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Skeletons of Inca-people found in Norway. How and Why...

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posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 10:51 AM
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This is my first post on this forum, and I am a bit uncertain where I should post this. And I have possibly done it wrong. But here goes:
Today I found an interesting article in the biggest paper of Norway (VG).

Article taken from the “VG\Verdens Gang”

Inca found in Østfold

Archaeologists have found the remains of a skeleton supposedly from 1000 AD in “Sarpsborg”, Norway. The skeleton has the same genetic marks as the Inca people of Latin America.

The archaeologists got them selves a big surprise when they were to remove some rosebushes. Beneath them they found the remains of two elderly men and one baby.
- When we grabbed the roots of the rosebushes, bones came tumbling down. It was quite shocking. States the archaeologist Mona Beate Buckholm from “Borgarsyssel” Museum.
One of the craniums had specific marks of a typical Inca Indian.
- It is a bone in the neck, that has not grown (sorry, but there is no precise word for “grodd” in English). This is an inherited mark that can only be found on the skeletons of the Inca Indians in Peru and their bloodline. This is an amazing.

Archaeologists will now try to determine what the man did in “Østfold”, and how he got there.

Here is the original text from “VG”:


Inkaindianer funnet i Østfold

Arkeologer har funnet skjelettrester fra 1000-tallet i Sarpsborg med samme trekk som inkaindianerne.

Da arkeologene skulle flytte noen rosebusker, fikk de seg en stor overraskelse. For under en av rosebuskene lå benrester fra to eldre menn og en baby.

- Idet vi skulle ta under rosebusken, raste det ut skjelettrester. Det var ganske overraskende, sier arkeolog ved Borgarsyssel Museum, Mona Beate Buckholm.

Det ene av kraniene hadde trekk som kan tyde på at mannen var en inkaindianer.

- Det er et ben i nakken som ikke har grodd, og det er et arvelig trekk som bare finnes hos inkaindianerne i Peru. Det er sensasjonelt, sier Buckholm.

Nå vil arkeologene forsøke å finne ut hva mannen gjorde i Østfold, og hvordan han har kommet seg dit.


The question I ask myself is of course how these people got here. Even more amazing is how they arrived in Norway so early. 1000 AD is just about the time when Norway went from being a land of the Viking Lords to become a Christian nation (they where of course forced to). We have a well known history of this time, and many specimens are found of the two different races living in Norway, but not once have it occurred a finding like this. Not even close. Norwegian adventurer and explorer “Thor Heyerdahl” (known from the “kon-tiki expedition”) had theories of immigration from the Inca people to Polynesia. But did they go as far as Northern-Europe. As far as Norway? And how could possibly this be done? And wouldn’t it be more remains of Inca people here in Norway if they did cross the sea? Or perhaps other places in Europe? Many people believe that many of the Latin American people had first time contact with Extraterrestrial life, and some even believe they are their descendants. However, this event could shed new light on the questions about the presumably “aloof” people like the Inca and perhaps the Maya. The history of immigration, and of course Erich Von Danikens theories
. What do you people make of this? I might add that I try not to assume anything, but it sure is weird that these remains found their way to Norway all of a sudden. I even ask myself if E.T life intervened in some kind of way, though I cannot say why they dumped these people in Norway
… ohh..very long post. Sorry, but had to hear other peoples opinion on this.

My history is possibly not of the best and neither my English, but I think that the historic events stated are accurate enough.

