Delluded Americans

Say what you will about USA,this isn't only place with issues,read the news there are problems all over,I will take my chances here rather than some 3rd world country,and most who say negative things haven't even been here,I think a few posters should do reasearch before opening mouth and inserting foot

Hi Oldtimer of course your quite correct all countries have their own problems but the majority of them aren't waging a war of global conquest and thats the proble.

Manyof the problems that the US is having now is because of its own action be they direct or indirect. At the moment there is much talk of the US and possibly Israel attacking Iran and maybe with nukes, if they did just what do you think the outcome would be or World reaction to such an event.

How could the leaders of the US place its own people in such a position where they would be seen as mass murderers who again used nukes against a country that has no means of fighting back.


Would the US launch nukes at Russia or China no it would not because your Goverment know's it would get the same treatment. Many Americans need to realise that people arent out to get them and it is the actions of the US Goverment and those who control said Goverment they see as the real enemy.

Sooner or later these criminals will be brought to justice as more and more people find out the truth and do not fall for the deception, lies and fear mongering that has been churned out on a daily basis since 9/11.

Well, if we're going to use analogies, and America is like an "alcoholic friend" who can't get off the satan sauce, then what characterizations can we make of other countries?

China?- He's the next door neighbor who we constantly hear over the fence screaming at and beating his wife and kids, but gives us a friendly wave and smile when we see him watering his front lawn.

Iraq (and most of the middle east in general)?- He's one of the drug dealers who lives in the house on the corner. A lot of shady people come and go at all hours, and his buyers are always trolling up and down the street scoping out the other houses.

I don't mean to insult anyone, in fact just the opposite. I wanted to point out that analogies can be a bad way to argue, especially when they're charged and biased. Remember, America is made up of Chinese and Middle-eastern people, too.

reply to post by Techsnow

Ya you're preaching the choir over here. You shouldn't come to ATS and say that crap. I think most people who have done their research can come to say that, yes, a lot of Americans are brainwashed... and yes, I say that as an American. So just get over it, I hate this kind of stuff. In fact you're post is so biased and angry towards America = a desperate nation for reform, that I'm adding you a foe.

America is seen as the enemy and the one leading us into chaos because you are the only Super Power that is left! When you are in charge everything is your fault!

We know thats not true,but that is what you get if you want to rule the world.Us Brits know all about that attitude,we've been there and done it.We've done glorious things for the world and committed terrible crimes,but people will only remember the blood and the wars rather than remembering all we did.Thats natural though.When times are hard you think only of the bad things.

America is now in this position.If you don't like it,then renounce your throne!!

I know for a fact that magicmushroom is not anti-American,he isn't anti anyone! I lot of what he says is true,America does live in a kinda bubble,and saying you live far away won't cut it anymore,the Internet is the window to the world!

But like others have said,too many people (and not just in America) believe everything in the Media,or even worse,believe what celebrities say!!
Yet for those who are not that gullible,where are you? Why are you not in the streets protesting on a daily basis? Whats that,you might get hurt? Welcome to the real world.Standing up for your rights usually equals bloodshed,but i do not believe that all of America is too cowardly just to sit and do nothing!
Do you really want your country to be led into a third war? Afghanistan,Iraq and maybe Iran next.And will it stop there? And when more soldiers die will you you be happy when your government has to start conscripting soldiers?

This war against Terror is your 21st century version of the war on
Communism that you waged in Vietnam.And now,as then,you are being led into chaos against people's who are not your enemy.You are fighting wars that don't have to be fought.
If you,and the rest of us just stopped interfering with these countries then there would be less hatred towards the Western world!!

reply to post by Copernicus


This seems to be common with Americans,admit these are bad but then compare yourselves to other countries.

You,and you alone are the worlds only Super Power!
You are not a dictatorship like China.You are not a Muslim state.You are not a 3rd world country.You are not run by (obvious) tyrants like Afghanistan was by the Taliban.
You are the world leaders,do you understand what that means? And if you act in a violent and oppressive manner,then why should other countries not follow suit? Why should they lay down weapons when you won't? Why should they act any differently than you? The US Government is hypocritical.After Russia you have the most nukes,you are the only country to have ever used them,yet you think other countries shouldn't have them! You talk of human rights,or lack of,in Muslim countries,but just look at how your prisoners get treated! Look at Guantanamo Bay,people held for years without trial!!

As i said earlier,
If you don't like all the flack you are getting,then renounce your throne!!
Or get your asses into gear!

[edit on 29-10-2007 by jakyll]

reply to post by magicmushroom


What is your deal? this is not the first post of this kind I have come across from you. You claim you are not anti American but your every word screams other wise. With titles like deluded Americans it screams hatred. Try being constructive for once. your post do no good they don't help things they make things worse. if you truly deep down in your heart want to help don't name your post things like deluded Americans. what good does it do? it invites American haters to spread there hate, yet you claim you don't hate America. I just don't get it.

