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Easy Question: Who's Responsible for the 9/11 Plot?

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posted on Sep, 2 2006 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by tuccy



Maybe ayou've missed it but you can take DNA sample usually even if the body is shredded to bits and burned.



Thanks Tuccy, no, I didn't miss it but first you need a body you can shred and burn to take DNA samples from. As far as I can tell there was no flying machine big enough (to hold all of the alleged bodies) that hit the Pentagon.




posted on Sep, 2 2006 @ 02:29 PM
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I don't know who is responsible, but it seems to me that all heck started breaking loose right about here


Clinton now wants to slash the defense budget by over $120 billion


and continued to get worse until this.


US President George W Bush has announced plans for a $48bn increase in defence spending to fight the war on terror.


Perhaps I just tend to oversimplify things?






[edit on 9/2/06 by makeitso]



posted on Sep, 2 2006 @ 08:14 PM
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Originally posted by makeitso
Perhaps I just tend to oversimplify things?


Yes. Plus it's a rather dull and partisan swipe at Clinton. Much as I detested BC, Dubya's far, far dumber and more unpleasant. People who see things only in terms of Democrat or Republican are really missing the point.



posted on Sep, 2 2006 @ 08:26 PM
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im pretty convinced that it was Mossad agents behind the whole thing.
I base that on the 1 day .line where a lady saw 4 "arab looking men" on the roof of a building cheering and taking pictures of the 2 towers falling down...
then the next day...we heard nothing of the story at all...wierd


Again i am in no way saying that its a jewish conspiracy blah blah blah
im not racist towards jews..i have jewish friends...so dont een bring that up, thanks


Mossad, CIA, Saudi Government any oppressive money hungry things are far from being jewish let alone a human.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 12:13 AM
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.


Rich23
Plus it's a rather dull and partisan swipe at Clinton.


Strange that you see it that way.

In reality it is a dull swipe at the defence industry. Thus the bold words "defense spending".


Clearly my point was that as soon as someone tried to take money away from the defence industry all heck started breaking loose, and only calms when its money is given back. The particular presidents involved were/are irrelevant in that respect.



[edit on 9/3/06 by makeitso]



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 12:18 AM
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I don't think it's an oversimplification at all. All of that money is going right to the military-industrial complex, ie corporations that manufacture for our military. They're also the most probable suspect in relation to carrying out 9/11, imo, at least for supplying the materials and providing the overall means.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 01:31 AM
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Makeitso -

you have my sincere apologies for missing the subtlety of your point.

All I can offer in the way of mitigation is that there are a lot of dull and partisan posters on here and I saw it in those terms. ATS contains finer minds than that, but they're thin on the ground these days



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 02:02 AM
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Originally posted by johnlear
Thanks Tuccy, no, I didn't miss it but first you need a body you can shred and burn to take DNA samples from. As far as I can tell there was no flying machine big enough (to hold all of the alleged bodies) that hit the Pentagon.


Then a) what was it, b) how did 757 wreckage get there, c) how did the human reamins get there or d) how the evil gubmint managed to make all the thousands of rescuers comply with their story, e) how did it make eyewitnesses comply, f) how come pieces of personal property of the passangers were found at the site and subsequently returned to families...



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 02:09 AM
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Rich -

You are a gentleman and scholar to appologize!
No worries, all is well.


My humble apologies for not being more clear in my original post.

bsbray11 - Thanks, thats exactly what I meant.




Now back to: Who is responsible?




[edit on 9/3/06 by makeitso]



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 09:14 AM
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Originally posted by tuccy



a) what was it,


Probably a small, remotely guided airplane with a missle, painted the same colors as American Airlines.


b) how did 757 wreckage get there


The parts on the inside were carried in beforehand.
I don't believe there were any 757 parts found outside. There was a piece of
aluminum painted red and blue found outside but this was not from a 757.


c) how did the human reamins get there or


I know of no human remains found inside or outside the Pentagon that were confirmed or identified by any city or county or state coronor in the local area or anywhere else. All we have are stories from the military itself.


d) how the evil gubmint managed to make all the thousands of rescuers comply with their story


I don't think there were thousands of rescuers, there were probably less than 200 particularly inside the Pentagon and of those that there were I have heard no kind of testimony of the carnage inside. And since the fire department was there in several minutes and since all of the supposed fuel was ignited instantaneously what was it that was burning inside for so long? And why was the fire department ordered to use water instead of foam? Were they trying to burn up evidence? The Boeing 757 is a massive piece of construction. Had a Boeing 757 crashed into the Pentagon there would have been some identifiable remains other than a turrbine wheel, and tire rim. I would like to see the fuselage/wing assembly. Or the assembly where the vertical fin is attached to the aft fuselage. Those assemblies are simply not going to burn to dust with the amount of fuel there was available.


e) how did it make eyewitnesses comply


I've only heard and seen 3 or 4 eyewitnesses that actually saw the aircraft fly into the Pentagon and their stories conflict. Do you know of more eyewitnesses?


f) how come pieces of personal property of the passangers were found at the site and subsequently returned to families...


