Why Our Forefathers Forbade War!!

Over and over again from different times pastors of various denominations and religions all over the world have made the statement that before tyranny strikes, a state of immorality has to exist. Many pastors from our church have preached this in sermons without telling us exactly how this will come about. Now the issue of terror has arisen, and recently, in order to struggle to preserve the Patriot Act, a politician was seen on a news program on TV saying that conditions are different now, therefore we need the Patriot Act. He then said something that was really weird. He said that we would not want to see this government taken over by Muslim extremists. At that point we knew that he was trying to make his hearers out to be jackasses.

America is arguably the most powerful nation in the world. Especially with it possessing deadly nuclear weapons, there is not a chance that it can ever be taken over by anything...

Coming from the outside!

There is no way we can first see a terror attack with 19 hijackers and ever think that this can in any way lead to Middle Eastern men living at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue in Washington, D.C. That politician was adding to the great fog of lies that dangerously hovers over America and is destroying it. NOT A CHANCE for something like that happening. The only way America can be destroyed IS FROM INSIDE! This fact therefore points in the OPPOSITE direction and that opposite direction can be more solidified based upon the fact that each terror attack makes our national leaders much more powerful and renegade. The terrorists don't attack our leaders who make decisions that affect the Arab and Muslim agenda. The terrorists spend more money to stage terror attacks against the American people instead. This in itself is a very suspicious fact.

Knowing this, the American forefathers made rules for us that, if we think about it, would fit the thoughts of the common, "Conspiracy Theorist." One example is the Second Amendment. Why was this amendment, giving the right to bear arms, created? Rush Limbaugh, the notable radio talk show host, confessed that it was constructed as a last resort lest the citizens of America find themselves the victims of a tyrannical government. Which government is that? NOT Middle Eastern men! It was talking about the federal government of the United States. The current forced mainstream construct is that any thought that the government is amiss to the interests of the American people is cause to roll on the floor and laugh or to assume psychiatric credentials and to pray for anyone who begins to think this.

Then, some years ago, Judge Mills Lane on TV said something we always knew was true. He said that the Constitution was created in order to protect the American citizens FROM the government and not from each other. He was addressing a local civil case where a man was trying to sue another man for taking his picture out in public without his consent, appealing to the Constitution of the United States.

But for years people have been arguing that the Second Amendment was not meant for actual individual citizens to be armed, but for government-regulated militias to have the right to have arms, offering no protection to individual citizens in case the government becomes tyrannical. They were saying that if even a bad militia is formed, it would actually need legislation to acquire guns. Without that legislation, it would not be able to. Of course, this is not true. That law was made for the people. But just that law itself reveals that the mindset of our national forefathers is the same mindset that is constantly ridiculed and condemned by the strange generation crying out for "change" today who get obstructed in their crusades against paranoia.

Mod Edit: All Caps Title– Please Review This Link.

[edit on 27/5/2006 by Umbrax]

But even the concept that the government itself can pose any danger to the American people has been ridiculed by the strange people we saw on the internet they claimed as proof of "Conspiracy theorism." In order to destroy this country, the thoughts of history have to be reversed. That is why the thoughts of the American forefathers are being ridiculed by people who claim to be the creators and supporters of mainstream thought today. We even have a quotation where President George Washington is warning the American people against the dangers of foreign influence: of getting involved with other countries in war or commerce. In that quotation he said that he has heard of the Illuminati: a secret order that sponsors subversion with the mission to take over the world. Instead of saying that he was rolling on the floor laughing when he heard about them like the strange people do today, he began to warn the American people about the Illuminati. Quite different from what is accepted as the mainstream today. He espoused what is now called in contempt, ISOLATIONISM! No one laughed at him at that time for his principles. He was on top of a nation rapidly growing and rapidly becoming more and more powerful and more and more prosperous under what is now called isolationism. At that time they didn't even have an income tax system to fund global escapades.

THE ONLY THING THAT CAN INSTALL TYRANNY ON THE CITIZENS OF THE MOST POWERFUL COUNTRY IN THE WORLD, IS THE VERY GOVERNMENT OF THAT COUNTRY ITSELF, ONLY! Since 911, the only thing that has been working to reduce the liberties of the American people is the government. Osama hasn't, and nothing else has.

If the government wants to install tyranny on us, how can it be done? It can be done through infiltration, AND THROUGH WAR!

