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camden boys

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posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 05:57 AM
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It's a terrible thing to lose kids,but what went wrong.The kids playing in the back yard on a summer day,only to come up missing.Parents and friends searching everywhere for their loved ones.Days later the father finds them dead in the trunk of their own car parked in the back yard.

Sounds like a terrible accident.I dont believe it,why you ask,i'll tell you why.

1.when you look for a missing child you search the area completely

2.you call the police right away,not 4 hours later.

3.the parents new the trunk was open before they came up missing.

4.the kids where found with powderd concrete all over them.

5.the trunk was not air tight.

6.you don't go out the day of finding your kids dead to collect money on the streets of camden.

7.you don't point the finger at the police for not looking in the trunk(they should have looked there anyway).

8.the search started 30 feet from the car they where found in.Why were they not heard.

I 'm not saying they killed the boys but to be so dumb as to not check the car is a BIG problem with me. time will tell.




posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 06:22 AM
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Originally posted by timoothy

Sounds like a terrible accident.I dont believe it,why you ask,i'll tell you why.

1.when you look for a missing child you search the area completely


Which is what happened.


2.you call the police right away,not 4 hours later.


Kids frequently move from place to place when they're playing outside. It's not unreasonable for the parent to assume they would have gone to perhaps another child's house, or simply to a new play area. It's unreasonable to expect alarm bells to sound immediately, simply because three kids moved from where you last saw them. One child? perhaps. But three? We'd probably assume they were all together, playing safely elsewhere.




3.the parents new the trunk was open before they came up missing.


It was an older-model maroon Toyota Camry which didn't have a mechanism that allowed the trunk lid to stay open independently when raised...if it closed, it would have locked at that point, with no way to open it from the inside - I'm not sure why this is suggestive of foul play.




4.the kids where found with powderd concrete all over them.


From various news sources: A bag of cement was on one side of the trunk and had broken open, spilling the substance onto the children.




5.the trunk was not air tight.



Aside from us not knowing this for sure, it wouldn't have to be air-tight - three bodies panicking and fighting for the same air which isn't being replaced rapidly enough will still suffocate; you don't need "airtight" to encounter suffocation.



6.you don't go out the day of finding your kids dead to collect money on the streets of camden.


Source?



7.you don't point the finger at the police for not looking in the trunk(they should have looked there anyway).


Think about it. You're feeling enough guilt about your child dying...it's a natural response to try and find blame elsewhere.



8.the search started 30 feet from the car they where found in.Why were they not heard.


Perhaps they were already unconscious. Or even dead - time of death hasn't been established (in actuality the autopsy reports imply that TOD was impossible to narrow down in this case).

I'm not seeing any evidence that foul play was a part of this.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 06:33 AM
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timoothy, source please


Thanks



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 06:40 AM
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source = every dam news channel


Once again i'm not saying that the parents killed them poor boys,but common sence goes a long way.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 06:51 AM
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And every news channel isn't sharing the same information, obviously


So....reading your initial post...again, how did you arrive at the conclusion that something was amiss?



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 07:00 AM
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Originally posted by Tinkleflower
And every news channel isn't sharing the same information, obviously


So....reading your initial post...again, how did you arrive at the conclusion that something was amiss?


That's what I should have said.

Tinkleflower, good points BTW

What news source did you YOU (timoothy) use?

I don't have cable, so it's kind of hard for me to get "source = every dam news channel"


I just heard about the Camden Boys on this thread..
But after googling up the camden boys and reading some stuff....
I don't know what to think now...doesnt seem to be foul play..IMO






[edit on 26/6/2005 by SportyMB]

[edit on 26/6/2005 by SportyMB]



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 07:27 AM
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I live in NJ so every channel has the story . But when i seen footage of them collecting money on the streets of camden it tore my heart out.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 07:30 AM
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I can understand that.....

But you're still not telling how you got to the conclusion that it was foul play.

Help us out here



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 07:38 AM
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call it common sence .If your child was missing would you not search in the area they were last seen.Three kids in a trunk would make a lot of noise,and when the father of one of the boys opened the trunk he ran away from the vehicle ,he didnt even try to hold his own son ,let alone take him out of the trunk.I don't know how i would act in that situation .god bless those kids.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 07:44 AM
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ok for those of us who are not getting this story can you please provide a link...
remember members are from all over the worrld so we dont all get the same news.

And as a standered you should provide a link to your story,

Thank you ,

Asala



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 08:22 AM
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sorry about that

www.comcast.net.../2005/06/25/164596.html



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 08:26 AM
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it was not raining at the time of searching right after the dissapearance.

