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Originally posted by Seekerof
What exactly are you calling "hogwash"?
Your contesting and calling historical documents used and readily found to substantiate the links I have given you as "hogwash"?
Are you a proponent of historical revisionism or simply advocating it?
Obviously I have hit a nerve, and one which gives you the tics, for it has left you devoid of counter yet full of hysterical defensless posturing. So just for that I repeat to be sure that you understand my abject contempt for yours and others disregard for human life;
Originally posted by PyrosWhat a completely uninformed, dim-witted, sarcastic, and absurd statement! Some of you folks should really proof-read what you are posting beford you hit that magic "Post Reply" button.........
I have annoyed you, haven't I? Most excellent! It pleases me to see how the backs of the ignorant are easily riled when I point out just how jingoistic and backward they are. I trust you are also a God-faring Christian who readily preaches turn the other cheek too, except of course when it is your cheek that needs to be turned.
Thoughts like these are probably the product of cursory 21st century high school history classes that spend a total of two weeks reviewing important events of the 1930's and 1940's. Go back to class.
Then I would be like you and subject myself to one-sided mythology, wouldn't I?
Read up about the American isolationist position, and how we were dragged, kicking and screaming into WWII because of European fascism and Japanese imperialism.
As above, but I add this: Japan was a sovereign nation, and whatever laws it enforced on its populace had nothing to do with you! Because I know you will miss the profundity contained within that statement, just look around you on this forum alone and you will find some of your fellow Americans are not at all pleased with either the leaders or the direction of your country, does that mean then that some country should bomb the bejeezus out of San Diego harbour? Why given your bent rationale it certainly does.
Read up on the death grip that the Japanese military had on the Japanese society, and how the practice of bushido prevailed throughout the military.
And those interned in North America were jovial and celebrating life? Or is it that your history books purposely omitted that?
Did you know that the Japanese POWs returned from Russia after the war in 1905 became social outcasts, and were driven to suicide and madness?....
I would have preferred that you did not change the rules of warfare, then wail shamelessly thereafter that the Geneva convention is being usurped. And I would have preferred that such despicable annihilation and wanton disregard for human life was addressed in a different manner, as was necessitated during the Cuban missile crisis. But of course you were not in complete control at that point in time were you? Playng safe is after all a different story all together when said bomb would be raining down on your cities.
you would have preferred us to land a million men in an amphibious assault on the Japanese island of Honshu and defeat their combined military and civilain forces in a protracted land battle?
Yes I do! I am quite comfortable taking that stance than that of those apologists who look for every subjective extrapolation of what could have happened otherwise.
You had And you believe that would have spared the Japanese the horrors and destruction of 2 atomic bomb attacks? Geez...nice trade off. Personally, I always preferred the version where we win the war that we didn't start, and we don't have to suffer half a million casualties to force our enemy to capitulate.
Originally posted by masterpNautical blockade! you know, where ships block the major ports of a country!!!
You obviously have no knowledge of war tactics. Waiting can be as painful as invading.
But there was no need to invade the Japan mainland! it was just an excuse made up for dropping the bombs! Japan was already destroyed from the fire bombing!
You and other posters here are stuck with the idea of invasion being the only solution. I was not talking about invasion, but using air and naval forces to take out the rest of military installations and other important targets.
But the 2nd bomb just 'happened' to be a plutonium one that killed 120,000 people. Can you say "experiment"???
I don't think 3 days were enough. They barely have the time to realize what's happened. Give them a weekly warning, then blow a deserted island to smithereens.
Really, and that is supposed to be an aqeduate response how? I asked you a question! I want to know if you would have been so amenable to these bombs dropping on your country, if you were unlucky enough to be born in Nagasaki. Where is your response?
Originally posted by SeekerofSave the terrorism rhetoric for those anti-nuke and anti-war rally's.
Apparently to you, Nanking was not an act of terrorism?
Banzai attacks and kamikaze attacks were not an act of terrorism?
The damn list can go on for your mis-mentioned use of terrorism when applying it to the dropping of the atomic bombs.
Save what? You obviously have your thoughts confused with my clarity dear boy. You did not drop to their level, no. You dropped to depths far below theirs, a depth that is yet to be matched.
Save the "we" did not have to drop to their same level, cause in war, real war, the goal is to win and to win decisively and with the least amount of life taken in a timely fashion, thus negating further loss of life. To continue to spout that terrorism 'this and that' is ludicrous. War is simply one act of terrorism after another, committed by all sides involved, period.
