who is satan? and what is this 5th planet spoken of in the bible?

Bigsage what I am, is the guy behind this PC. As far as any sentient life, which I feel does exist in the solar system, when they get there own lets be clear...

As soon as they get there own PC I will be happy to respond, until then, the best I can do is sugest that some of them may be as inteligent as dolphins (this is until evidence sugest an alternative).

Any thoughts?

jag,

here is where I do not agree with you.

most aliens have been identified as straddling our realm and a higher one.

that is why their technology is so wonderful compared to ours, they do not have to conform to our limitations.

they have by virtue of where they exist mastered the laws of physicality because they exist above it in many cases.

That is why bigsage is correct, you cannot apply what you know to this subject because frankly we do not know much at all.

like trying to explain university level mathematics to a child when they are trying to learn how to count.

if i have faith in the father and i see him not...
then why would i not have faith in the science seen and observed as "fact"...
just because they are potentiality does not make them the father but they are as much an aspect as you and i and those dolphins...

in other words if i believe and have faith why do i need to see something i know is potentially possible to know that it is potentially possible?

most aliens have been identified as straddling our realm and a higher one.
that is why their technology is so wonderful compared to ours, they do not have to conform to our limitations.
they have by virtue of where they exist mastered the laws of physicality because they exist above it in many cases.

Yeah right - there are spiritual beings who will tell you whatever you desire to hear. How do you know that these "aliens" are not just jerking people around? Indeed they blithely tell you that they can violate known physical laws without ever a mention as to how or why. It is just "well we are so advanced and you are so stupid".

just they may have advanced and we havent yet because of our selfish reasons...

if heaven was a mile away, which it seems to be, it would take all of humanities effort to reach it...

jag,

valid questions.

we are in a quandry us souled humans for we are both higher and lower than those entities that we are talking about (at least the negative ones anyways).

our bodies are in a lower realm than them but our spirits our higher then they can attain.

see the quandry?

that is why it says in the bible that we are special, for we are.

that is why the body, the container is so valuable, for what it contains.

just they may have advanced and we havent yet because of our selfish reasons...
if heaven was a mile away, which it seems to be, it would take all of humanities effort to reach it...

And oh yeah - these fantastically advanced "beings" only contact those who are spiritually equiped to communicate on their level and believe whatever these advanced "beings" will tell them. These fantastically advanced "beings" say that not all people can appreciate their message, not all people can see "the light". Wake up and realize who you are dealing with.

[Edited on 9-11-2003 by jagdflieger]

so one can protect their soul by way of battling the oppression?
or do you think the soul requires protection from us?

supposedly in the bible their is some talk about us being below angels, is this physically...

are these entities/groups attempting to have us think our bodies are the main aspect and not the essence of what resides within them?

What is on of the "gods" of this age? It is technology. People worship technology as if it were a "god". Therefore these type of people would believe that any being with much better technology would be more spiritually advanced than us and would believe whatever they say. Notice that these "aliens" have only shown up in the last few years (although they claim to have been around for thousand of years). Why? If these "aliens" have been in contact with the earth for as long as the claims, why haven't these "aliens" formed a regular contact years ago. The claim that the people of earth are not ready for it does not wash. If these "aliens" really wanted to help the earth, they would have been helping us on a regular basis for hundreds of years. What we have is an almost 70 year scam. Demons are out - technologically advanced aliens are in.

Originally posted by jagdflieger

just they may have advanced and we havent yet because of our selfish reasons...
if heaven was a mile away, which it seems to be, it would take all of humanities effort to reach it...

And oh yeah - these fantastically advanced "beings" only contact those who are spiritually equiped to communicate on their level and believe whatever these advanced "beings" will tell them. These fantastically advanced "beings" say that not all people can appreciate their message, not all people can see "the light". Wake up and realize who you are dealing with.

[Edited on 9-11-2003 by jagdflieger]

well there are positive and negative entities interacting with many kinds of people for many kinds of reasons.

so there is no easy answer to these statements.

suffice to say that each experience is unique and must be judged on its own merits IMHO.

their intent is to create a race of man complacent enough to be programmed and controlled and happy in their little box...
why?

a couple of theories...

1. maybe they need us in some way(obviously)...
2. maybe they want to be worhipped for humanistic reasons(pride,greed,honor)...

in reference to theory 2 maybe we give them the power they need to continue being as they are...

or maybe...

they are positive beings as they say and want to help without interfering with our will...

but this theory is suspect because will can be controlled by proxy...

all in all i can not say thay all humans are bad so i definately cannot say all beings other than humans are bad as well...

Originally posted by bigsage
so one can protect their soul by way of battling the oppression?
or do you think the soul requires protection from us?

supposedly in the bible their is some talk about us being below angels, is this physically...

are these entities/groups attempting to have us think our bodies are the main aspect and not the essence of what resides within them?

I think the body and soul were designed to work together and thus the soul is tied to the body. Thus one must consider the needs of the soul while in the body.

We were angels but the fall from Eden made us physical as I understand it. We exist in past present and future (purely souled state which we can access if we wish).

