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Raytheon confirms AESA package for Singapore F-15SGs

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posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 07:25 AM
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AA 2006: Raytheon confirms AESA package for Singapore F-15SGs; Raytheon has confirmed that the APG-63(V)3 active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar is on order by the Singapore Ministry of Defence (MINDEF), spurring the momentum of an increasingly competitive product.

From wikipedia; An Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA), also known as active phased array radar is a revolutionary type of radar whose transmitter and receiver functions are composed of numerous small transmit/receive (T/R) modules that each scan a small fixed area, negating the need for a moving antenna. AESA radars feature short to instantaneous (millisecond) scanning rates and have a desirable low probability of intercept.

I'm assuming that Washington will still go ahead (or has it already?) with the sale of F-16s to Pakistan, but the question now is, in light of the possible sale of Super Hornets, with AESA capability, to India, what block F-16s will the Pakistani's be getting?




posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 07:57 AM
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Right now it looks like the only F-16s they'll be getting in Pakistan are from Belgium and Holland, which means A/B models. There is a 70+ airframe order with the US, no word on block number that I can find yet, but it was put on hold after the earthquake in that area.



posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 08:10 AM
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The original Pakistani F-16s are Block 15s, upgraded to Block 15OCUs, and the new orders are for 50/52s.

Block 50/52:

Advanced versions of the Block 50/52 F-16s are difficult to tell from previous F-16s, as most changes are internal. However, the two-seat models of the Advanced Block 50/52 and Block 60 are equipped with a dorsal avionics compartment that accommodates all of the systems of the single-seat model as well as some special mission equipment and additional chaff/flare dispensers. Most aircraft are procured wit Conformal Fuel Tanks (CFT) for extended range and mission endurance. The rear cockpit can be configured for either a weapon system operator or an instructor pilot and can be converted with a single switch in the cockpit.

Advanced Engines
Advanced Block 50/52 aircraft have a common engine bay that allows customers a choice of engines in the 29,000-pound thrust class. The Block 50s and are powered by the General Electric F110-GE-129 and have the Modular Common Inlet Duct (known as the large mouth inlet). Block 60 aircraft (for the UAE) are fitted with GE F-110-GE-132 engine, a derivative of the F-110-GE-129 that is rated at 32,500 pounds of thrust. The Block 52s are powered by the Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229 Improved performance Engine (IPE) which also has 29,000 pounds of thrust. The engine is configured with the Normal Shock Inlet (also known as the small mouth inlet). The aircraft is also equipped with an on-board oxygen-generating system replaces the liquid oxygen system of earlier versions to provide breathable air to the pilot. The system improves mission rate, maintainability, deployment flexibility and safety.

www.defense-update.com...

Block 15OCU:

The Block 15 OCU (Operational Capability Upgrade) refers to F-16A/Bs powered by the more reliable F100-PW-220 turbofan. These aircraft also had structural strengthening and were provided with the enlarged HUD that was first introduced on the F-16C/D. The OCU included updates for radar and software, and upgrades for the fire control and stores management computers. A data transfer unit was added, and a radar-barometric altimeter was provided. Provision was made for the carrying of AN/ALQ-131 jamming pods. There was a provision for the installation of a ring laser inertial navigation system. F-16A/Bs manufactured since 1988 were built to OCU standards (starting with Block 15Y), with earlier Block 15 aircraft later being brought up to OCU status. The OCU program makes these F-16A/Bs comparable in many respects to F-16C/D models. Block 15 OCU F-16A/Bs were delivered as add-ons for Belgium (44), Denmark (12), the Netherlands (51), and Norway (2). Also included were planes delivered in the late 1980s and early 1990s to Indonesia (12), Pakistan (11), Portugal (20), Singapore (8) and Thailand (18).

www.patricksaviation.com...



posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 03:07 PM
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Lanton,

So, besides being 300lbs lighter, what is better about the APG-63V(3) than the APG-63V(2)?

I seem to recall that the process went:

APG-63
Separate D/A converter and hardwired or at least 'depot only' firmware signal processor.
APG-63V
Digital Signal Processor integrates D/A conversion. More Memory. Beginnings of NCTR.
APG-70
More Memory, Faster MCOPS/FLOPS processor, SAR and NCTR now realized.
APG-63V(1)
A cheap way to bring up initial APG-63 models to 70 standards without having to pay for DMS limited stocks of older 'supertech'. Presumably because they use COTS civillian chips. The baseline of late MSIP?
APG-63V(2)
A one time purchase made so that 'our friends', the UAEians, could have their very own block model in the F-16E. With APG-80. Based on APG-77 technology, it supposedly offers no operational volume/mode expansions (which seems ludicrous) but is at least able to scan those same volumes very, very, quickly. The penalty being 'brick not button' technology levels which are so heavy and cooling system intensive that not all jets can take the new antenna. And those which do have to be ballasted out with 300-400lbs.
APG-63V(3)
'The Real Money Maker', by which the V(2) is effectively made a real rather than a toy sensor with more modes than any of our jets have or will have, before the JSF. In fact uses APG-81 (button) technology and is ten years sooner out of the blocks which means it will be useful before it's outdated.

Am I missing something or is there a whisper of 'Golden Eagles' somewhere in Janes' subscriber section (whoring the tech to buy it ourselves)? And what about Korea? Are they going to start breathing and getting all purple around the gills on their F-15K's or simply order a followon batch?

Also like to know exactly what kind of a 'look' into our processing architecture and object/source code variables this kind of sale gives the Chinese and Russians. Both of whom are much 'closer' to these nations than we are.

Are we so close to conformal arrays and MP-RTIP that it doesn't matter? Or are export laws now basically written by for and in the name of today's profit Uber Alles?


