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Freezing Alaskans Say No To Chavez Heating Oil in Defense of Bush!

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posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 01:28 AM
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In a rarely seen gesture of principal in action some Alaskans are saying "No" to free heating oil from petroleum companies run by Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez. Will the Alaskans patriotic fervor become more prevalent here in the lower forty eight?
 



washingtontimes.com
ANCHORAGE, Alaska (AP) -- A few of Alaska's native villages are refusing free heating oil from the petroleum company controlled by Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, based on the patriotic principle that no foreigner has the right to call their president "the devil." "As a citizen of this country, you can have your own opinion of our president and our country. But I don't want a foreigner coming in here and bashing us," said Justine Gunderson, administrator for the tribal council in the Aleut village of Nelson Lagoon.

"Even though we're in economically dire straits, it was the right choice to make," said Mr. Gunderson, whose village on the Bering Sea can dip to temperatures of minus-15.
While scores of Alaska's Eskimo and Indian villages, where many are poor, say they have no choice but to accept heating-oil money from Citgo, Dimitri Philemonof, president and chief executive of the Aleutian Pribilof Islands Association, said taking the aid would be "compromising ourselves."
"I think we have some duty to our country, and I think it's loyalty," said Mr. Philemonof, whose nonprofit organization would have handled the heating oil donation on behalf of 291 households in Nelson Lagoon, Atka, St. Paul and St. George.
The Aleutian Pribilof Islands Association rejected the offer because Mr. Chavez has repeatedly denigrated Mr. Bush, calling him "the devil" in a speech to the United Nations last month and referring to him as a terrorist.




Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


Say what you want about president Bush, that wont take away from what these Alaskans have accomplished with this stand for what is right. What this says about the perception of Hugo Chavez is that with this free heating oil comes salt for the wounds of American patriotism.

Related News Links:
www.nypost.com
www.upi.com

[edit on 11-10-2006 by the_sentinal]

[edit on 11-10-2006 by the_sentinal]




posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 04:54 PM
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This is where blind patriotism goes just a bit too far. Bush on one hand calls Chavez part of the axis of evil - while at the UN mind you, then Chavez comes to the same UN building and calls Bush the devil - I still chuckle at that one. How dare another world leader speak bad about the president of the united states?!?


While I admire the decision of these native alaskans, I wonder whether it is truly the will of the people, or the people leading them for political reasons to reject Chavez's offer of free oil.

What have we become as a people when we cannot take criticism from others about our actions? Many people feel that Bush IS the devil, and not just in Venezuela.....



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 05:30 PM
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And that is your opinion,

My opinion is that many people think Bush is NOT the devil... I'm pretty sure he isn't, I believe that the Devil is a personification created by religion.

Why would anyone want to sully the honest and honorable actions of a people just to further an opinion of one man?

These Alaskans are simply and eloquently standing up for their opinion that they support someone that you obviously do not. This does not make them wrong, it also does not in anyway indicate any form of conspiracy or manipulation except the usual form that can be found in the opening of a can of soup. It quite simply and completely indicates an opinion that is in opposition to the Bush Haters. Not wrong, not right, just theirs.

I applaud them and their fortitude in the face of such opposition.


Semper
Semper



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 05:37 PM
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I say take the oil, and give Chavez the finger. Still keep the patriotism there.



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 05:40 PM
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Does nobody else find it strange that people are struggling to find heat in the 'Greatest Nation On Earth'? Or perhaps my perceptions of the USA are incorrect. I fully expected New Orleans to be fully rebuilt and shining by now.

I would have thought people would be asking how this can happen, rather than taking sides, but that's ATS I guess.

If myself and my kids were freezing, i'd take the handout and be asking why my government can't provide it for me...but thats just me.



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 07:07 PM
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Alaska is a red state, so it will be mostly republicans freezing to death right? Ok, just means fewer votes for the Republicans. Cruel to say this?

I believe the same with gas prices. People in red states can not complain about gas prices because they put the guy who let this happen in office. Sorry, if you vote for the guy who sodomizes you more then once you can't complain about not being able to sit down.

Just like democrats can't complain about school taxes or a animal they want to shoot being protected.(Seagulls! Dang rats with wings are protected!) They voted those people in so they can't complain when the people put in to power do what they do. If you want to shoot seagulls vote for the guys who will let you do that, not the guy who won't then complain that he won't let you shoot seagulls.



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 07:17 PM
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Originally posted by KhieuSamphan
...and be asking why my government can't provide it for me...but thats just me.


Not it's job, you only get the essentials and the rest you must provide for yourself, I'm not big on freeloading, IMO people should live how they did before, no one depended on the Government for anything, you did it yourself. And you do have misconception of the US as well as IMO unreasonable expectations.



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 10:17 PM
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If you want to shoot seagulls vote for the guys who will let you do that, not the guy who won't then complain that he won't let you shoot seagulls.


I hate those things!