Yes to control the soul one must convince the container that the soul does not exist and that the container is primary.

well supposedly...
their intent is to create a race of man complacent enough to be programmed and controlled and happy in their little box...
why?
a couple of theories...
1. maybe they need us in some way(obviously)...
2. maybe they want to be worhipped for humanistic reasons(pride,greed,honor)...
in reference to theory 2 maybe we give them the power they need to continue being as they are...
or maybe...
they are positive beings as they say and want to help without interfering with our will...
but this theory is suspect because will can be controlled by proxy...
all in all i can not say thay all humans are bad so i definately cannot say all beings other than humans are bad as well...

1. If these "aliens" are so technologically advanced, what do they need us for. These "aliens" would have machines which would do everything they needed to have done.
2. If they needed to be worshipped because they are "power tripping", why mess around. Show up when men are primitive and stay being "gods". (Since the claim is these "aliens" have been coming to earth for thousands of years, why disappear from the "gods" scene for a couple of thousand years.) This theory does not hold water.
3. If they are "positive beings" why not start helping us with "positive things" back when we had stone age technology. With "positive help" a stone age culture could be lifted to the iron age in a couple of generations. Again this theory does not hold water. Also not all humans are "so bad".
Again this is a 70 year scam. Demons are out - technologically advanced aliens are in. Demon possession is out - alien abduction is in. The source is the same, the tactics have changed for the times.

there were pre humans...

we create energy that cannot be seen with the regular eye...
this energy comes from the soul and radiates out of the body depending uppon how one exerts it...

Originally posted by LeenBekkemaa

The Gods to which you pray will kill you.

The God wich I pray will not kill me.

At least, there is a moral with that " God-satan " story : Don't mess with the Boss.

or do you commune with your father in secret?
just asking...and you dont have to answer if the question is too close to home...

What if the father is a being... a being like all the other beings... exept he is technologically advanced...

What if he created us to increase his chances of survival... what if he does this on many more planets... to get an army which helps him... in his battle against other beings... just like we visit the moon and are willing to build there some sort of house in which we can live... to survive on other planets... to increase our chances of survival...

What if God does the same... not for pride or something... just because he doesn't want to let his race die...

And if someone doesn't like that slavery (like Lucifer) then they will be killed... cause it lowens the chances of survival for the father...

What if Lucifer was the one which did knew about this slavery... and didn't want to let menkind suffer as his race did, under Gods will?

What if God also knows we will probably don't like this slavery neither... and that therefore also the Apocalyps will be for us... just like God said...

That we are just like Lucifer... we still give value to live... which God doesn't...

What if this is the real theorie... if this is reality... how stupid would menkind feel when the God came back.. and destroyed them all... while they worshipped him?

Just let go of the idea that he created everything... just say he created menkind to his equals...

If we are just slaves... created to increase his chance of survival... would we think like Lucifer... just because life is not worth living in such a way?

all in all i can not say thay all humans are bad so i definately cannot say all beings other than humans are bad as well...

Exactly... perhaps Lucifer and his 1/3th of the Angels were still some of the Good beings...

At least, there is a moral with that " God-satan " story : Don't mess with the Boss.

No don't mess with the boss, because if you don't want to become slaves he will kill you.

q: "What if the father is a being... a being like all the other beings... exept he is technologically advanced..."

a: the father is omniscent...

q:"What if he created us to increase his chances of survival... what if he does this on many more planets... to get an army which helps him... in his battle against other beings... just like we visit the moon and are willing to build there some sort of house in which we can live... to survive on other planets... to increase our chances of survival... "

a: nothing is wrong with exploration is there? control of other beings for the purpose of one is different, right?

q:"What if God does the same... not for pride or something... just because he doesn't want to let his race die... "

a:we all gotta go,all good things must come to an end,death is an aspect of life just as beautiful...

q:"And if someone doesn't like that slavery (like Lucifer) then they will be killed... cause it lowens the chances of survival for the father... "

a:your flesh is just that flesh, your soul lives forever;thus what is in danger of not surviving the flesh or the soul and if he was the father of all creation then he would not fear much for he would understand much more...

q:"What if Lucifer was the one which did knew about this slavery... and didn't want to let menkind suffer as his race did, under Gods will? "

a:the fathers will is free and has nothing to do with imposed suffering, imposed love,will,suffering has nothing to do with the father of all creation...

q:"What if God also knows we will probably don't like this slavery neither... and that therefore also the Apocalyps will be for us... just like God said... "

a:all is lessons, knowledge of truth is an aspect of love,experience is an aspect of love,truth is an aspect of love;thus what is there not to like other than the manipulation?

q:"That we are just like Lucifer... we still give value to live... which God doesn't... "

a:no, value to all life is value to life, not some for that is disrespect for the fathers creations...

q:"What if this is the real theorie... if this is reality... how stupid would menkind feel when the God came back.. and destroyed them all... while they worshipped him? "

a:death is a part of life, we all gotta go, all good things come to an end...

s:"Just let go of the idea that he created everything... just say he created menkind to his equals... "

a:where the equality? let go of some of the fathers creations?

q:"If we are just slaves... created to increase his chance of survival... would we think like Lucifer... just because life is not worth living in such a way? "

a:men who allow themselves to be bonded to the material un-reality are slaves to their material possessions...









these "gods" you refer to are physical...

the father is in all of creation from the top to the bottom but some never see him...



[Edited on 9-11-2003 by bigsage]

[Edited on 9-11-2003 by bigsage]