From Anonymous Posts: But you still need a

Original Anonymous Post By: anon_87197

Requesting a permit to carry your weapon concededs your right to carry one. If you have the right to carry a weapon, why ask your government (State or local) for their approval? As a legal gun owner, you shouuld not have to ask for their permision to carry a gun that you legally own.

But as a legal owner of a registered car, I still need a license to drive it legally. And a car can kill someone if used wrongly just as much as a gun can.

True True....But when someone takes there car out, usually their only intentions are to drive from point A to point B. When someone takes their gun out their intentions are to kill or seriously injure someone or something. Even though the fatality rate is very high in car accidents a gun is still more dangerous because of the intention someone has when using it.

Just think about this other than military, government, and police forces; most guns are sold to dangerous people. If you take out the hunters, I'm sure the small percent of people who purchase guns for protection is way out weighted by people who are dangerous. I believe people should have permits and license to own and carry a gun concealed or not. I think they should crack down a little more.

[edit on 5-6-2007 by Tetraspace]

Originally posted by Tetraspace

most guns are sold to dangerous people.

What is this sites motto ? Say it with me..."Deny Ignorance".

Where oh where did you get this....WAIT !

You're anti-gun. Gotcha. Just promoting the usual propoganda.

Carry on, nothing to see here.

Baffled,
Lex

PS : Exactly where DID you get that info ?

I'm a tad confused on the point of this post.

You're anti-gun

Thats something to admire not look down upon.

For people to WANT to carry guns implies a certain amount of collective paranoia.....

...A paranoia instilled by the fact that other, less "desirable" characters ALSO carry these guns.

If EVERYONE was anti gun, then this cycle would be at an end and YOU along with everyone else might not feel so paranoid, enough to WANT to carry/own a gun.

Don't try to insult someones views if those views are sited on the GREATER side of good

Peace
AoN

EDIT TO ADD: And i think CONCEALED guns (those small enough to be concealed) should be illegal... PERIOD!!

Why on earth, or for what reason would a CIVILIAN HAVE for concealing a weapon if they weren't intending it for some sinister use??!!
[edit on 5-6-2007 by Anomic of Nihilism]

[edit on 5-6-2007 by Anomic of Nihilism]

Uhhh. Wait.

People in general are the most dangerous species on Earth. Every person on Earth has the ability to make a gun work. Every person on Earth is dangerous in some form or another. Therefore, by your saying "most guns are sold to dangerous people." should be amended to "Every person who owns or carries a gun, with or without permits and permission, is the most dangerous person on Earth."
I don't like guns. I'm a sword man myself. But, guns exist. In the wrong hands, they are VERY dangerous. I'd own a gun, but, it would have to be the most hated gun in America. I'd own an assault rifle. I don't think I'd register it or buy it legally because I really don't want anything in record of me owning a gun. The opportunity to aquire one has not presented itself and I honestly haven't really looked for one.
Meh. Guns don't kill people. People kill people. It takes a person deciding to pull that trigger. If there isn't a gun, it would be another tool. Chances are the person decides to kill regardless of the impliment.

My $0.02
Cuhail

"The right of the people to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves and of the lawful authority of the state shall not be infringed, except that the manner of bearing arms may be regulated by law."

Concealing a gun is technically a manner of bearing an arm. And regulated by law it is.

Although I do not agree with any restriction on owning a gun (because it is unconstitutional), I do not have a problem with having to get a concealed weapons permit.

Requesting a permit to carry your weapon concededs your right to carry one. If you have the right to carry a weapon, why ask your government (State or local) for their approval? As a legal gun owner, you shouuld not have to ask for their permision to carry a gun that you legally own.

However, your anonymous friend does because of an error in his logic, and ignorance of the actual words of the constitution.

Originally posted by Anomic of Nihilism

Thats something to admire not look down upon.

In your opinion.

For people to WANT to carry guns implies a certain amount of collective paranoia.....

Again, you're opinion.

...A paranoia instilled by the fact that other, less "desirable" characters ALSO carry these guns.

Seems a great reason.

If EVERYONE was anti gun, then this cycle would be at an end

No, only the less "desirables" would have guns.

and YOU along with everyone else might not feel so paranoid, enough to WANT to carry/own a gun.

I don't own a firearm. Nor, do I wish to.

But, I did serve my country in order for those living in a free America,
so THEY could own a firearm, if they so desire.

Don't try to insult someones views if those views are sited on the GREATER side of good

Please, don't insult my intelligence. Thanks.

EDIT TO ADD: And i think CONCEALED guns (those small enough to be concealed) should be illegal... PERIOD!!

