One-fifth of world's surveillance focused on Brits!

i think this thread is hilarious....the uk vs us bickering..

anyway, i think greatlakes is bringing it to you stu and the the other dude...
you keep saying stuff like your argument holds more water cause you live there but there are others that live there that have posted and are not to happy about this.

maybe you guys are just in denial or something....thats funny that lakes posted about the camreas....there are all kinds of ways with google to gain access to these cameras...you can work them and such...
i have been on building cams zoomed in so tight that i could see people and plates....may be private owned but that info is going somewhere....it's on the friggin net.

i live in the states so go ahead and discount this...i was cought here on a traffic cam doing 13 over..they mailed me pics of a couple angles of my car, a tight shot of my plate, and me in the car...also a link to view on the net....
i have the paper with the small pics hanging on my wall. the big pics are on the net, somewhere.



also, no offense but i am personally amused by stu trying to defend everything lakes posts..."would you rather do the test fast right there or at the station?"

bwuahahahhaah

no, just give it to me right here on the road

Originally posted by stumason
Look, Greatlakes, if all your going to do is post without replying to any of my many counter arguments against your paranoia, what is the point?

This isn't a debate or even a discussion, your treating this thread as your own private showcase, whilst ignoring us who have real life experience of what your banging on about.

Maybe we should create our own "Anti" thread? Hmm or will that be removed?
Would be fun for us to have a thread full of facts to use against them.

Originally posted by Boondock78
i think this thread is hilarious....the uk vs us bickering..

anyway, i think greatlakes is bringing it to you stu and the the other dude...

Oh really? His debating style is to completely ignore what is being said and carry on as if it's his own personal showcase. If he actually addressed a single point I have raised, you might be right, but he doesn't.

Originally posted by Boondock78
you keep saying stuff like your argument holds more water cause you live there but there are others that live there that have posted and are not to happy about this.

One person has posted from the UK against CCTV. Several have posted countering all this Police State nonsense.

Originally posted by Boondock78
maybe you guys are just in denial or something....thats funny that lakes posted about the camreas....there are all kinds of ways with google to gain access to these cameras...you can work them and such...
i have been on building cams zoomed in so tight that i could see people and plates....may be private owned but that info is going somewhere....it's on the friggin net.

Er, they're webcams, not CCTV. By definition, they're not CCTV. Jeebus....

Originally posted by Boondock78
i live in the states so go ahead and discount this...i was cought here on a traffic cam doing 13 over..they mailed me pics of a couple angles of my car, a tight shot of my plate, and me in the car...also a link to view on the net....
i have the paper with the small pics hanging on my wall. the big pics are on the net, somewhere.

I don't disbelieve it. In fact, my opening posts actually said I would be surprised if you didn't have these systems in the US.

Originally posted by Boondock78
also, no offense but i am personally amused by stu trying to defend everything lakes posts..."would you rather do the test fast right there or at the station?"

bwuahahahhaah

no, just give it to me right here on the road

Yeah... that was my point, duh....

Sometimes I wonder if we in the UK speak a different language....

If a policeman suspected I was involved in a burglary and he had finger print evidence from the crime scene, I would rather be eliminated there and then, than have to be arrested and printed down the station and wait several hours to be told I didn't do something I know I didn't do.

I understand as im sure ALL us other Brits do, where GL is coming from but , all were saying is that we're not a police state, we are in control of our own lives.

It would be easy to say these cameras do not bother me , they do! i wonder when im walking in and out of shops , are they watching? most of the time i know they are not cos i have operated the things myself for days on end,

You scan an area and look for things that are out of the ordinary , suspicious , if GL were walking down the high street in my home town , YES i would see him but if he were minding his own business i would not bother with him, but if he were to be acting in a suspicious way i would hit the record button and follow him.

I have also seen abuses of the system first hand and in my capacity as engineer at the time i have reported and seen operators fired for abusing the system , so , in a nutshell YES we have cameras but there are laws that govern there use and any that flout those laws will be dealt with..

NO POLICE STATE !!

It has taken a decade or two to get the infrastructure for the cameras here in Blighty but im sorry to say that America already has the infrastructure to fit these in half the time , ie , cable tv networks.
If not already..

just chill guys were ok as im sure u will all be too !!

git.

Just check this website I found on a quick search. On here there are dozens of US camera's you can peruse at your leisure too..