An army of people are taught to infiltrate every organization in the United States, especially those that possess authority, control, entertainment, education, news and journalism. They struggle to capture the top positions of every public office, and positions that admit new recruits. In the government, that would be the top positions like the Executive Branch or President, and also those branches that hire new employees from top to bottom. The top position can help to appoint people who would control who are hired. After appointed they will admit more and more of their numbers into employment who qualify for the job above their competitors. It works like a virus. It overpowers the system at every level and then forces it to accept, as much as possible, only those of her own numbers. Therefore, like a virus, because it enters into the inside, it is hard to detect them, and is more than a delicate process to get rid of them. Therefore, as they secure power, all kinds of problems will be developed, with little options for how to solve them.

Concerning the last days, Luke says:

Luke 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity...

Perplexity means problems for which no solution is being found. It is frustrating. The actual problem is mostly on the inside, but it is hard to identify the actual people responsible. It can be easy to point to someone who isn't a problem and think that he is. It is through the methods described that we had a war even in our church because of strange people from top to bottom telling us we must debate about everything that can be debated, and have respect for those who disagree with us, before they then told us that our church MUST change to accommodate the beliefs of those who lately entered membership to the church and who were by far the minority. They worked to disallow anyone from disagreeing with their intents.

Yet, our national forefathers, who had thoughts that many strange people struggle to destroy today, had certain positions about war. Should this country engage in war? Should this country engage in pre-emptive war in order to "save" other countries? They all forbade this. Why were they so insensitive, cold and cruel? Why are our present national leaders so loving? The actual truth is the OPPOSITE! Here is an example of one very famous president who had such beliefs to stay out of wars as much as possible. He makes a very strange statement that goes like this:

"Surely we have some brave and reliable Roman Catholic officers and soldiers in our armies, but they form an insignificant minority when compared with the Roman Catholic traitors against whom we have to guard ourselves, day and night…." -- Fifty Years in the Church of Rome, pg. 296.

The author here is President Abraham Lincoln. He was here talking about infiltration into the military that they had to guard against the best way they could. You even entertain those concerns today, and you would notice people approach you telling you they are rolling on the floor laughing and that you are filled with supreme hate. They will recommend psychiatrists for you. You and I know that we don't take any such precautions today that Abraham Lincoln here describes. Also the situation back then is different now. Far more Catholics accept liberty and support it today than they did back then not too long after America was formed with liberty after the Inquisitions. The situation is different with the Jesuits. What will ultimately be the result of this described by President Lincoln? Well it works like this:

Strange people infiltrate the military also. They purpose to capture the highest positions. But good people are already there. How can they capture higher positions? Through changes of careers. Through retirement. THROUGH WAR!
Different kinds of soldiers were always in the American military: constitutional soldiers and those with the One World view as the worst enemies of this country always possessed. In the beginnings of this country, both fought and died in war. The strange ones were a minority. The strange ones however, more seek to become career military personnel. They would trend to stay in the military longer in the hopes of acquiring the highest positions. But America's policy of no war in former days was a frustration to them. When any of the good top military personnel retired or died, that was a position left vacant that the bad guys always took advantage of. Those with the One world view outside the country: namely the Communists or the Nazis, would do whatever they could to incite America into war or into military involvement around the world. As soon as commander positions become more and more filled with the strange people, THEN THOSE PEOPLE SELECT CONSTITUTIONAL SOLDIERS TO BE ON THE FRONT LINES IN THE HOPES THAT THEY WOULD DIE OFF, AND THEN WITH THE HOPES THAT THEY CAN STAGE FRIENDLY FIRE INCIDENTS AGAINST THEM OR EVEN BETRAY THEM OVER INTO THE HANDS OF THE ENEMY! This is easy for them to do. All they have to do is mark every soldier that is not a member of their secret orders. Even casual hand signals can alert them. Soldiers are likely even pre-selected to even train in certain companies which are scheduled for the front lines. Other issues of "friendly fire" and Prisoners Of War and Missing In Action cases would arise.

