Serpent mythology

The Serpent in the ancient world.

There seem to be so many tales, legends and myths in ancient cultures involving snakes. Why is this. It's not as if the snake was a bountiful source of food unlike bison, cattle or other major food sources. Nor is it a particularly attractive or proud animal like the eagle, lion or wolf. It is an animal that is generally feared or loathed by some, but to many cultures it is revered. It is not always associated with evil or bad things, there are many cultures that hold the snake in high regard. What is it about the Serpent that sets it apart and generates so many differing opinions throughout history.

Here are some links to a few varying views on snakes from different cultures.

Serpent mound



Hopefully Byrd may be able to add to the Native American beliefs regarding snakes.

The Rainbow Serpent



Aboriginal beliefs regarding the Rainbow Serpent suggest that it is a creator totem.

Quetzalcoatl - the Feathered Serpent



And in Indian folklore,

Naga's



The cobra in Egyptian mythology



And in Greek mythology we get the medical symbol of 2 snakes wrapped around a staff. Asclepius, saw one snake bring another snake back to life with the use of certain herbs and so discovered medicine.

And in some African cultures it was considered a crime to kill rock pythons



Whereas in Western christian beliefs the snake is reviled as something evil, why is the snake not held in the same regard as other cultures. These other cultures that hold the Serpent in some esteem are mostly areas that contain a large diversity and population of snakes, did they understand the snakes place in nature's heirarchy better than judeo/christian's who may have had a more limited contact with snakes and consequently a fear attached to these relatively unknown to them creatures.

As a lover of snakes and other reptiles it has always fascinated me that these animals can be seen from such diverse perspectives, particularly from a mythological viewpoint. Can any ATS members from different country's relate any other myth's, either good or bad relating to snakes, and what are your thoughts on why they are reviled by western culture's and not by so many other cultures. Many of the links i was able to find on snakes in ancient mythology associated them with life, power and rebirth, all good things, particularly to ancient cultures.

Hoping this is in the right forum, thanks mojo.

I love snakes. I hold a great interest for them.

Nice post, i respect very much that old Serpent. I think Chinese dragon is also serpent worship, but they do it as a national holiday.

Christianity, Judaism and Islam usually see Serpent as Satan or Lucifer. Maybe because they envy dragons from others.

Oh, you want a bad serpent? Look up the World Serpent of Norse mythology. He's the child of Loki and badass enemy extraordinarie to Thor and he will essentially destroy the world at Ragnarok.

Let's not over look the phallic apperance of snakes. It put's the fertility beliefs into perspective as well as the christian beliefs...

It's not accurate to suggest that Western Christians consider serpents evil. In fact, the bronze serpent erected by Moses in the Old Testement is used as a metaphor by Jesus to foreshadow his crucifixion in the New!

en.wikipedia.org...

you mean Jörmungandr (I have trouble with the spelling too)
en.wikipedia.org...


I think you are making the mistake of mixing up snakes and serpents
generally speaking serpents are huge ancient sea monsters associated with water and heaven and representations of evil who a great God has to defeat to gain kingship
and snakes are those animals that go "hiss"

So what is the rock python that some african tribes worship Marduk. A snake that goes hiss or a serpent.

I'll see if i can find some more examples of snakes used in ancient myth as well as seeing if i cant find a better definition of the snake vs serpent.

cheers mojo.

Its a rock python (a snake that goes hiss)


serpents :-
Jörmungandr - Norse
en.wikipedia.org...
Tiamat - Babylonian
en.wikipedia.org...
Kur - Sumerian
en.wikipedia.org...
Apep/Apophis - Egyptian
en.wikipedia.org...
Lernaean Hydra/Ketos - Greek
en.wikipedia.org...
www.theoi.com...
Cipactli - Mesoamerica
en.wikipedia.org...
Vritra/Makara - India
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...(Hindu_mythology)
Kurrichalpongo - Australia
en.wikipedia.org...
all these creatures (plus a few others I can't remember) are described as Huge, Big teeth, Malignant, associated with the primevil ocean and heaven, and are basically obstacles to be overcome by Gods or in some cases Heros.

these are all primevil serpents
the mistake of calling snakes by the term serpents comes from the ancient belief that a snake would eventually one day become a monstrous serpent if it was allowed to live long enough,
(yeah they knew loads about zoology didn't they)
this is reflected in the Mesopotamian cultures cuneiform spelling of the monstrous mušgal [SERPENT]
psd.museum.upenn.edu...
muš [SNAKE]
psd.museum.upenn.edu...
gal [BIG]
psd.museum.upenn.edu...






[edit on 21-6-2007 by Marduk]

[edit on 21-6-2007 by Marduk]

Hey you must own shares in Wikipedia Marduk.

Your wiki link for Kurrichalpongo is a bit of a waste of time, firstly they state that the Rainbow serpent is the underlying mythology for the Bunyip which doesnt fit in with what i know of the dreamtime, Bunyips were mostly living in the eastern states of australia around waterholes whereas the Rainbow serpent, though part of the folklore in other parts of australia, is best known in northern australian dreamtime story's.