Knives, too ? ANYTHING concealable should be illegal ?
Wow, just...wow.

Why on earth, or for what reason would a CIVILIAN HAVE for concealing a weapon if they weren't intending it for some sinister use??!!

Personal protection comes to mind.

Regards,
Lex

Ya know, the subject came up a while ago (2 Halloweens ago) where it was questioned to a local police officer about my wearing one of my many, many swords in public and if it were illegal. He checked the local laws...then county laws...then state laws and alas, there was no law regarding the wearing of a sword in public, hence, it was legal. Until I brandished it or threatened to use it on somebody, I'm legit.
Now, as a legal swordbearer, I understand that the 3'4" to 4'2" blade that I'm carrying is a tool SPECIFICALLY made to kill a PERSON, but it's up to me to decide if it will be used or not. It's not the swords decision, right? I'm in control of the arm that wields it and I possess the mind that makes the arm move.

I don't PLAN on wearing my swords in public, but I can. Legally.
I feel better, you?
Tee hee!
Cuhail

Lex...

Ahem..OK... most of your post was made up of clever "quips" my good friend, without true direction NOR substance.

(anti gun) Thats something to admire not look down upon.

Lex:...In your opinion.

That doesn't sound healthy. My "opinion" is that of a PEACEFUL one.
do you not wish LESS gun crime?

A paranoia instilled by the fact that other, less "desirable" characters ALSO carry these guns.

LEX:...Seems a great reason.

A reason SPURED on by the WIDE AVAILABILTY of guns......
you CAN'T RUN FROM A BULLET,.....THAT is an EXTREMELY unearving idea.

If EVERYONE was anti gun, then this cycle would be at an end

Lex:..No, only the less "desirables" would have guns.

Thats not "seeing" very far If guns weren't FREELY available then the numbers of IDIOTS, for want of a better expletive, (and i mean the STREET RAT criminals, and such) wouldn't be able to get a gun as EASELY as they can. ANY decrease in guns on the street is a GOOD desrease.

Don't try to insult someones views if those views are sited on the GREATER side of good

Lex:..Please, don't insult my intelligence. Thanks.

Haha!! Indeed.... but i KNOW you know i didn't, just a quick "quip" in the wind ay?

EDIT TO ADD: And i think CONCEALED guns (those small enough to be concealed) should be illegal... PERIOD!!

Lex:..Knives, too ? ANYTHING concealable should be illegal ?
Wow, just...wow.

Ahem!! Eeerm, NO, i didn't say that, Just guns...can you GET a licence to carry a knife??
As i said before, CONCEALED guns should be ILLEGAL. No HEALTHY reason WHY you should be CONCEALING your gun...UNLESS you wish to LURE those in you immediate vicinity into a FALSE sence of security...
...Which comes under the heading of SINISTER,SLY,UNTRUSTING,MISLEADING....all NEGATIVE words.

Why on earth, or for what reason would a CIVILIAN HAVE for concealing a weapon if they weren't intending it for some sinister use??!!

Lex:..Personal protection comes to mind.

Personal protection come JUST as easely with a SHOTGUN on yer back, IF you feel you need a gun,..crappy nieghbourhoods n'all.

But to CONCEAL a gun, suggests that its not there to protect, rather it is to be used ONLY when the situation has been ALLOWED to reach a certain point, where the GUN then must be drawn, a situation which might never have happened had the GUN been on DISPLAY.....
.....which doesn't seem very "intelligent" to me...

Sorry if im "insulting" your intelligence. Tushae

But in all seriousness. Guns are not a good idea, ANY restrictions you can put on owning a gun is good as it lessens the number, in trigger happy hands.

Guns are unfair, you cant RUN from a bullet. To many people find them selves at the end of someone elses "bad day", and it just so happens; that person had bought a gun not so long ago when he wasn't so crazy...


That type of **** just aint fair man.

Peace dude
I always respect opinions, but yours just ain't mine.

AoN

[edit on 5-6-2007 by Anomic of Nihilism]

[edit on 5-6-2007 by Anomic of Nihilism]

Originally posted by Lexion
Originally posted by Tetraspace

most guns are sold to dangerous people.

What is this sites motto ? Say it with me..."Deny Ignorance".

Where oh where did you get this....WAIT !

You're anti-gun. Gotcha. Just promoting the usual propoganda.

Carry on, nothing to see here.

Baffled,
Lex

PS : Exactly where DID you get that info ?

Listen Lex it is called an opinion come on say it out loud with me....

