Layout before prototype collection

Hups. Double post.

[edit on 11-2-2006 by matej]

Originally posted by matej
Ok Emile, lets start from the beginnig. The main error is that you assume, that there is some kind of order or algorytmus. But the designation were selected (because security reasons) almost randomly.
Second - project of what later become MiG-25 is known as E-155 (or Ye-155 in engish). There is no connection between E-155 and E-152 (as Waynos wrote). Here is the list of all subversions.

So there still is a mystere being if no connection between Ye-152 and Ye-155, then for logical inference, I have to say the MiG-25 is imitation of A-5 vigilanter frevisionally

Originally posted by matej
Continue...
Emile - I have a lot of british VG projects, but I think that you mean this:

I know you always give some surprising pics to me.

Now please allowing me move fast, let's talking about a layout before F-101 Voodoo. Combined Voodoo and Demon become Phantom II I am quite sure about this.
There is a layout is four engines before Voodoo, maybe there is layout before Voodoo with fitting engine more than four. I really want to know that shape of this kind of fighter would be.

Originally posted by matej

Emile - I have a lot of british VG projects, but I think that you mean this:



external image
link to full sized image www.hitechweb2.szm.sk...

Please bear in mind that the above model is NOT the genuine design for the Panavia 100. The MRCA (Tornado) was largely based on the UKVG which was designed by BAC after France withdrew from the AFVG which preceded it, this UKVG design was very much like the Tornado that was actually built, the model in the photos was a deliberately vague representation which was used to publicise the prject at airshows like Farnborough as the actual design itself was top secret. That is why the model makes no attempt to show the air intake geometry and is only very loosely representative of the actual design, as our American friends often say of certain projects, 'it was a decoy'

For the real Panavia 100, which was for Germany only, just picture a standard Tornado with the rear cockpit filled in.

[edit on 11-2-2006 by waynos]

(mod edit to reduce large image within quoted post)

[edit on 17-2-2006 by pantha]

And you are talking about this:

Yes, thats the one Basically a single seat UKVG.

One thing that changed is that the original inboard wing pivot was changed to an outboard one with a glove fairing (like most other swing wing designs) to avoid pitch up when the wing swung aft. This feature was the only one taken from the MBB design that they took into the project. This also featured a staggered, trainer like, two seat cockpit arrangement and an unusual mid wing rather than shoulder wing layout. See below.

Originally posted by emile
Now please allowing me move fast, let's talking about a layout before F-101 Voodoo. Combined Voodoo and Demon become Phantom II I am quite sure about this.
There is a layout is four engines before Voodoo, maybe there is layout before Voodoo with fitting engine more than four. I really want to know that shape of this kind of fighter would be.

Now it has been comulated two type
Today's fighter is Grumman F11F-1 Tiger. I has been considering this fighter is a fighter of standard shape at transonic period. But also no layout of it has been showed in public.
As I know that two main fighter serviced in US navy at the same period, one is F-11 Tiger other is F-8 Crusader, who know why? which is better?

[edit on 14-2-2006 by emile]

Not sure what you are saying emile but it seems as if you think the 'F-11F-1 is a secret version of the Tiger, is that right?

The designation F11F-1 however simply equates to 'F-11A' under the tri service designations allocated in 1962. Though I don't know if F-11A was ever allocated.

The way it worked was simply that the second 'F' denoted 'Grumman and the '-1' meant 'first version' translating as ; Fighter, 11th type, Grumman, first version' = F11F-1

Similarly all vought aircraft were designated with a U and the F-8A crusader was originally called the F8U-1

Other 'manufacturers letters' with the USN which were discardede in 1962 include J for North American (A-5 Vigilante was originally A3J-1) and D for Douglas (A-4E Skyhawk would have originally been called the A4D-5)

Therefore the F11F-1 was just a standard Grumman Tiger.