The Rainbow serpent is known by many names depending on which group you speak too. I was taught that it was a giant snake, i think the name serpent was probably given to it by anglo saxons as aborigines do not have a seperate name for serpent and snake in arhnem land from what i can recall, it is the same animal.

As for your other links i'll have a look but i'm not a big fan of wikipedia anymore, there are too many inconsistencies.

And if i'm mixing them up Marduk then so are all the dictionary's ive checked. So has Bradley T. Lepper, curator of archaeology at the Ohio Historical Society and George Chaloupka, the foremost expert on the rock art of Arnhem Land, from the first 2 links i posted they both refer to serpent and snake.

I've always considered serpents to be snakes or snakelike in appearance, as do all of the dictionary sources i can find, they all also put a distinctly malevolent spin on the meanings. But in many ancient cultures both the snake and the serpent of folklore are seen in a more generous light, which is the point of my OP.

Maybe i didnt explain myself well enough, or maybe you just like to nit pick and show off your vast intellect. :p:

dictionary.com





I'm interested in the different perspectives differing cultures have for both serpents and snakes in their mythology, not necessarily the semantics. I'll refer to both from now on as seperate entities if that will make you happy.

cheers










[edit on 21/6/07 by mojo4sale]

well thats the whole point of language
meanings change depending on the context
before greek and latin all these creatures were known by their own names
then went through a revival as serpents and then in the common era they became dragons. That says more about our culture than it does the ones that originated these myths
before the word serpent existed there were no serpents
before the word snake existed there were no snakes

a lot of the meanings attached to serpent are fairly modern
the twisting and meandering meaning of serpentine didn't exist before the 17th century
the adjective meaning of serpentine as "evil qualities of a serpent" didn't exist before the 14th century
likewise the original meaning of the word that became serpent (sanskrit "sarpati") was "to creep"

so depends which way you want to interpret them really
which is why I said snakes are easy to identify as they are the creatures that go "hiss"



one mans nit picking is another mans education

Don't forget the Taniwha (pron: Tany-far) of New Zealand's Maoris.

These are broadly sea serpents. One is credited for having created wellington harbour, whilst another is said to have carved the magnificient fiords at Milford Sound.

Interestingly NZ has no snakes or even sea snakes, so where is the belief from ?

thanks Sy
hadn't heard of that one
wiki has a page (you don't have to read it Mojo)
en.wikipedia.org...
this bit made me laugh hysterically

aaaaaaaaaagggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh run its a disconcerting log
superstitious lot these Maori

like all ancient sea serpents current orthodox thought is that they are the product of an over fertile imagination combined with a fear of the unknown ocean
but in this case





[edit on 21-6-2007 by Marduk]

[edit on 21-6-2007 by Marduk]

[edit on 22-6-2007 by sanctum]

[edit on 22-6-2007 by asala]

I hate to mention this but your shark needs a dentist. I saw some terrible decay there.

why don't you stick your head in and take a closer look

** MARDUK ** can you please resize that image so I dont have to scroll my screen over to read every sentance? Please?!

If I wasnt about to read a book and catch some zzzz's I would stay and post some serpent stuff.. well, stay tuned! Nice thread by the way, I'm sure it will get alot of good replies.

sorry
my time on being able to edit that post has passed

Ahh sorry if i was a bit narky Marduk, bad day at the office.

Thanks for that info sy, i have some Maori friends that i'll catch up with over the weekend i'll see what they know of that myth.

I will have some more info to post on the Rainbow serpent as well.

Whether serpent or snake Marduk the similarity's of shape/form cant be discounted as having some basis for the mythology of both intertwining imo. As i said earlier though it is called the rainbow serpent the aborigines of arhnem land refer to it as a large snake, even though it's body is made up of the parts of many animals, it is the shape and its attributes that suggest its name as snake/serpent.
Many of the snake and serpent mythology's seem to attach creator/life/rebirth attributes, the rebirth part is particularly interesting as it could relate to the snake shedding its skin. Rebirth?

Given a bit more time i'll try and get through all the links everyones posted, even the Wiki ones.

Thanks for the reply's so far.

looks like someone over at Wiki has already answered this question
en.wikipedia.org...

MYTHOLOGY?! whom cares about mythology. How about the DIRT Pharoahs...
They were "worshippers" of serpeants, but serpeants kingdom in mysterious ways. Two triangles battling eachother for the CHESS PIECE of the Greek God Zeus. The history on snakes is they are beguilers in secret(while honest looking) but there is a warning to call the serpeants beguilers harm shall come to those who does. Snakes are lovely creatures that are PURE FEAR of the Greek God Zeus from instant death feeling sorry for him and his people in the world and their lack of bread / breadings. There... that is all you need .. if you need more information give me a hollar at creepydns@gmail.com

Denise Marie King
vgl on EFNET
members.fortunecity.com... At my web site