The unfortunate fact is that in every war, not only were constitutional soldiers fighting against their enemies overseas, THEY WERE ALSO BEING ATTACKED BY PEOPLE THROUGHOUT EVERY LEVEL OF THE MILITARY ON THE INSIDE ALSO! It was a fact admitted even by the History Channel, that after WWII when many soldiers risked their lives and perished in warfare against the Nazi regime, MOST of the worst killers among the Nazis managed to escape justice. The History Channel then was forced to elaborate on how this took place and which entities helped the Nazi war criminals to escape. The History Channel gave a list of those who helped the Nazis in this order: The Argentinean government, the Syrian government, the Catholic Church (giving Nazis refuge in her monasteries), and lastly, US military officials. It said the stated US reason for doing this was to utilize those Nazi War criminals as experts in espionage against the Soviets. In every war we know of there is evidence of the US government actually fighting against its own. Then the documentation available concerning President Bush's grandfather (Prescott Bush) show consistently that he aided the Nazis quite deliberately, and little was done against him--to his grandson now holding the highest office and now recommending always understood anti-American methods against TERROR, and then torture.

As time progresses, more and more top military positions wind up being occupied by the strange people. All throughout the history of this country, its eternal enemies on the outside were determined to bring it into wars. As time progressed its enemies on the inside then more and more pushed this agenda. President John F. Kennedy would have none of this, so he was killed. Immediately afterward, President Lyndon B. Johnson allowed the Vietnam war. With time passing and more and more high military positions infiltrated to more purity, each successive war becomes more and more dangerous and destructive to American liberty: constitutional soldiers more purely wind up on the front lines, while those who secretly have a terrible passion against the Constitution are spared. The Iraq War is the most dangerous!

The military was already very amok to even the striking of the Pentagon with a missile (as Donald Rumsfeld mentioned the word) though claiming it was an airplane, but yet with no airplane debris and their constant babbling to hush people up about this evidence. We then allow President Bush to make the situation much worse by calling for war again and then killing more constitutional soldiers to our future TERROR and DESPAIR!!

The Nazis were very confident of defeating the allies but were disappointed. One main reason they were very confident WAS BECAUSE OF THEIR UNKNOWN BUT YET VAST ARMY OF SUPPORTERS THAT WERE ACTUALLY INSIDE OCCUPYING MANY POSITIONS IN THE ALLIED NATIONS. It was always high priority for them to keep this inner army secret to this very day. That's why strange people on forums asked us to discuss and claimed constantly that their highest goal was for free discussion and tolerance, but who then attacked us the moment we even started to talk about the possibility of this internal army.

After 911, and the American people were shown to have lost their senses and made strange people very happy by surrendering their liberties to the only president who failed to protect them so grossly, it was if he had an open-door policy to terrorists, President Bush brought on the agenda for war in Iraq. American law forbids America going to war in order to "free" any country. Something else must be done. Then came the lie about WMDs and Iraqi involvement with 911. Bush attacked the history of America, telling them of the great mistake America did in staying out of war in the 1930s too late till WWII started. He claimed that was a mistake that cost lives. Can other mistakes be made by staging what the Communists and Nazis always supported: pre-emptive war? After the WMDs issue was found to be in error (mistake), and even Rush Limbaugh didn't blush but they all claimed Michael Moore was such an embarrassment, Bush claimed he would have started war with Iraq anyway in order to "save America," or the country that beat Iraq so badly not too long previous in Operation Desert Storm. This shows he already had an aversion to American law. Many draped coffins are the result of finding no WMDs. Bush, who didn't cover up the so-called mistakes of lives being lost America made during WWII, covered up the coffins that showed his errors--errors he doesn't call errors to this day. No sign of changing the idea of pre-emptive war the Communists and Nazis always had since it already showed a key and embarrassing error.

He moved the burden of the war in Iraq at first most exclusively upon the American military. Soon American soldiers were reported to have committed suicide. Very early it was discovered that those soldiers on the front lines were not adequately protected. It didn't take a high IQ to figure that out; but a strange state of mental gridlock engulfed those who have credentials and authority, and who put the soldiers into harm's way. Months and months pass by with this problem with no action taken to solve it. Like clockwork, the terrorists staged remote-controlled road-side bombs and would detonate them as soldiers driving their HumVees passed over them. It was a wild slaughter, and the deliberate official ignoring of this condition made the terrorists VERY HAPPY! Responses to excuses that they were not protected because of economic inability to protect the soldiers were shown to be lies. The time came when a soldier asked Donald Rumsfeld why the soldiers have to dig even in landfills to find parts to use for their HumVees for protection while Halliburton is heavily funded. Rumsfeld tells that soldier that he needs to be satisfied with the military that's there instead of wishing for a better one at another time. With this revelation of his character, he has to patch things up by saying how saddened he is that the American people would think that the government is not doing all it can to make sure the soldiers are protected even though it told them they should be content to dig in landfills for protection. Many other strange people were actually upset with the soldier for daring to ask why they are not protected, and then came with the "conspiracy theory" that he had CONSPIRED with a reporter in order to dare to ask a question that he should not ask. What, this theory was true?