Westpoint.... EXACTLY

Why is it that some have the "Knee jerk" reaction that anytime something goes wrong, the government is supposed to "Bail" them out?


n 1: the organization that is the governing authority of a
political unit; "the government reduced taxes"; "the
matter was referred to higher authorities" [syn: authorities,
regime]
2: the system or form by which a community or other political
unit is governed; "tyrannical government"
3: the act of governing; exercising authority; "regulations for
the governing of state prisons"; "he had considerable
experience of government" [syn: governing, governance,
government activity]
4: the study of government of states and other political units
[syn: politics, political science]dict.die.net...
Courtesy DICT.NET


The Governments job is the "Govern." PERIOD!

Want a Nanny, join a commune.

Semper



posted on Oct, 11 2006 @ 11:06 PM
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Originally posted by the_sentinal
But I don't want a foreigner coming in here and bashing us," said Justine Gunderson, administrator for the tribal council in the Aleut village of Nelson Lagoon.

"Even though we're in economically dire straits, it was the right choice to make," said Mr. Gunderson, whose village on the Bering Sea can dip to temperatures of minus-15.
While scores of Alaska's Eskimo and Indian villages, where many are poor, say


Chavez is doing this at his own countries expense, the only thing on his mind is trying to show the US that our gov't isn't on our side and to try to divide the country into thinking that he is helping the US more than our own gov't is.

Venezuela's Chavez Chalks Up Deficit Despite Oil Gains

CARACAS -(Dow Jones)- Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez's spending has exceeded his government's gains from oil sales this year resulting in a gaping deficit that many believe will grow in coming months.

The Andean country's accumulated deficit stood at 4.9 trillion bolivars ($2.3 billion) at the end of July, according to the latest central bank figures released late last week

Chavez has continued to run up bills at a faster pace than his revenues from sales of crude oil in international markets.



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 03:40 AM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23

Originally posted by KhieuSamphan
...and be asking why my government can't provide it for me...but thats just me.


Not it's job, you only get the essentials and the rest you must provide for yourself, I'm not big on freeloading, IMO people should live how they did before, no one depended on the Government for anything, you did it yourself. And you do have misconception of the US as well as IMO unreasonable expectations.


You don't consider heating oil an essential service in ALaska? Man how far north have you ever been?

I agree with you about not relying on Government - but then that would go part and parcel with not collecting taxes. So, seeing as the government can't stop stealing from their people, then shouldn't their people at least expect the essentials provided? Jeeza, even Cuba can do that..

Also, the relying on yourself and not government would be nice to see those that work in government do the same, but I bet they are always comforable in the limos they ride in aren't they?



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 03:48 AM
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Can you tell HAARP system is located nearby


thats right be a nice brainwashed slave and just freeze to death....

....yeeees mastaaaa, anything for lord Bush

whatever floats their boat



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 07:00 AM
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then shouldn't their people at least expect the essentials provided?


They can.

Expect a Military to be maintained to protect you.
Expect crime to be investigated.

Expect the Government to Govern. Nothing less, nothing more.

Too cold where you live, move.

Semper



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 09:40 AM
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Originally posted by semperfortis
And that is your opinion,


Why would anyone want to sully the honest and honorable actions of a people just to further an opinion of one man?


I applaud them and their fortitude in the face of such opposition.


How did I "sully" their actions in any way, shape or form? I see a story like this and think it is absurd. I am tired of people taking this attitude that we are the USA - do as we say, not as we do. I have challenged people on this site to give me real, actual reasons - with links -of why Chavez is so bad. Every link posted has been either american propaganda or some blatently anti Chavez site - also Propaganda. Bush calls him evil on the same podium, and when Chavez returns the favor, people call foul - I love hypocracy in its finest
.

I pointed out - as I will again - that I admire the heart in these people, however I am concerned that this patriotism isn't shared by everyone taking place in this boycott equally, and that people who could really use that heat are going to suffer - all for political reasons.

I am all for smaller gov, dont get me wrong, however this government is all but that. This government is changing the rules on the playing field so that ordinary people like you and me WONT be able to provide for themselves, and will be FORCED to rely on gov - or corporation (actually, I cant tell the difference any more) to provide for them at a huge cost - not in monetary terms necessarally(as more and more of us have less and less money), but rather in pride and dignity. In all actuality, we are slowly becoming a slave state. You say that I sullied the honorable actions of a people to further the opinion of one man? That is not at all what I have done. It is you that sullly the american dream with your rhetoric and party line towing remarks (they all seem to be recycled) to further the opinion and goals of one man - and to many, that man is the Devil. Do I think he is the devil, nope - just an incredible @$$.



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 10:02 AM
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As long as you dismiss anything that varies from your pessimistic world view, of course you see evidence of Chavez as propaganda.
There in lies the absolute futility in debating someone filled with hate. Much like the Bush Bashers, there is no logic to their argument; so logical, researched debates have no effect on them at all. This is common when attempting to discuss a factual argument with an emotional subject.

As for my personal ability to provide for myself. Well I came from a dirt farm in WV, raised by my Granny, (God rest her soul) on 123$ a month in Social Security. Not one penny in government handouts. I have struggled my way, with fallbacks, to where I have no need to work every again if I so choose to.

So maybe YOU wont be able to provide for yourself, the rest of us will.