The Shock...

The Horror....

How will you cope.....

Originally posted by stumason
Just check this website I found on a quick search. On here there are dozens of US camera's you can peruse at your leisure too..

Nobody said that this is NOT occurring in the USA. It IS NOT A GOOD THING anywhere that its happening, but to REALIZE this important fact is an important step to understanding the concern that it creates.

We do have big brother here in the US, it is increasing, and it will continue to increase, encroaching from different angles, from any weak areas that the people allow. The UK is a testbed for these tactics, and the majority there are accepting of these tactics, it therefore makes it extremely difficult for OTHER countries to counter when this is happening.

OK ,

What do u suggest ??

git

Originally posted by completenuttergit
OK ,

What do u suggest ??

git

Difficult question and no EASY answer I'm afraid. But I do know this, it STARTS with AWARENESS. You have to realize that the government & military, is WAY AHEAD OF US in terms of knowing how AND having the MEANS to manipulate the masses, ie: the people, its citizens. Just query a google search for FOIA documents either US based or UK/MoD based manipulation, control, experiments, directives and the like.

So the 1st step is being aware of the tactics, then realizing what/how/where the tactics are, then dealing with WHAT to do about it.

Originally posted by stumason


Sometimes I wonder if we in the UK speak a different language....

If a policeman suspected I was involved in a burglary and he had finger print evidence from the crime scene, I would rather be eliminated there and then, than have to be arrested and printed down the station and wait several hours to be told I didn't do something I know I didn't do.

maybe we do cause i was being sarcastic and laughing at you for wanting it done right there.
if it involves anything more than asking me a few standard questions or having me maybe walk a line for something, take me down the the station jack.

i was laughing cause you would rather just 'get it out of the way' right there.
see me, i would rather go to the station and see whats what...
i don't know how it workd man...i don't know if that cop is on his first day and takes crappy finger prints and it might take up more time..either way, thats not something i do on the side of the road.

edit* you're talking dna samples too??
oh big hahahah

i think i would rather go down to the station, maybe have someone from the lab or something take my sample, not some friggin beat cop that picked me up.
negative on that.

you go ahead though. if you feel it makes your life easier, cool

[edit on 7-6-2007 by Boondock78]

Sarcasm is very difficult to convey via text. My apologies

DNA samples can be taken by a swab and in the UK it is always done by a Police officer. At least, when i was nicked it was....

EDIT: Given the choice, the side of the road is my preferred choice. get it out the way in 5 mins rather than wait for 8 hours down the station...

Your choice though. I'm sure they could serve you up some tasty Rugby player to see you through the night....

[edit on 7/6/07 by stumason]

Originally posted by stumason
Sarcasm is very difficult to convey via text. My apologies

DNA samples can be taken by a swab and in the UK it is always done by a Police officer. At least, when i was nicked it was....

well, not here.
i couldn't imagine having my dna ran right there and then...the cop swabbing me.
how can you possible think this is a good thing?
like with the prints??
say he prints you, then says you're good. you go on your way...so he is just rolling around in his car with a set of your prints.
i know the risk is still there at the station that they could be taken from there but somthing about the cop doing it right there don't sit right with me.

what about when they want you to get chipped so you can be 'scanned' and either detained or let go in 2 seconds?
would make your life much easier.....gonna take it...

you know, they are looking for john smith and you look like him so instead of asking your ID and you not having it and then having to go to the station, you could just get your chip scanned and then be on your way.

super duper man
edit* you're right...it's my 'choice' and i would like to keep on having a choice in things that concern me
here or the station? i take station

[edit on 7-6-2007 by Boondock78]

I made my position on chipping clear earlier.

As for "running the DNA" there and then. It doesn't work like that. Still needs to go the lab. You just provide a swab and say who you are, they then check your not the rapist they're looking for later.

It's been done for years. Often a whole area will be asked to provide DNA samples to be checked against the evidence they have retrieved from a sperm sample or whatever.

If anyone refuses, they're highlighted as a suspect. Why would you refuse?

Originally posted by stumason
I made my position on chipping clear earlier.