I knew the F11F-1 Tiger's original design is F9F-9 which is a aft number of F9F-8, Grumman give a company designation to G-98, but no matter G-98 or F9F-9 that I have never seen before I thought that totally different from F9F-8 which Grumman give a designation as G-99. So much confusion isn't it?
home.att.net...

Yes emile, it can be quite confusing. Here's the relevant OBA entries for those years.

first the 1955 edition and the prototype 'F9F-9' Tiger (G-98)



then comes the 1957 edition with the F9F-8 Cougar (G-99) coming after the F9F-8 designation for the Tiger had been changed to that shown above.



Finally there is the 1959 edition showing the redesignated F11F-1 Tiger.



I chose this as the final entry for the Tiger to appear in the OBA, it is not the first one where the F-11F-1 designation is used, that was the 1956 edition. However this allows you to see the changes between the prototype and the service version, don't forget though that that prototype was ALSO redesignated F11F-1 so these design changes are not covered by the designation change

[edit on 15-2-2006 by waynos]

Initially, I thought I have known American aircraft enough, but it seems something I don't know much more than I have known
I lost so many series number about fighter as list below
P-1 -- 11
P-13 -- 25
P-27 -- 34
P-37
P-41 / 42
P-44 -- 46
P-48 -- 50
P-52 -- 54
P-57 -- 60
P-62
P-64 -- 69
P-71 -- 74
P-76 -- 79

Everytime I type some of them intto Google to search, but resault I got are totally not relative with aircraft.

and Bomber as list below

B-1 -- 8
B-11 -- 14
B-16
B-20 -- 23
B-27 -- 31
B-33
B-37 -- 41
B-44
B-51
B-53 -- 56
B-59 -- 65
B-67 -- 69

Who would like to teach me?

Here you are emile, enjoy

www.driko.org...

Originally posted by emile
Yes, no transition is why I strongly suspect the Foxbat was just imitate from Vigilanter

Its a bit of a stretch dont you think?

www.military.cz...
www.military.cz...
www.military.cz...

The Mig-25 was aerodynamically unique, it had to be to have a chance of catching up with the XB-70 or SR-71, and had many innovations that enabled stability and control at high speeds.

If you want to talk about our innovation you are better off point at these.

www.military.cz...
www.combatindex.com...

[edit on 18-2-2006 by orca71]

Originally posted by waynos
Here you are emile, enjoy

www.driko.org...

The web you given here as same as some webs I couldn't open in China, then I use service agncy to open it, but only show once before I change to another page, it is blocked again, then never open :bnghd:

Oh, sorry emile. I never thought censorship would be a problem. Makes you wonder how ATS gets through?

If it helps I have heard that googling with a slight mis-spelling can get around the Chinese censoring.

I see nothing offensive about China or anything "very democratic" in that site. Wonder why the commies are blocking that ...myabe 'cause they'r "commies".

With threads about stuff like "'Chairman' Mao's sex life" i wonder how ATS is not censored

[edit on 18-2-2006 by Stealth Spy]

Maybe because its not censorship but the site might not be working for china?

And if ATS can get though maybe the censors aren't as a effective as the western media protrays it as

Today, I think we all think F-111 Aardvark is a porpular combat aircraft that most aviation fans know well, but I wondered who know the layouts before prototype of F-111. The previous number of F-111 is F-110 which developed from phantomII are different from F-111.

The F-110 wasn't a development of the F-4 Phantom, it was just the USAF designation for those F-4's which it bought. In 1962 the new tri service designation system was introduced and 'F-110' was dropped and all Phantoms were just F-4's.

If you want to take the roots of the F-111 right back to the very beginning look into the Vickers 583 VG strike fighter project from 1958. This was also meant to produce a strike aircraft for the RAF and a carrier based interceptor for the RN just like the original TFX (from which F-111 was born) was supposed to do for the USA. This has almost no physical commonality with the F-111 but was the source of much tech transfer from Vickers to NASA who later assisted on the F-111 and thus it can be said to be directly relevant.