a lot of well educated, free minded, tolerant and dare I say it "liberal" people.. just
check out former mayor Rocky Anderson who is a livid anti-war protester (as well as a alternative energy supporter who drives a natural gas car) Side
note on natural gas: SLC has tons of gas stations for those cars, so in SLC Utah you don't see that kind of hate or ignorance. My family is Mormon,
but I decided it didn't work for me when I was 10 or 11 years old and they respect that.
It was sad to see the way they treated the liberals, but I think it's cool the liberals stuck to their guns and were for the most part being the
nicer person (cause no one is better person than anyone else).
So back to my point, you go in any direction away from SLC in Utah and you'll find plenty of people who act like that in Orem. So not all of Utah is
like that, just *most* of Utah. SLC has a lot of good things.
To comment on the Alex Jones comment in an earlier post, I have watched quite a bit of his stuff and think he is good at what he does. I support him
because it seems like he spends so much time seeking the truth.
But Michael Moore, I have no problem with him. Bowling for Columbine & Fahrenheit 9/11 were good, but in a way it makes it seem like Bush is only
stupid. It doesn't emphasize that it may have been, or probably was (in my head it definitely was) an inside job to start a bogus war for their own
interests.
Thanks to ATS for posting this!
Cheers
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I really enjoyed this video!
I have to say though, that Kay Anderson guy really freaks me out, a bit of a self righteous nut if you ask me; being from the Scotland in the UK
though i do not know or understand much about American politics, but as far as religions go, we are pretty leanient (as far as my experiances go) if
some one is religious so what, i know christians, mormons and there is a jehovah's witness church literally right next door to me, and nobody cares,
we all get along; nobody tried to impose religion, or chase anyone away for that matter. I find the state of things in Utah quite strange actually.
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First I shall give you a short background on me:
First of all: I hate Michael Moore. He is a sellout who cares not about spreading truth but only about stirring up controversy if it will put more
coin in his pocket. Despite the fact that much of what he says is true, it is all lies in my opinion as it is all based on his greed.
Second of all: I spent sixteen years of my life devoted to the Mormon religion. I was as devout a Mormon as anyone could be. In the Mormon religion,
they called me a "Peter Priesthood" because I was so extremely devout.
Third: I lived in Orem, UT for a large fraction of my life. I know the town, I know the people, I know the culture, I know the mentality.
Fourth: I served in Iraq with the United States Army, (Active Duty).
That being said, I am ready to critique this documentary.
I would first like to say that anyone who says this documentary is un-biased is blind. This documentary was clearly made to discredit the
"narrow-minded" Utah Mormons who fought for Michael Moore's banishment. The film-makers did a *relatively* more-than-decent job of hiding this
bias, but if you do not see it you're blind.
Secondly I would like to give the utmost respect to every individual who went against the grain and supported Michael Moore. Being a former resident
of this town I know the challenges they must have faced were more than just what were shown in this documentary. Utah may be 75% Mormon, but the town
of Orem is over 99% Mormon. There is a greater concentration of Mormons, and a greater ratio of Mormons to non-Mormons in the town of Orem than any
other place in the entire world. Anyone who openly supports anything that is even remotely not conducive to the Mormon faith in Orem, UT is going up
against great odds.
As I said, I am not at all a Michael Moore supporter. No matter how much he says is actually true, he says it not for the sake of truth but for his
own greed. However, I would not spend one second of my time supporting an effort to deny anyone the right to speak. I am not surprised by the
reaction of a large portion of the student body of UVSC, and am in fact surprised that as many supported Michael Moore as did. I don't support
Michael Moore, but to quote Voltaire: "I disagree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
I think what Mr. Anderson was forgetting was that "his" community was not made up solely of conservatives, or Republicans, or even Mormons, but WAS
in fact made up of AMERICANS. He can talk all day about the "majority" of his community, but the fact is that he does not represent his community,
and thus has no right to speak for them. If he disagrees with something, he has every right to speak out against it. But speaking in the name of
"his" community was ignorant at best. And the fact that he tried to bribe the college into keeping Michael Moore out shows just how desperate he
was.
God forbid somebody come into his community with a dissenting opinion. If the belief structure that "his" community hold so dear is so incredibly
important and perfect, than how could a *presumably* false ideology being verbalized to that community be so damning? If his belief structure is so
correct, then shouldn't that of others be proven false and thus serve to verify the validity of his own? If he is so afraid of dissenting opinions,
it must be because he fears that he might be proven wrong, right?
And one question: were the people holding the signs that said, "Ignorance is bliss, leave us alone Moore" being sarcastic, or were they really
admitting that they liked being ignorant and not being aware of others' opinions?
Also, that Specialist in uniform who talked about the military not supporting Michael Moore: how dare he speak for the rest of us! If he has his own
opinion, let him speak it. But let him not speak for the rest of us; let us verbalize our own opinions. Screw Michael Moore, but more importantly
screw everyone who wants to shut him up.
And lastly, Michael Moore said something that I have been yearning for for some time now: he apologized. I don't think it right for him to apologize
on behalf of other people, but I would really like an apology from the American people for sending me to Iraq on behalf of *NOT FREEDOM*, but greed.
I've been to Iraq, and I've seen the true nature of this war. I am as much to blame as anyone else for my being there, but I'm not going to lie:
as much as I hate Michael Moore, and I know it was basically a publicity stunt, I shed literal tears when he apologized for my life being put on the
line for this bullcrap.
[edit on 1/3/08 by an3rkist]
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