O P I N I O N

1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty. (this one applies to my statement)
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
3. the formal expression of a professional judgment: to ask for a second medical opinion.
4. Law. the formal statement by a judge or court of the reasoning and the principles of law used in reaching a decision of a case.
5. a judgment or estimate of a person or thing with respect to character, merit, etc.: to forfeit someone's good opinion.
6. a favorable estimate; esteem: I haven't much of an opinion of him.

Hmmm telling me to deny ignorance....You can't even tell what an opinion is...And you have no idea why I have any opinion like this.

A. Where I live has a lot to do with this OPINION
B. You may not have seen and dealt with how easy it is to actually purchase a weapon without a background check, license, or permit with cash from a gun show.
C. It is ignorant to shut down someone's opinion without giving your reasoning or a statement to why you believe it is an "ignorant statement."

For your information I am not anti-gun. I come from a long line of hunters. I take pride in hunting humanely and safely and I do not waste one part of any animal nor does my family or friends. I grew with strict rules about guns and safety my father always had his guns/weapons locked up at all times, and we all had to learn about gun safety. One of my good friends is a game warden. Just about all my extended family is military. My immediate family is hunters. I know about guns. I know how dangerous they are and how easy it is for the wrong person to own a gun. Everyday in the city that is just across the lake from me someone is killed or injured by a gun.
The ignorance lays within people who sell these guns illegally and the dangerous people who carry them.

Something needs to crack down...




[edit on 6-6-2007 by Tetraspace]

Originally posted by Cuhail

Uhhh. Wait.

People in general are the most dangerous species on Earth. Every person on Earth has the ability to make a gun work. Every person on Earth is dangerous in some form or another. Therefore, by your saying "most guns are sold to dangerous people." should be amended to "Every person who owns or carries a gun, with or without permits and permission, is the most dangerous person on Earth."
I don't like guns. I'm a sword man myself. But, guns exist. In the wrong hands, they are VERY dangerous. I'd own a gun, but, it would have to be the most hated gun in America. I'd own an assault rifle. I don't think I'd register it or buy it legally because I really don't want anything in record of me owning a gun. The opportunity to aquire one has not presented itself and I honestly haven't really looked for one.
Meh. Guns don't kill people. People kill people. It takes a person deciding to pull that trigger. If there isn't a gun, it would be another tool. Chances are the person decides to kill regardless of the impliment.

My $0.02
Cuhail

"Every person who owns or carries a gun, with or without permits and permission, is the most dangerous person on Earth."

I agree with you %100 you just said it a lot better than I did. I just think that gun laws should be stricter. Everyone I know who owns a gun is either the PD, military, or a hunter.

I've seen the bad side though.....AND every time it was something to do with drugs, but you are right anyone who owns a gun is dangerous; for instance in a typical safe "crime free" family neighborhood not far from where I live a man loaded his rifle with buck shots and preceded to chase down and kill his wife and three small children all under the age of five. He shot down and killed his wife and three year old with a buck shot, the other two got away one ran to the neighbors in time and the other played dead. (Horrible but this is case where someone unexpectedly violently killed his family with a gun) So your point is a very good one and I agree with you.

But it is a difficult argument. My family and I own guns because we hunt, deciding whether or not whoever is behind the gun is mentally stable enough to handle it is difficult, and can raise an uproar. I would like to see stricter gun laws. I do not think it will solve our gun problems but I believe it can help.

And whoever was wondering about the point of this topic. I was trying to reply to an anonymous post and I accidentally started a new thread, but it turned out to be a good debate.


[edit on 6-6-2007 by Tetraspace]

Originally posted by Jvillezbank
"The right of the people to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves and of the lawful authority of the state shall not be infringed, except that the manner of bearing arms may be regulated by law."

Concealing a gun is technically a manner of bearing an arm. And regulated by law it is.

Although I do not agree with any restriction on owning a gun (because it is unconstitutional), I do not have a problem with having to get a concealed weapons permit.

Requesting a permit to carry your weapon concededs your right to carry one. If you have the right to carry a weapon, why ask your government (State or local) for their approval? As a legal gun owner, you shouuld not have to ask for their permision to carry a gun that you legally own.

However, your anonymous friend does because of an error in his logic, and ignorance of the actual words of the constitution.

Agreed, but It would not hurt to make the law a little more strict and actually enforce it. I do not think our right to own a gun should be taken away. I'm not wishing for an Australia here.

[edit on 6-6-2007 by Tetraspace]

Originally posted by Lexion
Originally posted by Anomic of Nihilism

Don't try to insult someones views if those views are sited on the GREATER side of good

Please, don't insult my intelligence. Thanks.

No one was insulting your intelligence, the fact that you have only stated you are intelligent and not proved it is ignorant though, and therefore you have put your foot in your mouth.