Originally posted by magicmushroom

But where are all the smart Americans, where are all those who do know whats going on, where in the Worlds alleged largest democracy is the hue and cry to these recent events, there is none.

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Is it because your so patriotic that you cannot see right from wrong that you are like children easily fooled by the illusonists tricks or is it you like it that way.

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We the people have always had the power to bring about change be it the Israelites fleeing Eygpt or the people of the French revolution so what is your excuse Americans.

You know, this is a tough one to answer. I mean to answer truthfully would be considered so un-PC nowadays. Humor me, allow me to go back in time BEFORE 9/11 and share with you my "delusions" and what would be our reality today in the USA if not for our increased security. And please realise that these are just the basics, I have experienced many more "delusional" moments involving peace loving Muslims who would never ever do us harm. (Note: I was very upset recalling the following events, please excuse the grammar and order).

Originally posted by seentoomuch

1. This was in ’94 or ’95. The memories of being chased by Muslim men through the streets of Paris as they yelled "infidel dog" feels my heart with great love for this peace loving religion. All I had done was to go shopping in an area of Paris which was mostly Arab and was buying some vegetables to make a stew. (Not knowing that certain areas in Paris were no go's I had no idea that this would happen. It was not something which the city govt. wanted known, it would hurt tourism) I was wearing a white T-shirt and khaki shorts and my red hair made me stand out a bit I guess. Note: a few picked up some cobbles and threw them at me, none hit me, which I thought was very kind of these peace loving people.

2. (Some of the logistics in this story may not be accurate, I was in shock for quite a while and some of it is blurred it was so horrible.) I lived a 5 minute walk from St. Michel metro station which is located at the edge of the Seine. The St. Michel line continues on under the river and is part of a network of metro tunnels. One day a very peaceful Muslim bought some propane canisters for camp stoves, he rigged them and put them in his backpack. (This next part was told to the news there by a survivor, a little old lady who had lived through the Nazi occupation of Paris). It was rush hour and the commuters were packed like sardines in the metro cars. The stop before St. Michel a 20 something Muslim got on board with his backpack. This lady saw him jam his backpack under one of the seats as there was no room to stand with it and he grabbed a hand grip hanging from the ceiling to stay steady as the metro moved to its next stop.

At St. Michel he got out and with the doors still open looked in at all the people, the lady yelled that he had forgotten his backpack. He stared back with his dead black eyes and grinning he flipped the finger at them all and said “Praise Allah!” and “Die Infidels” as the doors closed. She realized that this might be related to the recent bombings of the Algerian Muslims and she yelled to everyone to push to the back of the car as much as possible and she did as well.

The backpack exploded and 8 people were killed in that car and over two hundred were wounded. I heard the explosion and ran outside my apartment as did everyone else in the area and soon we realized what had taken place. My husband and I watched them carry the bodies out of the metro on stretchers; they soon ran out of these and had to send for more from all over the city. Other bombs went off at almost the same time and later upon interviewing “friends” of the bombers it was discovered that the plan had been to flood the metro tunnels and drown everyone (thousands) by strategically bombing and bursting the walls of the underwater metro lines.

3. Explosives were found in the cargo hold of a large passenger flight, its route was to fly directly over central Paris and the plan which was called in to a newspaper was to explode the plane over Paris and rain blood and body parts across the city. Their over-all goal was to finish what the Nazis had not, they said. This was in the early ‘90s, and from that point on Paris was considered a city under seige once again. Armed military were stationed all over the city and there were continued bombings and attacks on schools, the younger the victims, the better is what they announced through various media.

4. Walking to a Jewish bakery close to my home (thy have wonderful cheesecake there) two Arab men started following me, their wives were with them, but they were walking several steps behind the men. The peaceful kind Muslims were having a wonderful early evening stroll yelling out, “Infidel whore!” “ Let’s go f__k!” and continued to describe what they wanted to do to the said Infidel whore. Once again, I was wearing a white T-shirt with Khaki shorts and tennis shoes, not really out of line, it was clear they were cruising the Jewish district for someone to harass; it being so close to dinner time all the policemen were having their dinners so I ducked into the bakery and stayed there until they left. When I got home my husband and one of his associates went to go find them but they were gone. This was in ’94 or ’95.

5. 80's: And consider this also; a close friend of mine is a scholar of the Quran, he is from Turkey and just recently went back to help take care of his parents and he is now teaching courses on the Quran there. When he first moved here he spent most of his time with the Muslims in our area from Iran, though some called it Persia. He introduced me into the group and we all had many dinners together. After awhile I noticed that he had stopped visiting with them and I asked him why.