We discussed the issue of the soldiers being unprotected in Iraq on the internet with the other strange people there. They showed clearly that they were happy with the situation. We remarked about Pat Tillman, the football star who gave up fame and fortune to defend the interests of those who like to bellow, "Conspiracy theorists!" in the air day and night. He went right into the Iraq War and wound up being killed by some of his fellow soldiers. The strange people on the internet showed that THEY WERE HAPPY ABOUT THE FACT THAT PAT TILLMAN DIED. One of them even boldly made jokes about his death. We have the actual links showing these super-terrorist's words. These claim to be the definers of hate, remember?

What would happen when enough of the constitutional or, as the strange people view them, "rebel" soldiers are killed off? Well we have a Patriot Act that enables the government to capture anyone and imprison him forever and without charge. It can even murder him in jail. If you have a beautiful daughter, it can take her. History shows that those with the One World view, (including the Communists and Nazis) have always had sexual problems. The government can even make mass detainments. The President, under the Patriot Act, can empower many other officials to detain people. Those people can detain your daughter especially if she is very beautiful. According to the written document the Patriot Act, the government THEN OWNS YOUR DAUGHTER. They never have to tell you what happened to her. They can even kill her and invent any story, or tell you they don't have to invent a story at all! VIRTUALLY EVERY TIME IN HISTORY WHEN THE PRINCIPLES OF THE NOW PATRIOT ACT WERE ENACTED, THERE WERE MASS RAPES AND SODOMY GALORE! IT HAS REPEATEDLY BEEN HOSTED BY THE MOST BRUTAL OF REGIMES, AND WHEREVER THESE PRINCIPLES WERE, INJUSTICE, TORTURE AND BLOODSHED PREVAILED!

The strange people on the internet already told us that we have been under the Patriot Act for some time, and it is evident it hasn't caused us any harm. The reason for that is that there are even many military personnel WHO WOULD NEVER ENFORCE THE PATRIOT ACT LIKE THE WAY THE STRANGE PEOPLE WITH THE ONE WORLD VIEW WANT. It is in the interest of those who concocted the Patriot Act by making the "tough decisions" the Communists and Nazis always made (the principles of the Patriot Act were already always practiced by the Communists and Nazis, and ultimately even earlier in the Inquisitions) to get rid of those military personnel. They therefore beg more and more for us to "Stay the course!" in the illegal war. More and more coffins kept out of our reach. The longer the wars are continued will be the more the military will support Bush merely by what is happening. The more they stay there will be collectively the more tyrannical that body will become. Those who are not tyrannical are dying off!
Now Osama tells us that withdrawing more troops is a victory for Islam, we believe knowing that the more they stay is the more constitutional soldiers die and the stronger Bush and others who support the One World Government get. How is a stronger Bush going to fulfill an Islamic agenda?? It appears that not only are American interests being betrayed, but even suicide bombers and those who fight for the Islamic cause don't see what they are doing. If they were smart and hated Bush, they would kill Bush with a minimum budget and not spend huge sums for training in order to attack the people or buildings. Just the "new" teachings that liberties must be submitted for security guarantees more power to President Bush through terrorism.

The time will then soon come when enough of the constitutional soldiers are destroyed. When that happens something very catastrophic takes place. The Communists always had the One World View. The Nazis always also wanted a New World Order. Now most of our national leaders have long been showing us that a One World Government is their goal. And now, THE SOLDIERS in our military now have the One World view through the elimination of those who DON'T! One group of oddballs are different: the constitutional soldiers who are dying. What then is the result? What is the goal?...

FREE AND UNRESTRICTED USE OF NUCLEAR WEAPONS!

We developed nuclear weapons in the 1930s and 40s. After time and spying, the Communist nations acquired the technology. From that time to this there was something that prevented the world from suffering the effects of these weapons of mass-destruction. It was called: BALANCE OF POWER! As more and more of those constitutional soldiers die out, what's left both in this country and the Communist countries are people purely with this One World view: THE BALANCE OF POWER PRINCIPLE THAT PROTECTED US IS NOW VIRTUALLY WIPED OUT WITHOUT US KNOWING!  Those who have the One World View always believed in DEPOPULATION. To secure that One World Government the way they want, they always believed that the world must be DEPOPULATED. Birds of a feather will flock together. That is why the more our national leaders show they believe and support the One World view, is the more they tell us that the Communists are our friends. Some of these people with this view have quoted that the global population should be reduced by as much as 95%.

