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No winner in Space Elevator competition

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posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 08:05 AM
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Well since it's the first one it's not surprising. The first AI Driven car competition didn't have a winner.

www.wired.com...

Here was this years contest in a nutshell




On the beam-power side, the challenge at the games was to use a 10,000-watt light source to send a robot 50 meters up the ribbon in under 50 seconds.

For the tether competition, the goal was to construct a 2-gram tether that would be tougher than a 3-gram band made from a high-strength material called Zylon. The best-performing robot and tether, had they beaten those figures, would have earned their owners $50,000 each.


There was one bright spot though in that a tether made from Spectra almost took home the 50 grand prize. I cannot wait for next years competition which should feature Carbon Nanotube ribbons.

[edit on 25-10-2005 by sardion2000]




posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 01:21 PM
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"I have not failed. I have only found [2] ways that don't work."

Seemed apropos. Nothing like a little competition to get the gears goin' on this sort of thing. It's interesting to note how much gets done when simply trying to win, not necessarily trying to win anything.



posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 02:03 PM
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This was a little dissapointing, but there were a lot of positives which came out of the competition aswell. Also the prize money will double next year to 100 grand!

Heres another few links:

www.space.com...

www.newscientistspace.com...



posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 02:09 PM
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Originally posted by sardion2000I cannot wait for next years competition which should feature Carbon Nanotube ribbons.

[edit on 25-10-2005 by sardion2000]


Really? You think by next year people will be able to mass produce 50 meters of carbon nanotubes? This seems highly unlikely.



posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 02:13 PM
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Eh you didn't hear of the breakthrough I take it? They can spin a 3 cm wide ribbon at 7 meters per minute.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


www.worldchanging.com...
A team of researcher from the University of Texas, Dallas, and Australia's CSIRO has come up with a way to make strong, stable macroscale sheets and ribbons of multiwall nanotubes at a rate of seven meters per minute.


In other words that particular barrier has now been smashed through(and much faster then I anticipated)

As for the mass production some companies are producing over a hundred tons a year.

[edit on 25-10-2005 by sardion2000]



posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 02:34 PM
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I think the space elevator may be here before a lot of people think. The tech liftport needs is being developed before their predicted dates of development.
It's amazing how fast progress is moving ahead. It's basically something different achieved every month.



posted on Oct, 25 2005 @ 02:39 PM
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Anyone keeping an eye on this technology should be amazed just how fast it is developing. Between 1986 (When Engines of Creation was published) and 1996(when IBM Spelt it's logo in Xenon atoms with an AFM) progress was agonizingly slow. 1996-2006 is looking like an exponential trend like in IT.



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 12:26 AM
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What exactly is the other end of this ribbon or rope going to be fastened to? The Moon?



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 01:07 AM
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Originally posted by Frosty
What exactly is the other end of this ribbon or rope going to be fastened to? The Moon?

I really hope your kiding.

It will be a counterweight.

and these are the results that I expected from the competition...they had like six months...so what would you expect. Next year will be far better...hopefully in resmblence to DAPRA's Grand Challenge...in which the first year the vehicles didn't go far...but give them another year and double the prize and several finished the race.


I was pretty impressed with the laser powering system...which lifted a lifter up 40 feet!, by use of no battery, just the powered its collectors gathered from the laser below.



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 04:52 AM
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Originally posted by Frosty
What exactly is the other end of this ribbon or rope going to be fastened to?


The Space Tether will be sent up as a large spool of CNT Ribbon attached to a modular counterweight, when it's at the intended destination it will start unreeling a tether 50,000 km long down to the earth most likely somewhere in the Pacific near the equater. When it gets to the ground it's tied down to a base station which will have ports and a laser capable of lifting the lifter to the necessary orbit. There are other methods being explored but beam craft seem like the most likely at this moment. Once the Tether is under tension it should be able to support another spool of CNT ribbon with another modular counterweight that will attach itself it the one already up there and so on and so forth. Estimated cost of around 10 billion.

That is of course a very simplistic explanation so here is a couple of links for more information.

www.spaceelevator.com...

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 05:22 AM
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BTW Arthur C Clark has revised his prediction of "50 years after everyone stops laughing" to "25 years"

www.timesonline.co.uk...



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 05:42 AM
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Elevator 2010 Competition Roadmap

www.elevator2010.org...



# 2005 is designed as a 'stepping stone' competition, allowing teams to build only a subset of the 2006 system. We are limiting the scope of the competition to the climber only, and so Spaceward is providing the beam source, in the form of a 10 kWatt white Xenon searchlight. The beam is vertical, and tracking issues are resolved by having auxiliary centering tethers keeping the climber on the beam axis. Since all teams use the same light source, there's no need to limit the climber weight - instead of maximizing the power they can pump through a fixed mass climber, the teams will make a fixed-power climber as light as possible. By examining competition hardware, we'll be able to know if our 25 kg figure for 2006 needs refining.

# 2006 is the first full-formula competition. Teams provide a wall-to-wall solution, including beam tracking and climber attitude control. This in turn allows them to use multiple beams, increasing power densities and improving control of power levels. We believe teams will stay with white light, but if a team can put together a monochromatic light source by 2006, more power (!) to them.

# In 2007, we double the minimum speed limit, requiring higher power densities. We expect at least some teams to move to monochromatic light by then. The climb length is increased by 4, increasing the climb time by 2.