Same way Atta's passport got found on the streets of Manhatten: as the Boeing 757 impacted the World Trade Center, aircraft commander Atta's jacket flew open and his passport popped out of the inside pocket just as the side window of the cockpit broke open sucking the passport out of the aircraft. The force of the huge jet fuel explosion gently blew the passport away from the flaming inferno and it tossed and turned all the way to the ground where some lucky soul picked it up and gave it to a police officer.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 01:35 PM
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There was a piece of aluminum painted red and blue found outside but this was not from a 757


A piece? Just one? I don't think so.....

www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...





I know of no human remains found inside or outside the Pentagon that were confirmed or identified by any city or county or state coronor in the local area or anywhere else-----John Lear


US Military Installation....US military would have the jurisdiction in the matter.

www.usatoday.com...



WASHINGTON — On Tuesday, Army Staff Sgt. Mark Williams witnessed a combat zone for the first time in his 11 years of service. He never imagined it would be inside the Pentagon. One of the first recovery personnel to enter the crippled .quarters building after a hijacked Boeing 757 smashed into it, the urban search-and-rescue specialist found a gruesome sight. "If anyone has ever burned a pot roast, they'll know what the victims looked like," Williams, 30, said Thursday after another 12-hour shift of searching for 190 bodies — those of 126 missing Pentagon personnel and the 64 aboard the doomed jetliner.



When Williams discovered the scorched bodies of several airline passengers, they were still strapped into their seats. The stench of charred flesh overwhelmed him.


Concerning the bodies at the Pentagon

[Graphic images removed.]




I've only heard and seen 3 or 4 eyewitnesses that actually saw the aircraft fly into the Pentagon and their stories conflict. Do you know of more eyewitnesses?


Sure, Ive seen plenty of them....

criticalthrash.com...

www.geocities.com...


[edit on 3/9/2006 by Umbrax]



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 03:13 PM
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There's a couple of quotes from the USA Today story that I kind of like...


Members of Congress who toured the site Thursday said rescue officials reported that much of the fuselage of the hijacked airplane remains intact in the ruins.


Hmm... there's so much of this stuff to look into. I thought that one of the ideas floated by the True Believers of the Official Version was that the plane had vapourised in the intense heat, which would explain the lack of wreckage. I know that the photos I've seen of a small, 16-foot hole in the building don't remotely look like that aperture would allow the entry of a huge passenger jet.


On a second floor, right next to where the jet sheared off a section of the building, was an undisturbed stool. And on it was a thick, open book. Fellow searchers who had gotten a close look said it was a Bible. It was not burned. Nor was anything around it or on the two floors above it.

"I'm not as religious as some, but that would have me thinking," the soldier said. "I just can't explain it."


Mmm... propaganda with added Bible-flavour. Love it.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 03:19 PM
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Oh, and I'd like to ask a question.

Why are pictures that show charred corpses from 9/11 allowed to remain posted and yet any links to pictures that show foetal deformities arising from DU poisoning are immediately edited out and a notice about the T&C posted?

Occasionally one does suspect some bias on this board.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 03:32 PM
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We are. Because half of us voted for BUSH in the first election.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 03:43 PM
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Because I didnt post the actual pics, just the links for those who want to click on them.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 03:46 PM
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Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999



A piece? Just one? I don't think so.....

www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...
www.911myths.com...


Swampfox46, the above pictures are a truly and honestly pathetic representation of a Boeing 757 crash into the Pentagon. Its discouraging that an intelligent person like yourself could be led to believe that those little miserable scraps of metal could represent a Boeing 757.


US Military Installation....US military would have the jurisdiction in the matter.


Swampfox46, with all due respect, thats what I'm trying to tell you. There is no independent verification of any Boeing 757 passenger death.


When Williams discovered the scorched bodies of several airline passengers, they were still strapped into their seats. The stench of charred flesh overwhelmed him.