If any new happens to this, I will try to follow up.

````````````````
added 'ex' tags


[edit on 26/6/07 by masqua]




posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 10:53 AM
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Sorry, but I would have exceeded the 4000 character maximum. so here's the ending

Link to the article in VG:
www.vg.no...

This is what wikipedia has to say about the ”Inca”
en.wikipedia.org... (note. Some states that the Inca empire arose in the 11th century, and some states that it arose even earlier. And some states that it arose in the 13th century)
This is what wikipedia has to say about ”kon-tiki”.
en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 10:57 AM
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Sakif, good find! It would be amazing for an Inca to have traveled that far. Yet, it would not be impossible.

Still, one has to wonder if this could have been some bones that were transported to that area in the last century for study or something, and then re-buried.

Interesting just the same.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:26 AM
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Yeah. Point well taken. The remains could have been brought over, but there is some problems to that what so ever. In the last 19th and 20th century norway was quite an isolated country. The people was so concerned about ourselves because of the fact that we had our own independence declared in 1814 (after several years under Denmark). But then we was under the reign of Sweden until 1905. In this years and until the 1nd and 2nd world war, the Nowegian people had more than enough trouble by trying to identify themselves, our culture and our own history. We have allways been a small unsegnificant country until we hit the Oil Jackpot. You could say that scientist ann archeoalagists were more or less unknown professions in Norway in these years. We had little information about the outside world, and we did not care either (weird as it is
). Though many Norwegians immigrated to the United states in the time, extremely few came back. Mostly people immigrated to the northern part of USA. And as far as I know USA was a rather "new" country in it self, so study on natice Inca and Maya was not of the most important studies of the time. And the fact that the bones was dated to 1000 AD.. That is just to vierd
One should belive that if these remains was brought over to study, that it would be considered exlusive objects, and that they would have records of them or something. And why just dump the bones? That is even more crazy than the meere posibillity that Aliens brought Inca here.
Ahh.. maybe i'm just full of it. Wishing that Aliens did this or something



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:28 AM
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It's impossible that the Incas, or any people prior to the Inca empire, travelled that far by sea. But, on the other hand, there could be a slight possibility that some Viking explorers got as far as South America (perhaps by cutting through the Northern Sea, and going South), but that was totally unreported and is really not likely, given the distance they had to go.

There should be some problems with these findings. A peer review of the bones study could say something different.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:31 AM
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Originally posted by Sakif
Archaeologists have found the remains of a skeleton supposedly from 1000 AD in “Sarpsborg”, Norway. The skeleton has the same genetic marks as the Inca people of Latin America.


No problem with either your English or your history, Sakif. The two initial approaches to this scenario are:
1) Proof of the date when these remains were deposited in the context in which they were found.
2) One also needs to question if the genetic marker that connects them to the Incas still exists in a living population, or when it may have died out.

There are easier answers than ETs, but first we need to nail down the facts. This is a good posting and I'd be interested in any more detail that turns up.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:33 AM
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this is a really interesting story, who knows maybe we're not giving the incas the credit they deserve, thats usually a common occurrence in science. and thanks sakif for some insight to norway's history, i would love to see all of scandanavia one day



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:41 AM
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I don't share your confidence
they are talking about a skull with an interparietal bone, this is not common to just Incas
it has also been found in africans, asians and caucasians in who its presence is regarded as a deformity and it is not common (less than 3%)
in Incas it is universal as they all had it
this of course means that it does not have to be an Inca and in fact the odds are that it isn't
it is much more likely that its a normal everyday norwegian and the press is just sensationalising it
as is the OP with his talk of Extra terrestrial and EVD

this find was unusual
www.aftenposten.no...
the one being discussed is laughable
extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence
and in this case
there isn't any



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:45 AM
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Actually... The Vikings actually discovered the American Continent long before Columbus did. This has been proven a fact. They did it by Accident though. And they called the land "Wine Land". Norwegians have allways been explorers and men of the sea. Here's a link to the finding of America (lousy page though.. it's probably something to find on wikipedia.. but for some reason my explorer would not open wiki
) www.daria.no... there are allways small differences in how the story goes in it's whole. btw (Iceland was so to say a part of norway in those days)

Anyhow, Greenland and Latin America is faaaaar from eachother. Seriously. And the currents of the occean and the forming of waves are extremely different in the North Sea and in the atlantic. Not few times did the Vikingships break when going farther West\South and East in the World. The shape of these ships were formed to cut through waves of reletively "shallow" waters and not the Occean weather of the many seas in the world. And the possibility of the white man settling down across America, (going further and further south) in 1000 AD and as far as Latin America would have given more tracks. And I still can not see why they went to America if they wanted slaves (or "Trell" as they called it in norway). They did allready have lots of lots of them. This is just soooo weird. Hope they find out more soon



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 11:51 AM
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Originally posted by Sakif
Actually... The Vikings actually discovered the American Continent long before Columbus did. This has been proven a fact.

well the indians discovered it about 12,000 years earlier than the Vikings
this is also a fact
so its not too hard to accept what youre saying



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 12:00 PM
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hmm. Many good points here. Been a busy day, so havent had the time to evaluate the many possibillities (easily distracted