Therefore, as more and more positions in society are filled with these strange people, tragic "GIFTS" America never had to suffer from before, will wind up being given to America. 911 terror is just one of those gifts. Tommy Thompson, upon leaving his position under Homeland Security made a very strange statement. He stated that he doesn't know why the terrorists don't poison the American food supply since it was such an easy thing to do. Every American should have raised his eyebrows when Tommy made this statement! It was so easy all this time to poison the American food supply that no terrorist has done it yet, but they need to be reminded by Tommy! The statement of Tommy sets the stage for why this condition will be allowed upon the American population just as 911 was. Another likely gift of being influxed with strange people having the One World Government world view will be the unchanged Communists being allowed access to this country that they never had before. More involvement in war makes the military more and more tyrannical unknown to us.

If we are talking about population, a nuclear weapon can easily be used against a highly populated place. Nuclear weapons cost money to construct. It would not be worthwhile using nuclear weapons on sparsely populated areas. If they ever use nuclear weapons, they will make sure they use it on highly populated areas. In America, the sweetest target will be New York City. In the whole world, the sweetest target will be the Chinese people.

When they get that power to destroy, they will still want to keep the people deceived. If the leaders of Communist China want to depopulate their people, they do not have to use their nuclear weapons against them. They can arrange it so that our nuclear weapons hit them. If our national leaders want New York depopulated, it can be staged as a gift from the communist countries. North Korea has already told us they have WMDs and they were ignored. Ultimately, we believe that those nuclear weapons over there will find their mark at least somewhere.

That is why on the main work, we urge people to avoid highly populated areas and get to understand the benefit of the country life. To do otherwise will cost very dearly. No form of survival preparation would be worth a thing if we remain in highly populated areas. The methods that the powers that be will use to exterminate the residents of America are going to be very horrific, and that would include containing them in highly populated areas where there will be anarchy, crime bloodshed, etc. Many will perish even by slow starvation and other horrible conditions. It is very easy to make a mistake and do the wrong things when encountering the events that are about to come. We urge you to study closely the links dealing with INFILTRATION on the main work.

President Bush now has power not only over the Constitution, but over the American people. The people do not know this yet, and President Bush plays along while the lives of more constitutional American soldiers are being snuffed out in order to deal with all other potential residual opposition. While people call for impeachment of President Bush, members of the Supreme Court and Congress delight, knowing that they support all that he is doing in a secret unified manner. Many of them were placed there through internal treason over the span of other presidential administrations. If we were to get the actual picture of what is actually taking place, we would see President Bush's face virtually on all the Supreme Court seats and most of the seats of Congress, and even the seats of many Democrats who outwardly condemn president Bush. Those who spoke against him young or old are in trouble and do not know this, thinking that this society still supports democracy and thinking that they are protected. That includes Harry Bellafonte and even retired military officials who spoke against him. They are likely going to be humiliated if not killed in the near future.
So we now find out why the Lord will contend with, "the kings of the earth."

It is because...

Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

OH

I understand now.

Now the whole world is changing to something seemingly strange. We are being told that these changes are taking place because of SECURITY concerns. The Constitution is being trashed with pretense that it is not helpful for these concerns. The bible is saying that through these very concerns, what's at the other end is not peace and safety, BUT THE OPPOSITE.

Here is another simple and common scripture that will show us what will happen. We are being told and shown now that global peace must be secured by war. What does the bible say?

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
[Here are the wars we are told are necessary for "peace and freedom." What will be the result? Rumors of wars: we hear about those wars from the comforts of home. That's how we hear the rumors. But then something strange happens in verse 9]:

7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

Then we lose our liberties. No more conveniently hearing about wars on our radios or TVs. This testimony contradicts those who are war-minded, and especially the one who told us that God talks to him. Which one are you going to trust: this scripture? or the President?

Our "forefathers" forbade war?
Really?
When they do that?
Was it before or after they chose to go to war with Great Britain to gain their independence and then again in 1812?





seekerof

[edit on 27-5-2006 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by Seekerof
Our "forefathers" forbade war?
Really?
When they do that?
Was it before or after they choose to go to war with Great Britain to gain their independence and then again in 1812?