KPl.



posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by ch1466
Lanton,

So, besides being 300lbs lighter, what is better about the APG-63V(3) than the APG-63V(2)?

I seem to recall that the process went:

APG-63
Separate D/A converter and hardwired or at least 'depot only' firmware signal processor.
APG-63V
Digital Signal Processor integrates D/A conversion. More Memory. Beginnings of NCTR.
APG-70
More Memory, Faster MCOPS/FLOPS processor, SAR and NCTR now realized.
APG-63V(1)
A cheap way to bring up initial APG-63 models to 70 standards without having to pay for DMS limited stocks of older 'supertech'. Presumably because they use COTS civillian chips. The baseline of late MSIP?
APG-63V(2)
A one time purchase made so that 'our friends', the UAEians, could have their very own block model in the F-16E. With APG-80. Based on APG-77 technology, it supposedly offers no operational volume/mode expansions (which seems ludicrous) but is at least able to scan those same volumes very, very, quickly. The penalty being 'brick not button' technology levels which are so heavy and cooling system intensive that not all jets can take the new antenna. And those which do have to be ballasted out with 300-400lbs.
APG-63V(3)
'The Real Money Maker', by which the V(2) is effectively made a real rather than a toy sensor with more modes than any of our jets have or will have, before the JSF. In fact uses APG-81 (button) technology and is ten years sooner out of the blocks which means it will be useful before it's outdated.

Am I missing something or is there a whisper of 'Golden Eagles' somewhere in Janes' subscriber section (whoring the tech to buy it ourselves)? And what about Korea? Are they going to start breathing and getting all purple around the gills on their F-15K's or simply order a followon batch?

Also like to know exactly what kind of a 'look' into our processing architecture and object/source code variables this kind of sale gives the Chinese and Russians. Both of whom are much 'closer' to these nations than we are.

Are we so close to conformal arrays and MP-RTIP that it doesn't matter? Or are export laws now basically written by for and in the name of today's profit Uber Alles?


KPl.

I don't recall talking about whether or not the APG-63V(3) was better than the APG-63V(2), in terms of their individual costs and capabilities. I just thought it was a newsworthy item, and wanted to share it with the rest of the forum; that as well as the Singaporeans ordering F-15SGs with AESA capability, the Indians were being offered Super Hornets with similar capabilities.

I then pondered over what block F-16s the Pakistani's were being offered by the Americans...would they also have AESA capabilities?; Zaphod58 answered that question when he said that "The original Pakistani F-16s are Block 15s, upgraded to Block 15OCUs, and the new orders are for 50/52s." I'm assuming that that means that the Pakistani F-16s will not have similar capabilities to their Indian counterparts (if, indeed, the Indians do purchase those Super Hornets with AESA capability).


You make a valid point; that the block 60 F-16s, bought by the UAEs, came with the APG-80 AESA radar...but we're not talking about UAE here, are we. My question was about PAKISTAN; and which block F-16s they'd be getting.

Btw, it wasn't the Janes subscriber section; rather it was the non-subscriber section (free to everyone on the net).



posted on Feb, 25 2006 @ 09:34 AM
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This thing has already ben posted, can the mods close the topic...



posted on Feb, 25 2006 @ 11:02 AM
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The PAF will not AESA Radars IMO.
The IAF already technologically/numerically overwhelms the PAF.
but these F-16s will make any air war VERY interesting.
IMHO a true test of tech melded with pure skill.
PAF will still be at a disadvantage but they're one of the most skilled AFs in the world.



posted on Feb, 26 2006 @ 07:13 AM
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Originally posted by Daedalus3
The PAF will not AESA Radars IMO.

How so?



posted on Feb, 26 2006 @ 10:02 AM
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Well either I've heard it somewhere or its plain intuition..
Why don't you google for it?
Pak defence fora will be a good source of info..



posted on Feb, 26 2006 @ 11:22 AM
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Originally posted by Lanton
I'm assuming that Washington will still go ahead (or has it already?) with the sale of F-16s to Pakistan,

When the deal was just about to take off - it got stalled because of the earthquake in Pakistan.


Pakistan's President Pervez Musharraf says he will postpone the purchase of F-16 fighter planes from the US.
He said Pakistan needed to focus on reconstruction in the wake of the quake that killed more than 70,000 people.

Pakistan had been expected to buy more than 50 planes at up to $40m each. Quake reconstruction is put at $5bn.


"I am going to postpone that... we want to bring maximum relief and reconstruction efforts," he said. Pakistan has long sought the jets but the US only approved the sale in March after years of sanctions concerning Islamabad's nuclear programme.

news.bbc.co.uk...

This does not by any means that the F-16 deal is off. Infact just before the quake the pakis took delivery of 2 F-16's >> here's the link >> www.af.mil...

The Pakis will be getting a mix of block 50 and block 52's. Hoever the US has refused to sell any AAMRAMS to the pakeez.

On March 25th, 2005, the US Government announced that it had agreed to Pakistan's request to sell new F-16s. Pakistan has requested an additional 24 new Block 50/52 F-16C/Ds (with option for as much as 55 aircraft).

www.f-16.net...

The existing pakee block 15 F-16's are getting MLU'd.


but the question now is, in light of the possible sale of Super Hornets, with AESA capability, to India, what block F-16s will the Pakistani's be getting?


block 50 and block 52's. no AAMRAMS, and no AESA radars.

BTW : The US is offering an exclusive block 70 F-16 with AESA (& AAMRAMS) to India and not to the TSPAF.

To know about the custom block 70 F-16 offered to India go here >> www.abovetopsecret.com...&singlepost=1868109



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