Bush and his Divine right

Hey... my first post here claimed I am no expert on the subject, merely sharing some opinions. I give you for just being open to the discussion rather than just ranting and raving as many do.

I still stand by my beliefs but I am smart enough to realize when I am beaten!

I shall retreat to the darkness until I find a link!

Originally posted by deltaboy
Clinton and Carter said the same thing about such powers in the name of security.

So why now over Bush when nobody talked much about Clinton or Carter who committed the same such action about eavesdropping or other methods to gather intel without warrants. This is not something new here you know.

So you choose to slant the issue because no one talked about Jimmy Carter on the internet in the late 1970;s? Ridiculous. WHo here had access to the internet in the late 1970's? Hell, I wasn't even born!

Yeah, Bush does put himself above the law, but look at who he works in tandum with: Dick Cheney. Wiretaps? More like a convenient way to listen in on KBR/Halliburton's competitors if you ask me. They already have a $7 billion contract to put out fires in Iraq.
Dick: "Halliburton's profits are down too much, it's about time we did something about that. You know what we outa do Bush, start a war with Iraq."
George: "Say, that sounds like a good idea, lemme call my dad...Hey, dad, it is George W. I am going to go to war with Iraq."
Father: "Oh, that is fantastic son, let me tell Uncle Ron."
George: "So who wants to help me out in finding an excuse to going to war with Iraq."
Beuro: "I know Mr.President...uh, Weapons of Mass Destruction?"

Dick: "Halliburton's still losing out critical deals, we outa listen in on to what their competitors are doing."
George: "Right on man, pass that doob...but how are we going to do this?"
Beuro: "I know Mr. President...uh, wiretaps to listen in on terror cells?"

[edit on 11-1-2006 by Frosty]

Originally posted by FlyersFan
So what? Lots of people believe their lives have purpose ... that
God has directed their lives in some way ... in their jobs, in their
marriages, in their decisions. Believing that there is a religious
purpose to your position in life is not a crime and it could in fact
be true.

It’s not a crime, but I’m not comfortable with a nation’s leader mentioning he’s guided by Christian values in his decisions. He is a team lead, so to speak. He leads a huge national team were the players are from all walks of life. I don’t walk into a team meeting and say “hey guys we’re going to move forward on the new network infrastructure and I know we will be successful because I have Christian values on my side” My Christian values might indeed come into play in getting the project off the ground and into successful completion (from what I bring to the project table), but the atheist team member, the Muslim and the Buddhist were also involved in making things happen. Religion is a personal thing and should be left to the individual. Leave religion OUT of politics!

Ok – we haven’t seen a link on this and that’s cool (kind of) – We can still talk about it  I’ve heard of him saying such things in the past, but I’ve never seen a direct quote. I would love to see a direct quote.

Originally posted by Frosty
Wiretaps? More like a convenient way to listen in on
KBR/Halliburton's competitors if you ask me.

The wire taps were only on suspicious phone calls to
terrorist nations. If any US company is making
numerous phone calls to Syria and discussing 'key'
words in those phone calls like 'assassination' or
'dirty bomb', then obviously they are not conducting
legitimate business and they deserve to be listened in on.

Originally posted by knowseek
I’m not comfortable with a nation’s leader mentioning
he’s guided by Christian values in his decisions.

Why? It's your right not to want this, but why? You are
offended by Christian values guiding decisions?

Thou shalt not lie. Thou shalt not commit adultry
Thou shalt not steal. Honor your father and mother.
Blessed are the merciful .... Blessed are the peacemakers ...
Love your neighbor as yourself.

All these are things that I hope a leader of this country allows himself/
herself to be guided by. But don't worry. 2008 will bring
us another Clinton in the White House and we all know how
very little the Clintons let Christian values guide them. No
worry about them telling the truth, staying faithful to each
other so as not to put themselves in a position of blackmail,
no need to worry about them leaving the White House
silverware behind when Hillary is finished with her term in
office. Lies, stealing, adultery ... it'll all be back in 2008.

(actually lies never left. We are dealing with politicians afterall!!)

Religion is a personal thing and should be left
to the individual. Leave religion OUT of politics!

Sure. A person in a position of power shouldn't preach at
people. But to say that a person isn't allowed to put their
'best self forward' just because you don't like that their
'best' came from their religious beliefs ... that simply can't happen.

People are guided by their religious beliefs. That's just the way
it is. That's not interjecting religion into politics.

If someone got up and preached that God demands this, or
Jesus demands that, or I am the chosen one of God ... THAT
is interjecting religion into politics. NOT when someone is
guided by their religion.



[edit on 1/12/2006 by FlyersFan]

Originally posted by FlyersFan
Why? It's your right not to want this, but why? You are
offended by Christian values guiding decisions?

I’m not really offended because it conveniently matches my values (or on paper it matches my values – I’m not a Bush fan in the least) I do however view it to be troublesome in the name of democracy. I found this site which mentioned bush stating he has been instructed by god (view link for actual quote of the journalist – still not a valid quote from the man himself).

www.bbc.co.uk...

If he indeed feels this way in public or private, it is MY speculation that he’s capable of extremism or at the very least a decision based on his understanding of faith. This is not cool imo. His every move as president should be guided by the hand (arm) of law, science and open thought. No decision should be made for a free and diverse nation based on faith. IMO, a leader who would make such a claim is disregarding any non-Christian’s take on the matter and that’s not cool. I think most would agree that catching a phone conversation between terrorist is an important endeavor and there certainly should be a means to do so – including impromptu wiretaps. Nonetheless, it should be done in a lawful manner and no one is above the law. He should follow the laws and not play a religion card (not confirmed he actually did this) when the laws don’t fit his agenda. I haven’t much to offer on Clinton and Carter; I’m living in the now and for the future. I will say this – a lie about a hummer in the janitor’s closet is still a lie, but an agenda to invade a country based on falsehoods is down right dubious.
Give us a scientist as our next president!!!

"I trust God speaks through me. Without that, I couldn't do my job." —to a group of Amish he met with privately, July 9, 2004

politicalhumor.about.com...

That is the only similar quote I could find, although I did not look very hard.