If anyone refuses, they're highlighted as a suspect. Why would you refuse?

not too into giving swabs dude..they do need a warrant to do that. least here they do..
they get a warrant and they can swab me and the results will tell them iam not the guy. i am not just giving it up though...screw that

What about the pesky think called "reasonable cause"? Do you not have that right there as a Brit? Who are they SPECIFICALLY looking for doing roadside fingerprint checks? If they're looking for 6'1" male, blonde hair 190lbs, and you are a 5'8" male, black hair, 160lbs, where is the reasonable cause to take your fingerprints or *gasp* your DNA?

But don't worry, maybe it's only a TRIAL program...


[edit on 7-6-2007 by greatlakes]

Originally posted by Boondock78
not too into giving swabs dude..they do need a warrant to do that. least here they do..

they get a warrant and they can swab me and the results will tell them iam not the guy. i am not just giving it up though...screw that

Then if you fit the description (if they have one) then you'll be arrested and they'll take it anyway, question you for a day or two, then let you go. Shooting yourself in the foot really...

But, if you prefer to have your life interrupted and the stigma of being arrested for a rape charge, then by all means, crack on.

Greatlakes, they obviously do need reasonable cause. They won't go up to white guy if they're looking for a black guy.

Use some common sense.

Originally posted by greatlakes
What about the pesky think called "reasonable cause"? Do you not have that right there as a Brit? Who are they SPECIFICALLY looking for doing roadside fingerprint checks? If they're looking for 6'1" male, blonde hair 190lbs, and you are a 5'8" male, black hair, 160lbs, where is the reasonable cause to take your fingerprints or *gasp* your DNA?

But don't worry, maybe it's only a TRIAL program...


[edit on 7-6-2007 by greatlakes]

kinda boggles my mind too. just letting people swab you as part of a crowd of people...there needs to be a warrant for them to swab me. it is kinda surreal that people are totally cool with it.

they are looking for a 6 foot 3 inch dude, fully sleeved with tats and they see me so i am supposed to let them swab me cause of that??
bwuahahahhahaha

it absolutely does not work that way.
for one reason, say my dna was not on file...personally, i kinda like that. now though, after getting swabbed it is.
see, maybe they try to swab you there cause they know they don't have enough on you to get a warrant and you're just tossing your dna(not you, whoever)
i guess. not this guy

Originally posted by stumason
[
Then if you fit the description (if they have one) then you'll be arrested and they'll take it anyway, question you for a day or two, then let you go. Shooting yourself in the foot really...

But, if you prefer to have your life interrupted and the stigma of being arrested for a rape charge, then by all means, crack on.

no, i will be brought in for questioning(not arrested)....then i will answer their crap(if i want to, if not, i'll get a lwayer and then maybe he will anser for me...i just don't knoe) and if they don't think it ads up they will want a swab and they can get a warrant for that.
i don't look at it as shooting myself in the foot. i look at it as not letting them stomp all over me just to make it go faster...not when it comes to stuff like that.

Its boggles my mind too the attitude and perception of the potential and existing police state by the Brits. But you know what, its coming to America too, soon.

I see it everywhere, just look at the proposed senate bill regards to immigration in the US, it mentions issuing electronic tags for all of the illegal immigrants that get processed and are granted legal stay in America. This is just one step in making it seem that the RFID tags are mainstream and should be acceptaed here in USA. They will try to get the proverbial "foot in the door" in whatever ways possible. It all starts with a toe

Here's an amazing CAM in the US that monitors traffic. Its simply amazing, we can access this and check out the SMART tech that goes on with these types of cams, just imagine what they have in the UK to help the law enforcement there with identifying criminals...

trafficcams.cet.unomaha.edu...
This cam monitors the signal changes, the speed I believe and detects cars that enter into the field of view!

ps, its much better in the daytime, when I first spotted it, there are many like this, some in the UK, some in Germany, some in the US. I think Ill post a new thread on this cam




[edit on 7-6-2007 by greatlakes]

[edit on 7-6-2007 by greatlakes]

i know it is happening here too. but this thread is about the uk and i like seeing them get all bunged up trying to defend their country in a message board thread...it's pretty cool

Im just wondering, how do you know that these "private companys" that are monitoring the UK are really private???

Do you work for the Government?? Do you work for one of these companies???

Most of the "Private" companies that are being used in Iraq are DIRECTLY funded by the Government. Also, in the US just recently ALL ISP's are required to ALLOW the FBI to tap into our converstations, emails, web sites visited, ect.