The children were last seen around 5 p.m. Wednesday playing in the side yard of Cruz's home. Daniel Agosto lived nearby, while Jesstin Pagan lived farther away.

Elba Cruz, Anibal's mother, said she left the three children playing in the yard for five to 10 minutes while she cooked dinner. When she returned, they were gone

www.cnn.com...



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 08:36 AM
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Elba Cruz, Anibal's mother, said she left the three children playing in the yard for five to 10 minutes while she cooked dinner. When she returned, they were gone

Yeah that does seem kind of weird. I don't think 10 minutes is enough time to suffocate in the trunk of a car...especially for small children.
And surely someone may have heard the kids kicking and screaming.

I guess we'll have to stand by and see what developes over the next few days. Maybe evidence of foul play will be found...as of know, I think it's just an unfortunate accident. Man, that has to be hard on the parents



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 08:52 AM
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I've been following this one since the little cuties came up missing. And from the start I've had a hard time with the amount of time the mother is saying she was away. I still have trouble believing it was only a few minutes.

And now that they have found the boys
I have a harder time accepting her account of the time the boys were left unsupervised. We're not talking about a rural area where an out-of-commission car could be sitting a great distance from the house. We're talking about a very urban area where it couldn't have been more than a few dozen yards. There's no way these boys would have crawled in that trunk, realized they were locked in, and not screamed and kicked to beat the band. They would have had to have been in there for hours without anyone looking for them. Because the minute you went outside and started calling their names you would have HAD to have heard them.

Something is way not right.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 08:54 AM
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Alright...am I missing something here?


The mother noticed the boys were no longer in the last known spot....am I missing where this says she called police immediately?

She's surely only testifying that she noticed they were gone - not that she'd actually done anything at that point.

Three boys, playing outside, the last time you saw them.

You return 10 minutes later - they've gone somewhere else.

You assume they've simply gone to play elsewhere; is there a need to panic at this point?



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 09:10 AM
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sure there is ,this is camden nj the worst of the worst. Plus one of the boys was handicapped,(mentally).Never leave boys that young unattended especially in camden.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by Tinkleflower

Three boys, playing outside, the last time you saw them.

You return 10 minutes later - they've gone somewhere else.

You assume they've simply gone to play elsewhere; is there a need to panic at this point?



Yeah - you apparently have not had a 5 or 6 year old yet. Yes, there's every reason to start calling for them and searching for them.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 09:28 AM
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Erm...actually, you'd be wrong there, Val. But I did admittedly forget the ages of the boys involved.

Having said that...yes, ok. Perhaps the mother was faulty there in not doing anything sooner.

But I'm still not seeing how that equates to foul play?



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 10:23 AM
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I'm not equating anything to foul play tinker. That's why I hadn't started any discussion on this prior to the boys being found. I didn't want some one misunderstanding my concerns. I'm not for a minute stating that i think the mother killed the boys. I'm stating I think she's lying about how long she left them unattended. And I do think she's lying.



posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 10:42 AM
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Although Camden is the Murder and Crack capital of New Jersey, this neighborhood is in a relatively safe part of town, its a big town.

Police dogs did not trace the children to the vehicle, instead it traced them to the edge of a river.
Useless animals..and they get bullet proof vests.

The children could have passed out from heat exhaustion within 10 minutes of 110+ degrees and little oxygen. Its hot here this week, my attic is 110 degrees...that is when the thermometer can actually read the temperature and doesn't just say H for HELL I guess. Inside a car, with absolutely no ventilation and three 98 degree panicing bodies inside..it was probably even worse.

Yes the police searched the car but not the trunk. Odd since you can't get
pulled over for a buested tail light without the Nazi NJ Police looking in your trunk.
Maybe the heat was getting to their head.

The mothers claim of "ten minutes" is a general statement, I'm sure she didn't watch
the clock exactly, it could have been nine, it could have been twenty.

Since the lid of the Toyota trunk closed on its own, its very possible one or more of the kids
took a hit to the head from the trunk, and then from a body falling after the hit...
which would of course end any chance of them calling for help.

Why did Dad jump back on finding his kids? Well three days in a sweltering trunk probably
turned his children into something moving towards jelly. Yes dead bodies in intense humid heat
tend to get gooie, a neighbor of mine in New Orleans was found after a week in his apartment
and they had to scoop him up with shovels because he had liquified in the humidity. If its not a case of extreme putrification, imagine cooking meat for three days....the smell, the condition of the flesh!
If I saw someone hug a corpse after that I'd say they were really wacked!

This is a tragedy for the families involved.
None of us will ever know what really happened, even the coroner couldn't determine time of death ,tells you something of the state of the bodies.

Let the little ones rest in peace.



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