It's good! It's good! It's good...to be good

Many suggest that religion and the fear of eternal damnation is one of the main motivating factors behind the desire for most people to obey the ten commandments and lead a good life. It seems that many question the motives behind good deeds as if there is some alterior (sp) motive driving people to carry them out. A perception exists that people are either looking for acclaim, monetary reward, fame or some other kickback in return. Why is this the case? Haven't you ever felt the satisfaction and joy you get after helping someone else? To me this is a much underestimated sensation and most definitely reward in itself. Perhaps it's only me, but it would seem that the feeling you get from helping someone else out would be enough of an incentive to carry out the deed without the need to install fear or provide material rewards to encourage this behaviour.

I agree, it does feel good to help someone out. But does one need religion to do good? People without religion are not immoral or without value's. We are capable of doing good. Bush is religous ... he started a war, with a country that has done nothing to us. Bin Ladin commit's act's of terror, calling it a holy war. Christian's killed innocent women out of superstitous fears claiming they were witch's. Etc... IDK ... it's just odd how those of religion claim that to be good you must be of faith to do good, yet there history teach's that religion is far from good. A war waged in the name of an imaginary being is not good.

People don't need a book or faith in something that just may not be there in order to lead a good life.

This is an excellent point mytym, one that is often overlooked. Nice to see someone start a thread on something positive here for a change. The Bible (a guide on how to be good and what happens when we're not) is a great reference material second only to going to God Himself. For those who use both sources, it's pretty easy to determine that the Book is a hard-copy of what He has said to us before.

I found it interesting that the typical response is that Christians do not have a monopoly on doing good and this is true, however, it's not about what we do that makes the difference. It is about what we believe and who we are. From there good things should flow through to what we do and the desire to do right...which is exactly what mytym is saying. I'd addressed many many of the other points brought up before and have no desire to repeat. Simply, talk to Him and read the Book and there will be none of that sinful nonsense Christians are accused of doing.

[edit on 3-3-2006 by saint4God]

You don't NEED to believe in some imaginary diety in order to be a good person. Why do those of faith have so much trouble understanding this simple concept?

Originally posted by Produkt
You don't NEED to believe in some imaginary diety in order to be a good person. Why do those of faith have so much trouble understanding this simple concept?

I totally agree...which is why I'm glad I don't believe in an imaginary diety. Now to be good in God's eyes, that's an awesome thing...and a very simple concept as well.

saint,

would you say I'm a bad person? Immoral? Evil?

I don't believe in god, but I've lead a decent moral life imo. Does not believing in a god make me a bad person despite leading a devent moral life?

You don't have to believe in God to be a good person. However you also don't have to believe in God, for God to consider you good in His eyes, for this consideration is not dependant on your belief in Him.

I agree with Produkt in that there need not be a god to do good. Also you must remember that doing good lies in the eye of the beholder and in the society we live in, many wars have been fought on the pretext of "doing good" Iraq for example.
There are a few other reasons/theories for why many of us do "good deeds", it may be that its ingrained animal instinct that makes us help those around us as many animal societies show this to be beneficial and we ARE evolved animals dont forget. Also in these societies there is a rebel element as there is in ours. Were not that dissimilar to most higher mammal societies.


G

What was the purpose of this thread then? I haven't seen anyone imlpy that those of faith doing good deed's are doing so out of some alterior motive. And we all agree that you don't need faith to be good by nature ... So I'm at a loss as to what the thread's purpose is. :/

Produckt
There was no point except that a " well to do " christian thought it his christian duty to point out to us Heathens that only through religion can you truly do "good".

Can you show me where it says that? I'm looking, but I just can't seem to find it written anywhere? The only time I even saw the word religion mentioned was in Produkt's post. Am I missing something?

You did start off the post with this....

Many suggest that religion and the fear of eternal damnation is one of the main motivating factors behind the desire for most people to obey the ten commandments and lead a good life.

And the whole reason for my reply was due to me feeling as if you were trying to say that only following god/religion/bible w.e is the only way to be considered good. I still don't even understand the purpose of this thread ...

Produkt:
How right you are, my apology. I looked through the whole thing and missed that completely.

I don't know where you got the message from though. I believed I was actually saying that you don't need religion to create the incentive to do good things. As for the point of the thread: Nothing more than to express my view and see if others shared it.

My last post was actually intended to address Shihulud
's outreageous conclusion jumping abilities. I will need to find out how he/she obtained the gift of reading my mind and knowing moreso than myself, what my motivation was to start this thread.

ONE FACT :

There is NO Good and NO Evil.
Good and Evil are archaic concepts in this world. What is there however is right and wrong, that are completely different from Good and Evil .

It is important not to confuse what is right to what is Good and vice versa.

IAF101
If it is a fact as you claim, can you prove there is no good and no evil?

Why is it important not to confuse right and wrong with Good and evil?

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist"- The Usual Suspects

Originally posted by point
IAF101
If it is a fact as you claim, can you prove there is no good and no evil?

This I can but it would be easier if you read this :
www.diesel-ebooks.com...
You need this to read that link:
download.microsoft.com...
Once you are done with that you will understand exactly what I mean.

Why is it important not to confuse right and wrong with Good and evil?

Because they are fundamentaly different things. What is good is not always right and what is evil is not always wrong. Today both these concepts have become so interwoven that it is difficult to seperate any one from the other. This has confused people into interpreting things that are right as to also be Good and vice versa.

Originally posted by IAF101

Originally posted by point
IAF101
If it is a fact as you claim, can you prove there is no good and no evil?

This I can but it would be easier if you read this :

I hesitate to download items like this to my computer. Do you have a way of looking at these sites without the download?

I also am interested in the distinction you make between "right/good" and "wrong/evil". It is true, however, that I know when something is "wrong", but don't automatically characterize it as evil.

right/wrong, good/evil are subjective perception's. You can't prove/disprove to any particular party undergoing a certain problem or experience weather that problem or experience is right/wrong or good/evil. Those people in Al Queda feel they're doing the right/good deed of the god they follow, we feel they're doing the wrong/evil thing as terrorist's. If killing someone is wrong/evil, then what of out of self defense, self preservation? If you kill out of those circumstance's, your still killing, your still commiting an act viewed as wrong/evil. There are no excuse's.

Originally posted by mytym
My last post was actually intended to address Shihulud
's outreageous conclusion jumping abilities. I will need to find out how he/she obtained the gift of reading my mind and knowing moreso than myself, what my motivation was to start this thread.

I myself thought that the point of this thread was inferring that you had to be religious to trully do good. My apologies if this is not the case.
On the point of right/wrong/good/evil I also have to agree with Produkt again in that they are subjective. Views on ethics and morality change through time and location.



G

In my opinion,
The popular propaganda that there is no good or evil only serves those who gravitate toward evil and it only disadvantages those that aspire toward good.

If a thief can convince you that there is no such thing as theft then in your mind he is not a thief. He can now go right ahead and rob your house in front of you. I bet he's under no illusions about what he is.
You may even want to give him a wave (while sporting an idiotic smile on your face) as he casually leaves your house with your belongings.
Wake up and smell the B.S.