). But came to think about something. The Norwegian people of this time was (by claims) larger and higher than the everyday population of other races.. And usually it has been easy (unknown to me why though) to state that remains was Norwegian\scandinavic. The Article does not say anything about height neither does it go in the depth of the physics to these remains so only time will show. But abnormal markings in the bone structure of 2 men and a kid.. Thats pretty many abnormalities.. 3 out of 3.. hmmm.. I ought to find out more about the spesific location where the findings took place. See if it has some connections with earlier Viking findings of some sort. Closeness to "local civilisation" etc.. But.. Alien or not.. this could turn out to be a major event, that could very much change earlier stated facts about history.. (and that itself is exciting enough), as well as just be coincidence and nothing more than that. But I seriously doubt that "VG" choose to push further on in this case.. Most people in Norway don't care for these things.. They only care for frozen pizza... Going to write an e-mail to "VG" if nothing happens.. Ohh.. seriously.. My posts are waaaay to long.. Takin a break. Dinner..



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 12:56 PM
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Originally posted by Sakif
. But abnormal markings in the bone structure of 2 men and a kid.. Thats pretty many abnormalities.. 3 out of 3.. hmmm..

its a relatively normal bone in one individual found buried with another totally normal individual and a normal child
thats what
less than 1 out of 3


Originally posted by Sakif
But.. Alien or not.. this could turn out to be a major event, that could very much change earlier stated facts about history

this story will dissappear when they do a proper analysis

[edit on 26-6-2007 by Marduk]



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 01:48 PM
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Originally posted by Marduk
I don't share your confidence
they are talking about a skull with an interparietal bone, this is not common to just Incas
it has also been found in africans, asians and caucasians in who its presence is regarded as a deformity and it is not common (less than 3%)
in Incas it is universal as they all had it
this of course means that it does not have to be an Inca and in fact the odds are that it isn't


I was going to suggest something much the same as this. The evidence from the bones is thus insufficient to support such a claim. However, I do think that the find is interesting enough to justify dna testing if suitable material can be recovered, that would certainly settle the matter. The only plausible circumstance in which they could possibly be related to Incas is if they were met with somehow by the Viking explorers who travelled to North America, the dating places the finds vaguely in the right timeframe, but it really seems most unlikely.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 01:56 PM
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I would like to see the results of DNA testing on the bones. The comment that it was "impossible: to travel those distances by boat 1000 years ago are a bit much. I don't think it was "impossible" to do such a task if warranted, but its improbable that they did so.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by Marduk

Originally posted by Sakif
Actually... The Vikings actually discovered the American Continent long before Columbus did. This has been proven a fact.

well the indians discovered it about 12,000 years earlier than the Vikings
this is also a fact
so its not too hard to accept what youre saying


Where did the Indians (red) came from?
Don't tell me it is from India!


So, ok, you are trying to change the history, the American Indian was a visitor some 12,000 years ago.
Are you trying to say the real owner of America is British?
When did you ancestor first time came to England? They were not the real British, were they? They were just visitors.

Who were these VISITORS ACTUALLY ARE? Aliens?







posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 03:57 PM
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Well incans in scandinavia is more plausible than vikings in latin america. The gulfsteam would be a significant help to anyone travelling from the americas to europe.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 04:29 PM
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Originally posted by tomcat ha
Well incans in scandinavia is more plausible than vikings in latin america. The gulfsteam would be a significant help to anyone travelling from the americas to europe.

Uhm... no.

Gulf stream is only in the northern hemisphere. So niether option is terribly likely.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by CinLung-Part-3
[Where did the Indians (red) came from?
Don't tell me it is from India!



Asia
NOT MOSLEM COUNTRY



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 04:48 PM
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Seems to me that the depth of the burial is a little unusual, too. Only under a few inches of topsoil, enough for a rose bush to grow? That seems a little shallow to have lasted 1000 years. But, hey, I'm no expert, just curious.



posted on Jun, 26 2007 @ 05:00 PM
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First, thanks for the entertaining article, Sakif!

I did some research (brief) and found other references to it that clear up the matter somewhat -- apparently the scientists were misquoted:
aviana.com...


“There is a bone in the neck [of the man] that has not healed,” Norwegian archaeologist Mona Beate Buckholm says, “and this is an inherited trait that is only found among Inca Indians in Peru.”


Poor scientist! She was very badly misquoted!

Here's a BETTER article on it, that gets the matter straight. Apparently these three individuals were found with rosebushes planted on top of them in a medieval graveyard... and not in standard graves. What was found are bone fragments and not a complete and intact skeleton. They may have been "unbaptized" people... it was common then to bury unbaptized in non-consecrated ground rather than in consecrated ground:
www.bitsofnews.com...

So... having a look at the fragments:
www.bitsofnews.com...
...it's an older man (we'll assume that yes it's a man from other things in the grave), who has lost his teeth and suffered from gum disease and was about age 45-50 at death. I'll guess that these bone fragments are from the same skeleton... though they may not be. That jaw makes him look much older, but the fusing on the skull is that of a younger man.

Look at the flat skull piece -- there's a "crack" on the skull that's really a very wavy and almost loopy line. This is where the skull bones grew together. Everyone's got them and the crack fills in over time. By age 70, it's hard to see and by age 90, it's almost completely filled in. The cracks are called sutures.

Where the sutures from the parietal (top side of the skull) meet the occipital (rear lower bone), an extra bone sometimes forms. It's not shown in the photographs at the article. This is called the "inca bone" -- but it's not always found in Incans.


Additional stuff:
Here's a paper on an Indian skull that shows the way the suture forms (this appears to be a saggital coronal suture):
www.neuroanatomy.org...

On this page, skull #769 shows similar features of the suture:
www.boneroom.com...

Shown here on page 64 (slideshow presentation):
anthropology.uvic.ca...

I found a senior level anthropology thesis that says (after studying one skull collection) that the "inca bone" is found more often in males than in females. It doesn't say where the skulls came from, but this may represent a Native American population. If so, it's not unlikely that one or more Native Americans (particularly Aleut or Inuit) or a halfbreed ended up back in Norway:
www.soa.ilstu.edu...

Anyway... what an interesting article! Thanks for bringing it to us!

[edit on 26-6-2007 by Byrd]



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