Semper



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 10:19 AM
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While I think this country is suffering from extreme Xenophobia right now, I have to applaud the villagers. I am not a big Bush fan, but to have some foreign leader come to our country and basically state that our leader is the personification of "evil" is rather insulting.

Now, on the flip side of the coin, I think Chavez may really care about others. Somehow I doubt it, but he may.



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by semperfortis
As long as you dismiss anything that varies from your pessimistic world view, of course you see evidence of Chavez as propaganda.
There in lies the absolute futility in debating someone filled with hate. Much like the Bush Bashers, there is no logic to their argument; so logical, researched debates have no effect on them at all. This is common when attempting to discuss a factual argument with an emotional subject.

As for my personal ability to provide for myself. Well I came from a dirt farm in WV, raised by my Granny, (God rest her soul) on 123$ a month in Social Security. Not one penny in government handouts. I have struggled my way, with fallbacks, to where I have no need to work every again if I so choose to.

So maybe YOU wont be able to provide for yourself, the rest of us will.

Semper


How dare you say that I am filled with hate.

You neither know me nor understand me. I have asked a perfectly logical question and you say there is no logic in debating me. You are skirting the edge of breaking the T&C of this site by attacking me in your last post. I truly feel sorry for you as you have no sense of reality nor decency.
What evidence of Chavez do you speak of???? I have asked and no one delivers! Everyone that I know (including my Venezuelan friend) have a high opinion of Chavez. I never said anything about not providing for myself either - I work my ass of every week for my life - unlike you, I am not too selfish to share part of what I dont need with people who cannot. The only purpose of your last post was to inflame and aggrivate me - well congrats, you succeeded. Unfortunately, you have yet to post anything of substance other than your hate filled rant throwing undue accusations at others for simply expressing their right to their opinion. I love the term that has been applied to logical people who are critical of this administration - Bush bashers. Another token phrase recycled from the right wing nut job propaganda machine that you have been brainwashed by.



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
but to have some foreign leader come to our country and basically state that our leader is the personification of "evil" is rather insulting.

Now, on the flip side of the coin, I think Chavez may really care about others. Somehow I doubt it, but he may.


Actually, the "devil" comment was made at the UN building, international soil. If Bush can bash the world from that podium, where is the world supposed to express their opinion??

[edit on 12-10-2006 by LogansRun]



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 11:02 AM
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Originally posted by LogansRun

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
but to have some foreign leader come to our country and basically state that our leader is the personification of "evil" is rather insulting.

Now, on the flip side of the coin, I think Chavez may really care about others. Somehow I doubt it, but he may.


Actually, the "devil" comment was made at the UN building, international soil. [edit on 12-10-2006 by LogansRun]


You see, the problem is that the U.N Headquarters are in New York, New York which is not "international soil," as you term it. It is on the sovereign land of the United States of America.

I know the word sovereign is a dirty word in the increasingly globalistic world, but the last time I checked, America was still a sovereign nation. For someone to come to any .quarters palced on a sovereign country's soil and degrrade its President is rather offensive..

[edit on 12-10-2006 by SpeakerofTruth]



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 11:03 AM
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I'm truly sorry you feel it necessary to become emotional on such an relatively benign topic. This of course negates any possibility of intellectual debate.

Being passionate for a subject is diametrically opposed to emotional outbursts.

Now to refute some of your exclamations


What evidence of Chavez do you speak of???? I have asked and no one delivers!


of why Chavez is so bad. Every link posted has been either american propaganda or some blatently anti Chavez site - also Propaganda.

Your own words..


How dare you say that I am filled with hate.



Many people feel that Bush IS the devil, and not just in Venezuela.....
Another token phrase recycled from the right wing nut job propaganda machine that you have been brainwashed by.

Again, your words not mine..



I never said anything about not providing for myself either - I work my ass of every week for my life


so that ordinary people like you and me WONT be able to provide for themselves, and will be FORCED to rely on gov

Again, your words

Finally...


You are skirting the edge of breaking the T&C of this site by attacking me in your last post.



you have no sense of reality nor decency.
I work my ass of every week for my life - unlike you
right wing nut job propaganda machine that you have been brainwashed by.

Did you even read the T&C??

Well, anyway, it is apparent no intellectual debate is going to happen as long as the emotional "Flaming" continues..

Semper



posted on Oct, 12 2006 @ 11:21 AM
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Originally posted by semperfortis

Well, anyway, it is apparent no intellectual debate is going to happen as long as the emotional "Flaming" continues..

Semper


Show me that any comment that I made indicates that I am full of hate. You started the flame fest by claiming that I was - how else am I supposed to react? That is another token phrase from the right - you cannot debate a "bush basher" because they get too emotional....

How else is any rational person supposed to react. The issue is, you CANT debate me. You have no ammo. You just make empty accusations and twist reality to fit your own deluded perception. You quote my words, yet you offer no response to them other than "emotional flaming". What valid point have you made in this exchange other than to attack people who criticize their gov's actions?
I will take a step back and apologize for the flame, are you able to do the same to have a rational discussion about this, or are you going to continue to attack and insult those with opposing views?




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