Swampfox46 you should realize how ridiculous it it is to say that passengers were still strapped in their seats after hitting the Pentagon at between 450 mph and an ensuing fire that burned everything except a wheel rim and turbine wheel. Do you have any idea the force of hitting a concrete wall at 450 mph. Wouldn't it cross your mind that the seat belt would break? Passengers still strapped in their seats? After hitting a concrete wall at 450 mph? This must be the Twilight Zone.



Sure, Ive seen plenty of them....


No. You've read testimony most of which is from military personnel.


Swampfox46, I have a background in aviation. I have built airplanes and I have flown them. I have investigated accidents, some pretty gruesome. I know how airplanes fly and I know how they crash. My personal opinion is that a Boeing 757 did not crash into the Pentagon no matter how many websites you present. And that is my opinion.

So lets agree to disagree. You're basing your opinion on reading stories on the internet. I am basing mine on 49 years of aviation experience (I am 64). You see I know what a Boeing 757 is made of. And what its made of is neither in front, nor inside the Pentagon. Lets do this. If you can show one single, thats one single, current and qualified Boeing 757 captain that says, "Based on what Swampfox46 has shown me, and based on my personal knowledge of the Boeing 757 I am totally convinced that a Boeing 757 crashed into the Pentagon", I will concede the argument. Until then, we will agree to disagree and make no further, "but what about this...." posts. Thanks.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 04:24 PM
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Swampfox46, the above pictures are a truly and honestly pathetic representation of a Boeing 757 crash into the Pentagon. Its discouraging that an intelligent person like yourself could be led to believe that those little miserable scraps of metal could represent a Boeing 757


With your experience, you should know better. Several of those pics arent "little miserable scraps" they are several square feet in area. Excuse me for not posting ALL the pics of the outside wreckage. If you know what the 757 is made of, then you should know that the majority of the fuselage is aluminum. Coincidentally, thats what the wreckage in the pics is mostly made of.




No. You've read testimony most of which is from military personnel.


ex]• Christopher Munsey, Navy Times reporter , was en route to work. I couldn’t believe what I was now seeing to my right: A silver, twin-engine American Airlines jetliner gliding almost noiselessly over the Navy Annex, fast, low and straight toward the Pentagon, just hundreds of yards away

Not military...


John O’Keefe, 25-year-old Northern Virginia commuter, managing editor of Influence, an American Lawyer Media publication about lobbying was "not much more than a football field away" on


Not military....


• Joel Sucherman, USAToday.com Multimedia Editor, saw it all: an American Airlines jetliner fly left to right across his field of vision as he commuted to work Tuesday morning. It was highly unusual. The large plane was 20 feet off the ground and a mere 50 to 75 yards from his windshield. Two seconds later and before he could see if the landing gear was down or any of the horror- struck faces inside, the plane slammed into the west wall of the Pentagon 100 yards away


Not military...


Omar Campo, a Salvadorean, was cutting the grass on the other side of the road when the plane flew over his ..


Not military...


Alfred S. Regnery, president and publisher of Regnery Publishing, Inc., a sister company of Human Events saw a jetliner, apparently at full throttle and not more than a couple of hundred yards above the ground, screamed over.


Not military...


Afework Hagos, 26, of Arlington, is a computer programmer, a consultant for Nextel. On his way to work he was stuck in a traffic jam on Columbia Pike, near the Pentagon when the plane flew over. He said he looked at it and saw American Airline insignia and when it made impact with the Pentagon initially he saw smoke, then flames


Not military...In other words, the majority of the witnesses on the one site were not military or US Government employees.

About some bodies still being strapped in, one, thats what the belts are supposed to do, keep you in your seats. So why NOT find a few remains still strapped to what was left of their seats?

But the BEST part is your assumption that I am relying on the internet. Wrong. I have 20 years of experience with aviation, I've taken apart aircraft and put them back together, I've flown on them, I've performed safety of flight inspections. I know very well what aircraft are made of, aluminum, steel, titanium, kevlar and epoxy composites, of which I've seen evidence of each in the carnage of the Pentagon. Ive also been part of crash investigations and know that in almost every accident, there is at LEAST one thing that makes you scratch your . and say I've never seen that before.

I also rely on the people I know, that were there that day and by the grace of GOD they survived that which killed others we knew.

So forgive me if I dont think it takes a "one single, current and qualified Boeing 757 captain" to show it was a Boeing 757 that crashed into the Pentagon.