Am I the only person annoyed at the anti bomb stance at the 60th anniversary of Hiroshima day?
Reading the articles in the media you are left with the feeling that the nasty American forces killed all those innocent Japanese out of spite, or to test their weapon, or scare the russians.
The actual historical antecedents around the event are lost in the outpouring of "oh poor people look what you suffered" articles.
Originally posted by masterp
The drop of atomic bombs opened a new era of atomic warfare. If Hiroshima hadn't happened and all countries agreed to "no atomic weapons", then there would be no nuclear threat for US today.
Because killing 200,000 in 10 minutes is a very 'bad' thing to do?
War has its rules though.
So you should have just killed the emperor, then.
Originally posted by makeitso
These are not indicitve of and do not reflect the reality of the war that was forced on the US and the rest of the world. I do not recall the US going out of its way to start or join that world war. In fact quite the opposite. But once pressed into it......
Originally posted by howmuchisthedoggy
I disagree totally. The U.S. was no more forced into WWII than it was forced into it's current "War on Terror". It saw an opportunity for carpet-bagging, profiteering and expanding it's already growing sphere of influence. Despite what John Wayne told you, there never was any noble reasons to join this war.
Originally posted by howmuchisthedoggyThe Pro A-Bomb people on this thread would have you believe that history begins with the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbour. Of course this is glossing over many years of colonial adventures and U.S. Marine Corp. invasions of countries in the area. Pearl Harbour was a measured response to a long period of provocations.
The sooner the U.S. stops crying over it and 9/11 the sooner they can see to what ends the blood of their sons and daughters is being spilled. The soldiers who fought in WWII in the Pacific arena were no better than thugs or hoodlums working for the mob. The sad thing is they went for purely alutristic reasons. They were good and honorable people but their strength was misdirected towards evil goals. Evil goals which included the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
It gives me chills to read in this thread how the taking of hundreds of thousands of lives are so coldly dismissed as an almost "charitable" act towards the Japanese. Be they military or not, the "Japs" as they are so lovingly referred to in this thread, were still fleh and blood people.
When the Japanese grieve their dead in Hiroshima it is sickingly hypocritical to hear people accuse them of forgeting why they "deserved" it. Not so long ago we had to put up with much wailing and gnashing of teeth over 9/11. A lot of people in the world would agree the U.S. more than deserved that, yet we gave you space to grieve your dead, without asking any awkward questions, like "Why"?
But that's different isn't it? The residents of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were viscious little "Japs" that didn't appreciate the "Freedom" that the U.S. was gifting them.
Sounds a little to close for comfort to current events.
Originally posted by Pyros
This post contains so much unmitigated horse manure I barely know where to begin
nor am I sure that I will be able to adequately address all of the glaring errors and misconceptions it contains......
I will only take issue on the last sentance of this last piece of drivel. Tell that to the French, Danish,blah, blah blah........liberating their countries...blah...Nazis....blah....Nanking...blah....6 million jews...blah blah
Although the attack on Pearl harbor provided us with the impetus to enter the war, to imply that the US had morality in this cause is just plain stupid. Stupid
Please provide us with some fine examples of your enlightened view of world history that illustrates this claim.
Show me where US Marines invaded Japanese territory
or any foreign soil in the Pacific during the 1920's and 1930's.
And BTW, what the heck is "Pro A-Bomb people" supposed to mean? It is a historical fact that cannot be argued with.
What wonderful praise and insult in the same breath.
So nice of you to have feelings for the Japanese people who suffered and were killed. How about the other 60 million people all around the globe who died during the war? Or, are their deaths OK because they weren't bombed with nuclear weapons by the US?
Bombing the Japanese was never an act of charity. However, it was an act of cold determination made with the utmost deliberation with the objective of stopping the war and reducing the amount of friendly deaths and casualties.
The Allies won WWII because, fortunatly for us, opinions like your, for the most part, did not exist.
Your comparison of 911 and Hiroshima/Nagasaki is off base.
A better comparison would be 911 and Pearl Harbor.
So, what in your mind is "deserving" punishment or retribution for nations who invade their neighbors, mass-murder their citizens, and aneex their sovereign territory? What is an appropriate way to deal with a country that starts an inter-continental war, inflicting millions of casualties amonst their vicitms?
Are we supposed to just gently push them away and tell them to be good? Are we supposed to just forget about the dead and the maimed? And the oppressed and imprisoned?
Man, the crazy things people say!