You do not have to be so offensive when trying to state your opinion or what you believe is bewildering (baffling) to you. It's ok for you to disagree; but state your reasoning’s why you believe our opinions are wrong, and if you can back up what you say with credible information. We are debating here, not just telling each other we are wrong and arguing like a bunch of children. Make this a learning experience not a fight. Don't just act like, "you’re wrong, I'm right because I'm smart."

You seem to be an intelligent person but you are selling yourself short with your immaturity.

Originally posted by Anomic of Nihilism
Lex...

But in all seriousness. Guns are not a good idea, ANY restrictions you can put on owning a gun is good as it lessens the number, in trigger happy hands.

Yes, I agree again.

Let me ask something...Do you think there are more restrictions on driving and owning a vehicle then owning a gun?

Originally posted by Tetraspace

Listen Lex it is called an opinion come on say it out loud with me....

O P I N I O N

I know the word well.

And you have no idea why I have any opinion like this.

A. Where I live has a lot to do with this OPINION

If you think I live in a townhouse whitebread area, you're quite mistaken.

B. You may not have seen and dealt with how easy it is to actually purchase a weapon without a background check, license, or permit with cash from a gun show.

Actually, living in Louisiana you don't even need to go to a gun show.
The best weapons aren't openly advertised.

C. It is ignorant to shut down someone's opinion without giving your reasoning or a statement to why you believe it is an "ignorant statement."

I'm sorry, my reply never "shut down your opinion".
You said

most guns are sold to dangerous people

.

Ok, without sarcasm, where did you get this info ? Have statistics, or
is it just your opinion ?

For your information I am not anti-gun. I come from a long line of hunters. I take pride in hunting humanely and safely and I do not waste one part of any animal nor does my family or friends.

I gather from this you yourself are a hunter. I admire this, and your
hunting ethics.

The ignorance lays within people who sell these guns illegally and the dangerous people who carry them.

I agree 100%.

a man loaded his rifle with buck shots and preceded to chase down and kill his wife and three small children all under the age of five. He shot down and killed his wife and three year old with a buck shot, the other two got away one ran to the neighbors in time and the other played dead.

What's the rest of the story ? Why did he do this ? Have a link to a local paper ?
And, would a Drowning have been any better ? Should we ban bath tubs, now ?

And I'd really like an explanation of this :

anyone who owns a gun is dangerous

Since you and your family own guns, are you saying you are dangerous ?

Broad statements are like spider webs.

Awaiting your rebuttal,
Lex

Edit to correct grammar.









.








[edit on 6-6-2007 by Lexion]

Not bad I'd have to say this was a much better reply from you.

Link

Here is the link and guns have killed more people than bathtubs...

I'm from Louisiana BTW. Katrina survivor. 6 in a half feet here and lived in Houston for about a month. I was a very lucky one actually, what I experienced was absolutely nothing compared to most. I live north of the lake. What the people experienced south of the lake was something out of your worst nightmare. Unless you saw it with your two eyes you would never know how bad it really was.

I said what I had to say. Gun violence is a major problem, I do not think our right to bear arms should be taken away; but I think that enforcing these gun laws and even making them stricter would not hurt but help.


[edit on 7-6-2007 by Tetraspace]

And I'd really like an explanation of this : Anyone who owns a gun is dangerous.

I think that was me. And honestly, it doesn't take a gun to be dangerous. The gun is a tool, as is a knife, sword, stick, rock,etc. The person is dangerous by having the mind and abilility to kill, hurt, etc. So I stand by my statement that every person who owns a gun IS dangerous. I have 20+ swords in my house and not one of them makes me dangerous. My ability to wield those swords and the decision-making skills to decide when and how to use them makes me dangerous. The fact that I am human makes me dangerous.
Take the guns out of the situation and Tetraspace's whole family is still very dangerous.
I believe they all have the mind to decide how and when to use them as well.
I hope they make the right decisions with their guns. Honestly, there's nothing I can do about their intent, but, the guns have little to do with it.

My $0.02
Cuhail

I agree all people are dangerous; stepping outside your house is dangerous.

That was a vague statement I made....There are people behind guns who are more of a threat than others kk...

To the passive souls:

Some there are who fear the gun
and rue it's use in every way.
But when the fit hits the shan
we'll change your name to prey.

Peace.

Originally posted by Tetraspace

I think that enforcing these gun laws and even making them stricter would not hurt but help.

Enforcing, I agree with.

Stricter, I do not.

We both have our opinions, and your is highly respected.

This has been a fun debate, and I thank you for the thread.

Respectfully,
Lex