He explained to me that though they are over-all good people they felt obligated to be anti-American, anti-Christian, anti-anything that is not Muslim and that he did not agree with them on this. I said that I never got that impression from them and he explained further saying that the discussions he was referring to usually occurred after dinner, away from the women and that the men would all spend the evening talking about how they hate America (though it had educated them and had given them a livelihood) and would recount with pride the double dealings they had performed on infidels that day and would plan with excitement more to follow. All the men joined in, some out of fear of not being considered a good Muslim, others for the feeling of superiority over all others that it gave them.

He argued the Quran with them for many nights to try to change their views but in the end they considered him a bad Muslim. From then on he spent his evenings with Americans and he said that it was refreshing just to be who he is, a true Muslim and that it broke his heart that so many had twisted the meaning of his religion. This was in the early 80s.

STM

OP:

If you think for one minute that they wouldn't do the same to your children, your wife, your mother, you, well then you're the one that is deluded.

STM

[edit on 10/30/2007 by seentoomuch]

reply to post by magicmushroom


The most simple answer you could break that question down into is "Fear."
When Americans finally decide they've had enough and actually WANT to see past the bull#, maybe they'll start realizing that it is the people, and only the people, who have ever made a difference

Originally posted by Illuminated88
The most simple answer you could break that question down into is "Fear."
When Americans finally decide they've had enough and actually WANT to see past the bull#, maybe they'll start realizing that it is the people, and only the people, who have ever made a difference

I had no fear as I was purchasing stew vegetables. So why did they chase me down the street throwing stones? You seem so wise, so please, tell me the truth of the matter. And keep in mind this was in the mid-90s, pre 911. Explain this please. Tell me the rationale behind these moves.

STM

[edit on 10/30/2007 by seentoomuch]

Dear Angry if you read some of my other comments about Americans you would see that on thwe whole I see them as victims of the plot. The reason for the threads is as Jakyl has stated, you are a World leader and are followed by example.

Whilst your Government screams at outrage committed by radical Muslims your own Goverment is torturing people and worse. And my views are posted here because of the arrogant attitude of so many American members here on ATS.

Its the kind of language I would expect of some radical fanatical groups and not from the mouths of what is supposed to be the Worlds greatest Democracy.

Stating what others have done in their past does not negate the actions of your Goverment or the attiude of its supporters. But as I have posted before your country, its people and its goverment have been highjacked to do the dirty work ofor those who have the real Global ambitions.

As many of your fellow countrymen have said America has done much good but that is easily forgotten and its miss deads and the suffering it inflicts on others on a daily basis is not.

Americans should not be proud that their country can kick ass, nuke anyone, invade anyone, kill whom they like, their is no pride in that and the sooner that peole realise that it will be for the better.

But if I could give you any solace I would be typing the same if it was China, India, Russia or good old Blighty.

There is much the American people can do its just a case of getting organised and clearing the crap out of ones brain to see whats really going on. You all live in that democracy exercise your rights whilst you still have them.

reply to post by angryamerican

What is your deal? this is not the first post of this kind I have come across from you. You claim you are not anti American but your every word screams other wise. With titles like deluded Americans it screams hatred. Try being constructive for once. your post do no good they don't help things they make things worse. if you truly deep down in your heart want to help don't name your post things like deluded Americans. what good does it do? it invites American haters to spread there hate, yet you claim you don't hate America. I just don't get it.

Delusion has no connection to hatred whatsoever,it means you have to wake up!!
As said earlier,i know for a fact he doesn't hate Americans,he is not racist in any way.
So instead of getting all defensive actually look at what he is saying.Look at it until you get it,and if you can't understand then don't bother replying to him!

reply to post by jakyll



Oh I get it and Ive gotten it before when him and I went around on another hate America spreading thread.

do not think to tell me what I can and cant reply to As long as I Don't break the Terms I can reply to whom ever and what ever I want to. As stated this is not the first time not even close to the first time. Dont like what I say put me on ignore.

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Dear Angry if you read some of my other comments about Americans you would see that on thwe whole I see them as victims of the plot. The reason for the threads is as Jakyl has stated, you are a World leader and are followed by example.

First as you may remember I have read and joined many of your threads, I very clearly see what your about.
Second I am not a world leader My friends are not world leaders. we a simple people who work play love and live just as people in other country's. Our government may be world leaders but we stopped being the same as our government a very long time ago. As previously stated in my other reply. You do not help you hurt with titles like deluded Americans.

Whilst your Government screams at outrage committed by radical Muslims your own Goverment is torturing people and worse. And my views are posted here because of the arrogant attitude of so many American members here on ATS.