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by johnlear

Swampfox46 you should realize how ridiculous it it is to say that passengers were still strapped in their seats after hitting the Pentagon at between 450 mph and an ensuing fire that burned everything except a wheel rim and turbine wheel. Do you have any idea the force of hitting a concrete wall at 450 mph. Wouldn't it cross your mind that the seat belt would break? Passengers still strapped in their seats? After hitting a concrete wall at 450 mph? This must be the Twilight Zone.



Sure, Ive seen plenty of them....


No. You've read testimony most of which is from military personnel.


Swampfox46, I have a background in aviation. I have built airplanes and I have flown them. I have investigated accidents, some pretty gruesome. I know how airplanes fly and I know how they crash. My personal opinion is that a Boeing 757 did not crash into the Pentagon no matter how many websites you present. And that is my opinion.

So lets agree to disagree. You're basing your opinion on reading stories on the internet. I am basing mine on 49 years of aviation experience (I am 64). You see I know what a Boeing 757 is made of. And what its made of is neither in front, nor inside the Pentagon.


Hi John- I have a question; Do you think that there's any photographic evidence in your opinion, that shows impact marks of the wings on the pentagon's facade?

If so, wouldn't that material at that same velocity described above almost dissappear into fine particles and leave no visual evidence on the lawn? Thanx again-



posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by 2PacSade



Hi John- I have a question; Do you think that there's any photographic evidence in your opinion, that shows impact marks of the wings on the pentagon's facade?


The wingspan of the Beong 757 was about 150 feet. There is little or no damage of impact of a wing either to the right or the left of that hole supposedly made by the Being 757. Neither are the windows broken (on both sides) or impact damage to the right or the left of the hole that would indicate the 150 foot wing of a large airliner hit the face of the Pentagon at 450 mph.


If so, wouldn't that material at that same velocity described above almost dissappear into fine particles and leave no visual evidence on the lawn? Thanx again-


The wings of the Boeing 757 are made of large thick spars. There are flap actuators, pipes, tubes, large cast fittings, fuel tanks all kinds of things that just would not disappear into fine particles. Since there is no indication that the wings went into the Pentagon they must be outside. So where are they? The only thing that disintegrated on the lawn in front of the Pentagon was the credibility of those who say they saw a Boeing 757 crash into it.

The bottom line on the Pentagon crash is that the bomb inside the Pentagon went of at 9:31 and the plane with the missile crashed into the pentagon at 9:37. The reason the Pentagon can't show the film from any of the 30 or 40 cameras is because:

(1) there is no Boeing 757, and
(2) the plane crashes 6 minutes after the bomb goes off

Pretty embarrassing, huh?




posted on Sep, 3 2006 @ 05:29 PM
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Originally posted by johnlear
Originally posted by 2PacSade



Hi John- I have a question; Do you think that there's any photographic evidence in your opinion, that shows impact marks of the wings on the pentagon's facade?


The wingspan of the Beong 757 was about 150 feet. There is little or no damage of impact of a wing either to the right or the left of that hole supposedly made by the Being 757. Neither are the windows broken (on both sides) or impact damage to the right or the left of the hole that would indicate the 150 foot wing of a large airliner hit the face of the Pentagon at 450 mph.


If so, wouldn't that material at that same velocity described above almost dissappear into fine particles and leave no visual evidence on the lawn? Thanx again-


The wings of the Boeing 757 are made of large thick spars. There are flap actuators, pipes, tubes, large cast fittings, fuel tanks all kinds of things that just would not disappear into fine particles. Since there is no indication that the wings went into the Pentagon they must be outside. So where are they? The only thing that disintegrated on the lawn in front of the Pentagon was the credibility of those who say they saw a Boeing 757 crash into it.

The bottom line on the Pentagon crash is that the bomb inside the Pentagon went of at 9:31 and the plane with the missile crashed into the pentagon at 9:37. The reason the Pentagon can't show the film from any of the 30 or 40 cameras is because:

(1) there is no Boeing 757, and
(2) the plane crashes 6 minutes after the bomb goes off

Pretty embarrassing, huh?



Thanx for the insight. Your expertise in these matters is greatly appreciated. I'll look further into a couple of the points you brought up. . .

But how did it get there in the first place? It's the Pentagon? You couldn't fly over a drug dealer's house & not be noticed in the USA!`

sorry for the edits.

[edit on 3-9-2006 by 2PacSade]

[edit on 3-9-2006 by 2PacSade]




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