# Moving forward, we'll continue to increase the speed and length of the climb. We'll move to an aerial tether platform, and at some point, to a CNT based ribbon. The eventual elevator has to work at approx 50 m/s, so by 2010 we're planning to show a 33% power dense system.



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 01:49 PM
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Originally posted by sardion2000
BTW Arthur C Clark has revised his prediction of "50 years after everyone stops laughing" to "25 years"

www.timesonline.co.uk...


I have read Clarke's Promis of Space, it needs revision. Though he had high expectations, Clarke's only flaw in his predictions was the inability to find a reason why moonbases would be necessary. He also did not give much consideration into advancements in electronics, the microprocessor and robotics in general. He thought robotic exploration was a henderance and sort of a waste.

To the space elevator, what exactly do people intend for the tether to attach to? A base station is very generic, a moon is more specific
. Would this be a space station such as ISS?



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 02:04 PM
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Originally posted by Frosty
Would this be a space station such as ISS?


From what I gather as we are constructing the first stage by launching up a spool of CNT Tether with a companion
"Modular Counterweight segment" satellite attached to it(there is a minimum mass the satellite has to be I
forget right now but I'm sure it's well within our capabilities to launch now) we will be preparing additional spools
with their component "Counterweight Segment" that will be "Beamed" up(
) as soon as the Tether is strong enough.
The basic idea is we can build up a sufficient counter-weight to haul massive loads by just doing it in a slow
and steady baby-step by baby-step.

Liftport groups FAQ asserts ....

www.liftport.com...



The purpose of the counterweight is to make the center of mass of the elevator be at geosynchronous orbit (36,000 km). The whole elevator weighs so little that we don't need a huge amount of mass out beyond GEO to balance it. In fact, the mass of the equipment used to construct the elevator will be sufficient.


That is if you are not amoung the believers that they are just patent squatters(as some on here
have alledged with no real proof)

As for the idea that the Counterweight could serve as a Space Station. Interesting idea. I shall do some
research into this idea. A refueling and jumping off point for "Made in Space" Spacecraft. Of course far off still
but it's getting closer...

[edit on 26-10-2005 by sardion2000]

[edit on 26-10-2005 by sardion2000]

[edit on 26-10-2005 by sardion2000]

[edit on 26-10-2005 by sardion2000]



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 03:51 PM
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yes, there are a few concepts out there that put have a space station at a the zero G portion of the elevator...in other words the middle of the cable.

As for the counterweight...nothing is set in stone yet. They would use a large rocket and launch up the counter weight...which will be as big as the rocket will allow. The counterweight will be reletively small, just enough to make the cable tight, between it and the earth. They plan on thickening the cable once in place...cause this will be a huge money saver, versus using rockets for the whole thing. The will have lifters that make the cable bigger, and they will build dozens, if not hundreds of them, and it will be a one way trip, they will put just enough on it to make the full 62,000 mile long trip, and once to the top it will just get left there, that way its 2 birds with one stone kind of approach. Meaning that not only will each lifter make the cable stronger, but building up the counterweights weight in the process.



posted on Oct, 26 2005 @ 06:18 PM
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Indeed. I heard on one of the liftport newsletters that the first lifter to travel up the ribbon will stay at the top and become the counterweight which will be gradually built upon.
This is a much more efficient approach rather than toeing an asteroid to become the counterweight in orbit.

Here's an interesting illustration of what the counterweight may eventually look like:



Also; an interesting article about the space elevator:

www.spectrum.ieee.org...


[edit on 26-10-2005 by rufi0o]



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 08:31 AM
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Originally posted by sardion2000
The Space Tether will be sent up as a large spool of CNT Ribbon attached to a modular counterweight, when it's at the intended destination it will start unreeling a tether 50,000 km long down to the earth most likely somewhere in the Pacific near the equater. When it gets to the ground it's tied down to a base station which will have ports and a laser capable of lifting the lifter to the necessary orbit.

Not bloody likely, since the earth's rotational axis shifts - hence the seasons - it can NOT be tied down to the ground nor will it always be near the equator, instead it will vary between + and - 23.5 degrees latitude.

www.bbc.co.uk...

[edit on 27-10-2005 by Simon666]



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 08:35 AM
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Make the "barge" mobile then. How fast would the drift be? Why cannot we just use corrective burns in strategic places to keep it stationary? I'm just speculating here so don't shoot me :p



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 09:15 AM
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Originally posted by sardion2000
Make the "barge" mobile then. How fast would the drift be?

Somewhat slower than walking speed is my estimate.



Originally posted by sardion2000
Why cannot we just use corrective burns in strategic places to keep it stationary?

You mean keep it above the equator at all times? Well, say you either fix it or apply "corrective burns" then you apply tremendous sideway forces and oscillate your thether enormously at the summer and winter equinox (and already start oscillating in an unhealthy fashion long before that).



posted on Oct, 27 2005 @ 09:43 AM
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Originally posted by Simon666
Somewhat slower than walking speed is my estimate.


That's it? Floating barge or skyhook it is then.



You mean keep it above the equator at all times? Well, say you either fix it or apply "corrective burns" then you apply tremendous sideway forces and oscillate your thether enormously at the summer and winter equinox (and already start oscillating in an unhealthy fashion long before that).


There may be ways to counteract the oscillations, but considering the drift is rather slow moot point on my part.

Thank you for the input


[edit on 27-10-2005 by sardion2000]



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