I assume that was after judging by the content of the post.

I would like to add, though... When we won against the Brits, the world was not such a developed place that could send missiles at us and blow us into smithereens! We were much more protected by the atlantic ocean than we are now.

You mean why Bush went to war with Iraq without inventing the WMDs lie? He could have done that because America allowed war?

Of course, they had to war for their independence, and they have to war if they are directly attacked or threatened. They forebade war unless directly threatened naturally. They are not going to stand there and get attacked.

Originally posted by niteboy82

Originally posted by Seekerof
Our "forefathers" forbade war?
Really?
When they do that?
Was it before or after they choose to go to war with Great Britain to gain their independence and then again in 1812?

I assume that was after judging by the content of the post.

I would like to add, though... When we won against the Brits, the world was not such a developed place that could send missiles at us and blow us into smithereens! We were much more protected by the atlantic ocean than we are now.

HERE WE GO!! The different circumstances argument that negates and demands change in American law, to the point where Bush pre-emptively attacked Iraq for WMDs and neither he nor his propaganda team blushes EVEN AFTER GIVING THE ANTI-WAR ACTIVISTS HELL, WHEN THEY SAID THERE WAS NO THREAT FROM IRAQ!

Just give Bush a paranoia pill and remind him that we have deadly nuclear weapons that would deter a nation we "bombed into the Stone Age" during Operation Desert Storm from attacking us!

Originally posted by tmac100
You mean why Bush went to war with Iraq without inventing the WMDs lie? He could have done that because America allowed war?

First off, your solely referencing "Bush" is ludicrous.
Secondly, the Bush Administration was given such approval.
Thirdly, this has been hashed and rehashed so many times already within ATS, it is doubly ludicrous to discuss it again.

Of course, they had to war for their independence, and they have to war if they are directly attacked or threatened. They forebade war unless directly threatened naturally. They are not going to stand there and get attacked.

Ironic that the 'forefathers' "forbade" war only after they started two, huh?
I do not recall that in either case, the 'forefathers' or this nation were directly attacked or threatened. Must be a matter of perspective, huh, kind of like it would be in interpreting if the US was "attacked or threatened" prior to and after 9/11?






seekerof

[edit on 27-5-2006 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by tmac100
You mean why Bush went to war with Iraq without inventing the WMDs lie? He could have done that because America allowed war?

First off, your solely referencing "Bush" is ludicrous.

My Response: Why? You left out the reason why. Bush was the one who said we had to make a CHANGE and support Pre-emptive war. He said it was a new day and we had to CHANGE.

Seekerof: Secondly, the Bush Administration was given such approval.

My Response: After already making the case that he doesn't need such approval and then he brought the WMDs lie.

Seekerof: Thirdly, this has been hashed and rehashed so many times already within ATS, it is doubly ludicrous to discuss it again.

My Response: I wasn't here, but it needs to be rehashed so I can contend with it then. The idea that something is rehashed doesn't settle an issue. Let me try to deal with it.

tmac100: Of course, they had to war for their independence, and they have to war if they are directly attacked or threatened. They forebade war unless directly threatened naturally. They are not going to stand there and get attacked.

Seekerof: Ironic that the 'forefathers' "forbade" war only after they started two, huh?

My Response: You mean that they wrote the Declaration of Independence and yet had slaves? It doesn't matter! Bush didn't go right into war. He wanted to do it, and when he can't he brought in the WMDs lie to get into it. After that, THEN he claimed the President must be able to make pre-emptive war and change the standing policy of this country.

Seekerof: I do not recall that in either case, the 'forefathers' or this nation were directly attacked or threatened. Must be a matter of perspective, huh, kind of like it would be in interpreting if the US was "attacked or threatened" prior to and after 9/11?

My Response: Kind of even like when other countries wanted America to help during the days of the forefathers, America refused to help.

Anyone heard the opposition the protest groups are getting for opposing the War in Iraq?

[edit on 28-5-2006 by tmac100]

We must stop just talking and start moving out of populated areas. MORE ASTOUNDING ACTS OF TERROR ARE ABOUT TO TAKE PLACE THAT COULD NOT TAKE PLACE BEFORE.

The WAR ON TERROR is what will allow these events!

i see

Originally posted by fy7726
i see

After viewing the links all I saw were ad's
that what you see ?