Possession? Or just blind obedience?

Take a look at this article about Hitler Possessed by the Devil?....

On the rare occasion I take note of any Pope (or Cardinal) making comments about the scripture and how it relates to current events...I am always torn between laughing and crying....the so-called religious authority over the majority of christianity does not even read the Bible! If so, comments like these would never be published:

“It’s both,” he said. “They have full responsibility for their actions, but they have followed the promptings of the devil — and they have done so willingly. Therefore they are guilty, completely responsible.”

When asked if there were any leaders today who could be similarly possessed, Father Amorth said there are “many who listen to the temptations of Satan and follow him.” Because of that, he said, “the world goes bad.” Instead of leading others “towards peace and well-being, the world moves towards war and unease,” he said.

Obviously they are not familiar with the story of Nebuchadnezzar....nor do they even understand 'satan.' It is those who care so much about doing what God convicts them that HE says is right, in their heart, that they have no regard for even their own name! Only God's name. Just like Joan of Arc....but of course they didn't like her at first, either. And she was driven by the 'good' side of God! The only one!

BTW - there sure is a lot of stuff about this man on the net these days...I saw some of the craziest stuff last evening; maybe because I had never googled Hitler before - but it was good for both of us!

His pre-reich artistic creations have been selling at auctions for phenomenal amounts! CBS Evening News

Now I am certainly no expert, I just like what I like...but truly there are some of the more colorful architectural scenes that I really like. And still there is so much put-down of it by the 'critics' as being uninspired and uninspiring.

Perhaps if the critics, who were critics because they themselves were mediocre, had said a more positive thing (ideally let him into the Academy! Trying out twice should be enough to show his earnestness...)

Envy is an UGLY thing...it causes hate beyond a person's capacity to master their environment...remember Cain and remember Abel...

Adolf was surely not Cain - his devotion to God went to far as to commit genocide of a degree so great that he poured out all that he was for and all he had been given (more than most us, talent - wise!) for the sake of the Master Plan.

There is NO 'devil' remember...the dragon is the mightiest of all the heavens...El Elyon is the dragon and if you have darkness in your heart (Hitler had light) then what you think is the truth will be your own vile imagination.

God wants som one who is LOYAL! Not judgmental or arrogant or unkind or foolish...

Just loyalty and constancy...

So is the Vatican behind any kind of evil agenda (all you catholic bashers) or perhaps is the only true master of conspiracy the same as the source MIND of all genius (both 'dark' and 'light')?

I think mankind has been had! Calling one a savior who was acting in his role of false prophet and condemning the one who came as the true shining light of salvation?

DO some research on the character of Hitler..according to what those close to him said in the early years...look at his pictures....look INTO his eyes...

Was he evil? You make the call!

Okay, I did do some research as suggested. I have to admit that what I have found, although fascinating, is colored by my own preconceived notions about religion and about Hitler.

I am not Catholic or Christian, so I simply do not believe in demons, devils, or possession. I must then arrive at the conclusion that Hitler acted just as he wanted to act. He made his choices and carried out his plans without supernatural influence.

I looked at as many photographs of Hitler as I could find and I made every effort to look into his eyes. I normally avoid judgemental feelings that a person IS evil, but I will say that Hitler committed much evil. In the name of decency one should never plan and carry out genocide, regardless of one's religious or social beliefs or convictions.

His paintings were interesting and I actually like the style in which he painted, although I must say that it lends a few of his works a sort of "paint by number" feel. The remainder of his works that I viewed were nicely composed and well represented. I can see why they did well at auction, both as works of art and works of historical significance.

Originally posted by queenannie38
Obviously they are not familiar with the story of Nebuchadnezzar

What does that have to do with anything?

....nor do they even understand 'satan.'
In the new testament, satan/the devil is a force for evil that tempts people to do what they should not, such as with christ in the wilderness. How is the preist wrong?

Was he evil? You make the call!

Heck yeah, if anyone was evil, he was. Its possible to say that there is no such thing as evil, sure, and if there's no such thing as evil anywhere or if there can't be any humans that can do evil things, then of course, logically, he can't.
But otherwise, yeah, hitler was an evil bastard.

Nygdan, I know you are familiar with the bible and are VERY intelligent. I'm not going to spell it out because understanding it is much better because it applies to Hitler, too...
And also it is up to you, totally. I know you are not what they might call 'a bible believer' even though you know it...and much more....so it's up to you to pursue it...

As far as Satan - you understand - why don't you see the priest's interpretation is lacking the idea of Satan being God's anger?

God is evil AND good:

Isaiah chapter 45 says:

I make peace and I create EVIL. I the LORD and there is no other. (paraphrased)

The bible also says that we will not be give temptation beyond what we have power to resist - yet King David was unable to resist Satan who made him 'number' Israel!

If God desires evil to be done for His Plan, same as with good - man does it!
ONLY a very obedient and solely God-driven person would do EVIL for God to the point of exterminating so many Jews..