Yep lets talk about those outrages shall we. Lets talk about a beautiful little girl who is 6 years old who is growing up with out her mother who took the Muslim elevator to to the basement via the world trade center. it was her first day back at work after giving birth. I got a call from her that morning she talked about how hard it was to leave her baby but they needed the money. I said before you know it the day will be over and you will be holding your baby again. well for her and little Katie the day never ended.

why dont you bitch at them as much as you bitch at us? Two wrongs will never make a right but and I feel deep shame for what is going on

Its the kind of language I would expect of some radical fanatical groups and not from the mouths of what is supposed to be the Worlds greatest Democracy.

Stating what others have done in their past does not negate the actions of your Goverment or the attiude of its supporters. But as I have posted before your country, its people and its goverment have been highjacked to do the dirty work ofor those who have the real Global ambitions.

As many of your fellow countrymen have said America has done much good but that is easily forgotten and its miss deads and the suffering it inflicts on others on a daily basis is not.

Americans should not be proud that their country can kick ass, nuke anyone, invade anyone, kill whom they like, their is no pride in that and the sooner that peole realise that it will be for the better.

But if I could give you any solace I would be typing the same if it was China, India, Russia or good old Blighty.

There is much the American people can do its just a case of getting organised and clearing the crap out of ones brain to see whats really going on. You all live in that democracy exercise your rights whilst you still have them.

Angry the fact is that Muslims persee are just like you and I and on a larger scale they are not going around invading other peoples countries are they. But America and Americans are and thats the difference.

Despite what you may think of me or my views one cannot detract from the truth and that is that many Americans think its great to kill, loot and pillage and it is they whom I target in my threads.

As for 9/11 there is still no shread of proof of whom was behind the attacks and the US Goverment as seen fit to muzzle any real enquiry into the event.

And just to enquire, why are you angry, is it because of people with views such as mine or is it because of your fellow countrymen who bring shame and dishonour on you and your country.

reply to post by angryamerican


Why should i put you on ignore when your replies make me laugh!?!

As i am magicmushroom's daughter i can say,with great authority,that he is not racist and he does not hate Americans.He just hates your government,as do many people.The same goes for the British government.

You need to stop winging like a lil girl."what about this country,what about that country." America is none of those places!!
People can talk about the state of life in other countries til their blue in the face,but it doesn't change the fact that America is the only Super Power and therefore the Moral Leader of the world!!

You believe the lies about 9/11,and you believe the media hype that all muslims are bad.You have invaded 2 countries that had no connection to 9/11.Osama is a Saudi.The hijackers were Saudi,according to the government Saudi Arabia has the largest number of Al Quaeda members in the world! So why isn't that country being dealt with? Oh,thats right,because its all a load of boll***s! No one would plan something as large as 9/11 and not have a back up plan.Do you see unified Muslim countries? No.Has any Muslim country gone on a huge arms making program? No.Do any Muslim country have easy access to America and therefore a base at which to wage a war? No.Have there been any other major attacks on America? No.Has there been a cistamatic bombing campaign waged by Muslims against the west? No.Have W.O.M.D. been found in Iraq yet.No.You would expect these kind of things,would you not?
Your isolation is your greatest strength and your biggest weakness.And no foreign country in their right mind would plan 9/11 and then sit back and do nothing!! Everyone knew what the American reaction would be to such an event,so you would expect one helluva phase 2,but that just aint happened!


Some have said that the Taliban gave Osama shelter and support.And? Your point? Some American-Irish and Australian-Irish gave money to the IRA.Britain didn't see the need to invade those countries and start a war!
The Americans (and probably the Brits too) gave money and support to Osama to build the caves in the Afghan mountains,so are you telling me they can't find them now?


As soon as Saddam was toppled it was easy to see what would happen.All the different religious/political groups would fight for their own space and way of life.Could the experts not predict this? You are now fighting people who you claimed you were there to save.I have an American friend who's serving in Iraq and she's said the whole things going to hell in a hand basket.No one knows who to fight,no one knows who the enemy is,soldiers are dying when they don't need to be,they have no proper equipment or supplies,no one knows who's in charge and what orders to follow,etc etc.
And America is now talking of invading Iran!! Screwing up 2 countries is obviously not enough.The British did the same thing with the Middle East,but it seems you have learned nothing from our mistakes!

Do you understand what Illegal War means?

If you can understand that you will understand everything!!




[edit on 30-10-2007 by jakyll]

Did you guys ever stop to think that perhaps the powers that be, illuminati and other groups, have specifically desgined and implemented acts to purposefully create a holy war between the 2 biggest Religious groups in the World????

(Christians vs. Muslims)

I Love me some Jesus, but I don't believe in fighting holy wars. I simply turn the other cheek. However an internal US anti-gov revolution is a whole nother story.

reply to post by dominicus


I have often thought that.
Which of course leads to the question of,why would they do such a thing??