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Originally posted by truthseeka
Guess what kind of skin tone he has? ... If it was REALLY about helping black kids, how come you can't apply to it?
What the show did was tell white America that, "hey, if Dr. Huggstable can do well in America, we shouldn't be concerned about any barriers the average black faces. It's their own fault they aren't successful
Originally posted by truthseeka
My professor brought it up yesterday in class.
Jack and Jill
but after we discussed it, I understood.... What the show did was tell white America
Originally posted by HarlemHottie
I'm saying, at that point, realize that there may be some undercurrents you're not fully aware of.
I would just like to help you weed out the bad science, or generally unaccepted theories, or whatever.
What more do you want from me?
When have I ever said that, BH? Now I'm insulted.
You thought up a whole scenario.
I think that all we're saying prejudice and racism against black people by white people does exist. Someone has to be perpetrating it. We don't know every single one of you, so we obviously can't be that precise.
Maybe someone should start a thread to find the best name for who you call the 'wealthy corrupt,' in this new classist-not-racist outlook.
I'm serious, you're right in saying that we call them the wrong thing, but 'wealthy corrupt' hasn't caught on yet.
When I say that I know 'what black people think', I mean it literally. I'm not projecting my own opinion out onto the black population. I'm basically sharing with you what other black people have told me, or what is the leading opinion. I guess I could say, I'm telling you what the black people I know have told me.
Originally posted by ceci2006
You know the funny thing, phoenixhasrisin, statistical measures determine a lot. How much people spend. How much people do a certain behavior opposed to another. Even, what shows people watch.
They also give a person a clue that the sample of "successful" Blacks is very wide and diverse, instead of the old "Bill Cosby/Shelby Steele/Alphonso Jackson" tripe that continues to be dripped from the lips of those who believe him. Statistics quickly get to the heart in the matter more than any sentiment could.
I don't expect you to agree. But, in the end, numbers always tell the story.
But I wonder sometimes if you truly understand what we're trying to say to you instead of trying to take sides.
Originally quoted by phoenixhasrisin
You do not expect me to agree because deep down you know that the statement was/is non-sense. Statistics can be a useful source of information yes, they will never be able to help you quantify subjective concepts such as success though, and the suggestion that they can is absurd.
I don't even understand what you are trying to say, and I'm black. Well, half black in all honesty, but growing up my Father stressed the 1/100 rule in our house.
Originally quoted by Benevolent Heretic
We don't need anything confirmed from you of all people.
We can read. We can see. We can hear.
Your confirmation means absolutely nothing to me.
Ammunition?
For one thing, “people” don’t need any more ammunition if that’s what they’re looking for.
There’s free ammunition everywhere. We don’t have to drag it out of you. Secondly, it says a lot about your own intentions that you assume “people” are scouting for ammunition to attack you.
That is what ammunition is for. Attacks.
Originally posted by ceci2006
It's not so much about being safe with an academic explaination, jsobecky. It is about trying to approach the subject with a framework that will help analyze what is being asked.
Originally posted by jsobecky
Well ceci, you finally acknowledge my existence.
Why do you need a framework?
Why not answer from your gut?
You are without a doubt the most proficient scholar of information that I have ever encountered on ATs. That's a compliment, btw.
But that tells me that you are more than capable to stand on your own two feet. And that is the person that I want to understand, not what someone else has to say.
When/if Ceci writes her doctorate's thesis, what will be her own thoughts and concerns? That is what I want to know.
Originally posted by ceci2006
And I thank you for clearly stating what I've been trying to say. No one can truly define who is "successful" and "intelligent". That's why the list presented in this thread was truly biased because it did not include a broader sample of Blacks. It stuck with those in the public eye. If only celebrities and dignitaries who are Black represent the only ones considered successful and intelligent, what about the rest of us?
Originally quoted by phoenixhasrisin
What about the rest of you? No one stated that those in the public eye are the only examples of successful black people, that is your inference.
Perhaps the reason that the original list was populated by those in the public eye is due to the fact that they are just that: public . Being public, they are figures, and issues that people are likely to be aware of. Besides, there is no need for a more representative list, after all, this is not a study, this is not statistics.
Ten pages later and you still have given no explanation for the phenomenon, hell unless I missed it somewhere, you haven't even admitted that the problem exists yet!
By all means though, continue chasing your tail.
Originally posted by ceci2006
Originally posted by jsobecky
Well ceci, you finally acknowledge my existence.
You addressed me politely. That compelled me to answer.
Why do you need a framework?
A framework helps me reflect about the topic. It provides me with a foundation in order to address the subject matter. As they say, you can't play a game without any ground rules.
Why not answer from your gut?
Knee-jerk answers never serve anyone well. They are almost never well received. In light of saying that, they work for some people. It pays to reflect sometimes on what you want to say instead of letting it fly out of your mouth.
You are without a doubt the most proficient scholar of information that I have ever encountered on ATs. That's a compliment, btw.
Thank you very much for saying that. That is very kind.
My concern has always been about people getting along. I want people to understand each other and work with one another to achieve a better society. I would certainly hope that there are others who have the same goals in mind. I have never deviated from this no matter how much I've been accused of "having an agenda".
I've always been interested in people. Society has always held a fascination for me.
That is why the issues asserted by the OP is important because there are perceptions at stake. The question in the OP most undoubtedly calls into question how one group of people sees another. So, I think in light of what has been said, it is important for one to note that simply answering a question doesn't really tell the story. Instead, like in Eugene Kane's column (that I posted on the HUD thread), it can only initiate these talks that people are afraid of having within the aspects of RL.
Hope that answers your questions.
[edit on 2-2-2007 by ceci2006]
Originally posted by soloperative
As a American man of mixed heritage I am sick of being called a sell out. I had a successful military career, academic career and soon a successful political career. I submit that all these so called Africans are misled. My wife(white) went on a missionary trip to Africa. There were blacks on the trip and they were told they were not African they are American. They were shocked to hear this. These people simply want to blame whitey for everything instead of working hard and achieving the dream. Wake up people of color you are Americans. Embrace all people and aspire to a goal. Keep your eye on the prize. God Bless
You have voted soloperative for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.
The Republican party must always be the party of inclusion. It is our diversity that has made this nation strong. Yet our diversity has sadly, throughout our history, been the source of discrimination. Discrimination that we must rip out branch and root. It is our party, the party of Lincoln, that must always stand for equal rights and fair opportunity for all. And where discrimination still exists or where the scars of past discrimination contaminate the present, we must not close our eyes to it, declare a level playing field, and hope it will go away by itself. It did not in the past. It will not in the future. Let the party of Lincoln be in the forefront, leading the crusade, not only to cut off and kill discrimination,-- but to open every avenue of educational and economic opportunity to those who are still denied access because of their race, ethnic background or gender.
Originally posted by soloperative
There were blacks on the trip and they were told they were not African they are American.
Wake up people of color you are Americans. Embrace all people and aspire to a goal.
I didn't know it was supposed to fall on me. However, you admitted it on your part. That should make you feel good.
Btw, the last time I looked this wasn't a confessional, either.
By all means though, continue chasing your tail.
Is that better than sticking one's tail between one's legs?