And the christians say either the pharisees were evil and/or the Romans for christ's crucificxion.....
Yet they believe that death saved THEM all..

Same thing - bigger scale - this was the real deal, though!

Originally posted by wellwhatnow
Okay, I did do some research as suggested. I have to admit that what I have found, although fascinating, is colored by my own preconceived notions about religion and about Hitler.

Quite understandable! Totally! And thank you SO much for responding in an interested but neutral way! Thanks a lot!

I am not Catholic or Christian, so I simply do not believe in demons, devils, or possession. I must then arrive at the conclusion that Hitler acted just as he wanted to act. He made his choices and carried out his plans without supernatural influence.

Well, that is also understandable - I think the ideas we each have about such things are very varied and depend on many things...no need to hash that one out right now!

I looked at as many photographs of Hitler as I could find and I made every effort to look into his eyes. I normally avoid judgemental feelings that a person IS evil, but I will say that Hitler committed much evil. In the name of decency one should never plan and carry out genocide, regardless of one's religious or social beliefs or convictions.

Yes he did do 'evil.' God does 'evil,' too, according to the bible - and when one can truly understand the overall picture presented (in the bible) it is not dualistic in the way of an inner struggle within God (as it is for man) it is rather just the two sides of the judgment scale - dark and light - each working in turn according to what God was planning for the Good of ALL men....

I say often: God's evil is good - he does it for the sake of ALL's good
Man's good is evil - it is driven by selfish motives unless it is driven by God.

We cannot help it. We don't always know it. And it really doesn't matter... God know s us better than we know ourselves. And He doesn't hold it against us whereas we blindly make things worse by doing all sorts of error in judgment of one another!

His paintings were interesting and I actually like the style in which he painted, although I must say that it lends a few of his works a sort of "paint by number" feel. The remainder of his works that I viewed were nicely composed and well represented. I can see why they did well at auction, both as works of art and works of historical significance.

I think it is just an effect of the present times..more and more people are fascinated with him and it will become apparent why.

To copy photos is normal for beginners - I know he did that quite a bit, and it shows...he wasn't really that good but he did have talent and the lack of encouragement took him in another direction for his life - which lead to being Fuhrer which led to all that we know and much more that we have made up and also assumed....and there is more to know that is true...

Our Hitler
June 22, 1941
To the Front Fighters of the World

Those are non- tainted words that lend a different and wider perspective....I'm not expecting to persuade anyone of anything - just as always - I believe in the freedom of our own minds and I demand it for myself and so I must give it to others just the same.

But I do like to encourage people to re-examine things when it becomes clear to me, undoubtedly, that things are not as we thought....that way no one is ignorant except by choice and everyone has the chance to decide for themselves...

I also read a little bit of 'The Rainbow Swastika' a few weeks back. Now that really puts a different spin on things - like a roulette wheel - spinning and spinning!

I was amazed that many of the unknown or misunderstood forces behind many things that happened are rooted in both esoterism and are borne out by the readings of Edgar Cayce (which have since been proven to be totally reliable - just also misunderstood and wrongly applied!)

See what you think, if you want to.

Originally posted by queenannie38
If God desires evil to be done for His Plan, same as with good - man does it!
ONLY a very obedient and solely God-driven person would do EVIL for God to the point of exterminating so many Jews..

I can see this working, and then we'd have to say 'no one is evil', which of course would have to mean hitler isn't evil either. But, if people can be evil, in whatever meaning of the word, then hitler would have to be, I think.

Right! The only problem we really have is that our 'good' and our 'bad' fight within us...they need to merge...

to Grey!

Annie, have you gone mad?
Basic fundamentals...
1)God gave man free-will.
2)God proceeded with the 10 commandments: one of which is "thou shalt not kill".
3)God also makes it very clear that those who oppress His people will suffer greatly.

Hitler made his own choice(although he was tempted by satan, which is even as an ANGEL OF LIGHT[Lucifer-bringer of light]).
Hitler broke a commandment, which results in sin, and NEVER repented(if it is true that he killed himself, then he surely did not repent.)
Hitler (allegedly) ordered/assisted the deaths in the vicinity of 6 million jews.
Hilter (allegedly) ordered/assisted the deaths in the vicinity of 6 MILLION jews.

The Jews are His people.

Whoever denies his artistic ability is truly jealous. Yet, whoever denies his evil spirit is completely blind.
Nowhere in the Bible does it demonstrate that God increased anyone in the Spirit to overcome that which is GOOD for His Will.
Only does God ALLOW and do nothing against that which can be used for HIS better purpose. Only does God ALLOW (as in the book of Job) that Satan tempt His followers into doing evil. However, if even Job, a simple man, was able to get through his trial with temptation...
then Hitler should have been a little more meek.
There was no God in Hitler when he committed his crimes. He was willingly possessed of himself the evils that corrupt ones spirit. Revenge was his option.
As to exactly what happened to Hitler's spirit after any written history suggests...only God knows that.